Operating a Business in International Waters

[DennisM]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

It would be a hit: cruise liners would visit.

I'd like to request the tee shirt and souvenir concession.

[bobconnie]

Old Idea, been done a few times I know of ! Once by a friend of mine with an aluminum 60 ft Cat, with BIG fuel tanks ! He did pretty well for a couple of years. He finaly got a bad health problem, and had to return to Louisiana, and soon passed away, leaveing his partner, and his children with a boat and no way to use it ! Always seemed to be a working idea to me ! but never had tanks large enough to do much but just fill em up in Columbia, or else where with cheap diesel, and then be able to cruise a little cheaper for a while !! Big difference in US prices for diesel, and fuel in some other countrys ! And with the normal winds you can do a round about under sail. I would think if ya had enough tankage you might do well ! But how you would let folks know where and what ya have for sale might be the biggest problem !! Just my 2 cents

[Brian T]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

On the Atlantic ridge, the route between the Cape Verde's and Barbados? Much like a space station in the likes of Deep Space 9 or Babylon 5

It would be a hit: cruise liners would visit.

Yeah you get it! Did anybody see the movie water world? Think floating atoll... Maybe I'll rewatch that, to potentially get some logistaical tips from them

[denverd0n]

So it sounds like, basically, you want to offer the dock space, and whoever comes along will offer their own products/services to others. Is that about it?

I still see the big problem being the rig itself. It is going to have to be a solid, stable dock. Out in international waters, it is going to be completely exposed, and is going to have to remain stable in serious winds and waves. Something like that is going to be very, very expensive to put together.

You mention the floating atoll in Water World. Think about what it would really cost to put together something like that today.

[Brian T]

Originally Posted by denverd0n

International water is 12 miles offshore in most places. At least 3 miles offshore everywhere that I know of. You can't just take your average work barge out there, drop an anchor, and have it work very well. The only thing equivalent in use today would be oil rigs, and those are hundreds of millions of dollars each.

I'm thinking that, between the cost of the rig itself, the on-going costs to bring your inventory out, and the cost to provide security, you're not going to be able to compete with land-based operations.

Well we're not talking about your AVERAGE barge here I'm thinking that it would be set up like the committee/marker boats in sailboat races these days... They have revolving props that are tied into a GPS and keep the boat in one place no matter the wind or current. I'm thinking that it would have a solar panel roof that powers this GPS positioning system... and obviously we would be doing all of this with OPM (other people's money), I will go on a marketing tour and raise some venture capital... most of the supplies will be donated because we'll let the manufacturers all hang their pretty banners off the barge!

And I would not be bringing the inventory out, each vendor brings their inventory/tools/capability out for themselves. This is simply a place for them to set up shop.

[BlackOak]

An Atoll, like in Waterworld? That one didnt fair well, as I remember. I like the idea though. Used to be a place up on Pickwick, dude sold burgers and stuff off his pontoon boat out in the lake. did a pretty good business. Problem with this idea, eventually a "government" will step in and shut ya down for no permit.

The concept is attractive. ie....floating cathouse, hash bar, casino......

[Brian T]

Originally Posted by BlackOak

An Atoll, like in Waterworld? That one didnt fair well, as I remember. I like the idea though. Used to be a place up on Pickwick, dude sold burgers and stuff off his pontoon boat out in the lake. did a pretty good business. Problem with this idea, eventually a "government" will step in and shut ya down for no permit.

The concept is attractive. ie....floating cathouse, hash bar, casino......

Well luckily we have all of their mistakes to learn from

And yeah, every conversation that ended in "yeah good idea, but not profitable with the proper permits/ins/ect, and not worth risking the punishment if caught" is what started the idea for this thread.

[daddle]

It been tried. Sometimes famously. The governments of countries from which you must import stuff conspire against you. Survival is unlikely if you have any success at all.

[skipmac]

Originally Posted by Brian T

And yeah, every conversation that ended in "yeah good idea, but not profitable with the proper permits/ins/ect, and not worth risking the punishment if caught" is what started the idea for this thread.

The problem is that most of these good ideas that require permits are only viable in physical proximity to the market.

Say you are a diesel mechanic or refrigeration technician or canvas maker or dive master; any kind of skill that might be useful to cruisers or tourists. BUT the local government don't need no stinkin gringos taking jobs from the locals so you can't get a work permit.

Setting up an offshore haven will eliminate the permit problems but where's your customer base? Sitting on the beach back in the place where you can't get the permits.

The greatest product or service in the world is worth nothing if you can't get it to the buyers. Location, location, location.

Sure there are skills and jobs that don't require physical proximity to the customer: computer programming, trading in all manner of commodities like stocks, currency, futures, etc., but these can usually be carried out anywhere since one would not be technically working in the economy where you are located but online. So no need for a haven to do this kind of job.

So far from all I can think of, you have an idea for a solution that doesn't quite fit the problem you are trying to solve.

[BlackOak]

ANAKLIA Sea Hotel - floating underwater leisure center - YouTube

nice concept!

[Sailmonkey]

It's already a concept that's moved to creating other forms of government. I still haven't figured out how they plan on powering or maintaining their "countries".

http://www.seasteading.org/

[skipmac]

Originally Posted by DennisM

Well said. But to paraphrase H. L. Mencken, nobody ever went broke overestimating the unsavoriness of cruising sailors.

Probably a lot of truth (present company excepted of course ) but I don't think I want to be the one catering to the unsavoriness. Being an aspiring boat bum I'm already considered the black sheep in my family. No need to go and confirm it.

[Brian T]

Originally Posted by skipmac

The problem is that most of these good ideas that require permits are only viable in physical proximity to the market.

Say you are a diesel mechanic or refrigeration technician or canvas maker or dive master; any kind of skill that might be useful to cruisers or tourists. BUT the local government don't need no stinkin gringos taking jobs from the locals so you can't get a work permit.

Setting up an offshore haven will eliminate the permit problems but where's your customer base? Sitting on the beach back in the place where you can't get the permits.

The greatest product or service in the world is worth nothing if you can't get it to the buyers. Location, location, location.

Sure there are skills and jobs that don't require physical proximity to the customer: computer programming, trading in all manner of commodities like stocks, currency, futures, etc., but these can usually be carried out anywhere since one would not be technically working in the economy where you are located but online. So no need for a haven to do this kind of job.

So far from all I can think of, you have an idea for a solution that doesn't quite fit the problem you are trying to solve.

Apparently everything that I know in life comes from movies, cause I'm thinking of the movie Field of Dreams as an answer to that one... "If you build it, they will come"

But you are right, certain skills will need proximity to certain people or land features... but many of the others just need the customers. And if the customers are (or could be) people on boats, then the creation and presence of a good deal will bring the customers in.

Think of how many people go here for certain repairs, or stock up on this and that at certain places simply because it is known that it is the best deal that they will encounter. Many boaters delay certain repairs or purchases until they are going to be in a place wherer they KNOW they will get it for the best price. This will be like that, but for everything that we offer

[DennisM]

Originally Posted by skipmac

Being an aspiring boat bum I'm already considered the black sheep in my family. No need to go and confirm it.

Please inform your family that anyone who owns a Pearson 422 is not a bum by any definition. If they don't believe you, keelhaul them.

[boatsail]

Originally Posted by DennisM

That is certainly a solution, Boatsail. But I wonder how much you'd have to increase the price of a gallon of diesel to cover the cost of a private naval force.

less than the current price of taxes im sure;-)

The reality is that fees like this are already included in everything we do back in our homeland. Someone has to pay for it. The consumer.