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Old 21-11-2012, 11:07   #76
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Re: Maltreatment By Homeland Security

Sailboats have been used, to smuggle people, drugs and weapons so boarding in remote areas protects us all, I have been stopped and boarded by marine patrol ,wildlife, sheriffs , coast guard, and even secret service mostly at nite twice at anchor, but always treated with firm resolve and respect. Australia found a sailboat, aground with a million dollars of coke , and a dead body onboard just THIS week. Happy thanksgiving to our friends to the south. Ole
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Old 21-11-2012, 11:35   #77
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Re: Maltreatment By Homeland Security

If the boat is not clearly marked, unlike how CG boats typically are, I like the idea of broadcasting a PAN PAN of your position with a physical description of the unidentified boat on 16 so that it gets recorded, before they come onboard. This way things are more likely to be on the up and up. Sorry if they are legitimate and their cover is blown but private citizens also have the right to protect themselves from illigitimate or abusive boardings. Any unmarked illigitimate boat can feign being legitimate.

At night if they are shining a bright light at you then you have the same moral right to shine a bright light back at them as a means of identifying the hull markings of their vessel. I say moral right because it is illegal to shine a bright light at another vessel potentially causing the operator to be blinded.
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Old 21-11-2012, 11:36   #78
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Re: Maltreatment By Homeland Security

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Originally Posted by David_Old_Jersey View Post
Why not put out a Securité / All ships warning on the VHF......

"Unidentified persons are attempting to force a boarding - please avoid my position as risk of gunfire".

"Am engaging".
LOVE IT!!! Will let you know how that works out...

At least the USCG dont hide who they are, (Unless they are buying Rumrunners at the Tikideck while still in uniform late at night)
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Old 21-11-2012, 11:42   #79
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Re: Maltreatment By Homeland Security

Quote:
Originally Posted by olepedersen View Post
Sailboats have been used, to smuggle people, drugs and weapons so boarding in remote areas protects us all, I have been stopped and boarded by marine patrol ,wildlife, sheriffs , coast guard, and even secret service mostly at nite twice at anchor, but always treated with firm resolve and respect. Australia found a sailboat, aground with a million dollars of coke , and a dead body onboard just THIS week. Happy thanksgiving to our friends to the south. Ole

Nobody should object to a boarding based upon "reasonable cause" by any government agency investigating potential threats to the US or crimes in commission. However, the random and unnecessary boardings to cruising vessels that have increased recently are the result of a government run amok and another step towards loss of our liberties and freedom. As our country continues its decline into an amorphous amoebic mass of stupidity, the abridgement of our rights is the obvious consequence. From the offensive searches at our airports to the boardings of recreational vessels from known and unknown agencies, the march continues. On a lighter note to Ole: Takket vaere fra en bror Viking. Happy Thanksgiving.
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Old 21-11-2012, 12:29   #80
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Re: Maltreatment By Homeland Security

Several posters have discussed reaching for the radio and issuing a Pan Pan etc.

Apparently, this sort of boarding procedure by the US government hasn't happened to them yet. These Homeland Security boats come up on you very quickly with little to no warning with a guy behind a machine gun on the bow wearing a black storm trooper helmet and bullet proof vest. The boats are black and don't show up on radar; this also happened to a friend who saw the boat & had his radar turned on... although in his case it happened in UK waters.

Grabbing for anything in this situation... even a radio, would be insane.
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Old 21-11-2012, 12:29   #81
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Re: Maltreatment By Homeland Security

No Political Posts Please
Although there have been some good comment on this thread, let's keep the political opinions out of it if we want to keep it open. Some posts have been removed.
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Old 21-11-2012, 12:36   #82
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Re: Maltreatment By Homeland Security

So shouting "fire in the hole!" is out of the question, I would think.

All joking aside, the situation would be quite unsettling, to me at least.

James L
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Old 21-11-2012, 12:37   #83
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Re: Maltreatment By Homeland Security

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Originally Posted by Kenomac View Post
Several posters have discussed reaching for the radio and issuing a Pan Pan etc.

