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Old 14-09-2015, 11:48   #16
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Re: List of insurers that don't require a survey

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Originally Posted by estarzinger View Post
BoatUS actually just changed, like a month ago, to not require a survey for most boats.

Beth led the analysis to convince them to make the change. Turned out that "insurance surveys" we're not adding much value . . . . Quite Different than "pre-purchase surveys".

good to know, is that for liability only? If not, how do they establish the value for a hull insurance?

Dirk
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Old 14-09-2015, 12:02   #17
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Re: List of insurers that don't require a survey

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Originally Posted by estarzinger View Post
BoatUS actually just changed, like a month ago, to not require a survey for most boats.

Beth led the analysis to convince them to make the change. Turned out that "insurance surveys" we're not adding much value . . . . Quite Different than "pre-purchase surveys".

Is this for newly under written insurance policies or existing policies? Boat US paid a surveyor to look at one of our boats prior to renewal. If it was a typical experience then Beth is right. Boat US wasted their money (and some of mine).
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Old 14-09-2015, 12:22   #18
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Re: List of insurers that don't require a survey

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Originally Posted by estarzinger View Post
...Beth led the analysis to convince them to make the change. Turned out that "insurance surveys" we're not adding much value . . . . Quite Different than "pre-purchase surveys".
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Is this for newly under written insurance policies or existing policies? Boat US paid a surveyor to look at one of our boats prior to renewal. If it was a typical experience then Beth is right. Boat US wasted their money (and some of mine).
This would be a welcome change. I've never understood how insurance companies get away with this practice of demanding that the boat owner pay for an insurance survey prior to getting a quote, or getting a renewal. Seems to me this is a cost of the their business. If the insurance company wants this kind of (fairly useless) information, then they should pay for it.
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Old 14-09-2015, 12:29   #19
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Re: List of insurers that don't require a survey

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good to know, is that for liability only? If not, how do they establish the value for a hull insurance?

Dirk

The insurance we picked up from Boat US was for hull insurance. All they wanted to know was purchase price. I was surprised they didn't want a survey as it is a custom cold molded epoxy build, though only 5 years old. We had a structural survey done by a boat builder who is very experienced in this type build. No need for a full pre purchase survey which quite often can be useless.


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Old 16-09-2015, 17:47   #20
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Re: List of insurers that don't require a survey

Just switched from Progressive to Boat US. We are hauled out up the St John's River in Florida so we were able to get an Inland Rivers policy at about a quarter the price of our old policy. Genius. I will have to up the insurance when we relaunch in a year but no big deal.

In order to get Boat US insurance they make you fill out a Self Survey which basically just insures that your boat isn't held together with bailing wire. They also want pics of the interior exterior and engine compartment.


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Old 16-09-2015, 18:24   #21
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Re: List of insurers that don't require a survey

youi do not require a survey for insurance here in Australia. But in their contract they have a clause that states the boat has to be in a seaworthy condition. They employed me recently to do a survey on a boat that had made a claim. I sent them my report just stating the facts and they decided not to pay out on the claim. You cannot get a car insured in Oz without a road worthy certificate,so