Apparently, this sort of boarding procedure by the US government hasn't happened to them yet. These Homeland Security boats come up on you very quickly with little to no warning with a guy behind a machine gun on the bow wearing a black storm trooper helmet and bullet proof vest. The boats are black and don't show up on radar; this also happened to a friend who saw the boat & had his radar turned on... although in his case it happened in UK waters.

Grabbing for anything in this situation... even a radio, would be insane.
I agree 100%. A "show of hands" is very appropriate in this situation.
" Young guns" with itchy trigger fingers may tense up before he see's only a mic in your hand.
Like it or not, be safe.
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Old 21-11-2012, 12:55   #84
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Re: Maltreatment By Homeland Security

How about pushing the DSC button on the VHF?
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Old 21-11-2012, 13:24   #85
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Re: Maltreatment By Homeland Security

How about staying as far as possible from the US waters ports and airports. Anyway I'm going next Feb to Caribean and the flight via Miami was 400€ cheaper what I bought.. but a cheap price to avoid TSA and such..
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Old 21-11-2012, 13:40   #86
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Re: Maltreatment By Homeland Security

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How about staying as far as possible from the US waters ports and airports. Anyway I'm going next Feb to Caribean and the flight via Miami was 400€ cheaper what I bought.. but a cheap price to avoid TSA and such..

That is more and more becoming our choice. I like ordering stuff from Defender and all, but I have no real reason to visit the U.S. with our boat and be subject to whatever quasi-legal mania is in vogue that month.

Besides, one of those visits would really disturb the tranquillity of our evening "Cuban rum and Cohiba" hour.*

*legal for decades for Canadians on Canadians' boats.
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Old 21-11-2012, 15:55   #87
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Re: Maltreatment By Homeland Security

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Originally Posted by GordMay View Post
The border search exception is a doctrine of United States criminal law that allows searches and seizures at international borders and their functional equivalent without a warrant or probable cause; as otherwise required under the Fourth Amendment.
http://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/homesec/RL31826.pdf

Nice, but it says;

"border searches allow customs officials"

and;

Courts have determined that border searches usually fall into two categories—routine and nonroutine—
though this analysis may no longer apply to searches of vehicles or personal property.
Generally, the distinction between “routine” and “non-routine” turns on the level of intrusiveness.
Routine border searches are reasonable simply by virtue of the fact that they occur at the border
and consist of only a limited intrusion, while non-routine searches generally require “reasonable
suspicion” and vary in technique and intrusiveness."

So we are back to only Coast Guard and Customs. They should have said who they were. But that is obvious.

Maybe they just had to fill another "training" box on thier papers for the day?
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Old 21-11-2012, 16:40   #88
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Re: Maltreatment By Homeland Security

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Originally Posted by forsailbyowner View Post
He told me he would contact an official from another office of homeland security and I could expect a call from them in the near future.

mmmm . . . 6 pages . . . . do we know what agency actually did the boarding yet?
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Old 21-11-2012, 17:54   #89
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Re: Maltreatment By Homeland Security

Besides, one of those visits would really disturb the tranquillity of our evening "Cuban rum and Cohiba" hour.*

I really like the idea of Cuban Rum and Choiba hour. Perhaps a nice strong dark rum with a nice Choiba. If it is really good rum, straight is good. Not so good rum, mix it down with a little lime & cola, or make a mojito. Damn I am getting the winter blues bad, time to make way for the tropics.
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Old 21-11-2012, 20:36   #90
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Re: Maltreatment By Homeland Security

I was once on a boat off of Key West in the 1980's when we were approached by an unlit boat which followed us off of our port quarter. It was visible on radar and despite no moon we could sea its bow wave because of the bioluminecence. We made repeated calls for them to identify themselves on 16 and called the USCG on 16 but got no answer. Finnaly in exasperation the captain called to the unidentified vessel and told them to identify themselves or he would open fire. About 1 second later we were hit with a very bright spot light and a loudspeaker announcing "This is the US Coast Guard prepare to be boarded. We were actually glad it ended up being the coast guard as the area was frequented by a lot of drug smugglers in those days. This tactic certainly worked well for the Coast Guard as they are military trained and have very good fire discipline. I'm not sure the same can be said for other agencies that might have been following us that night.
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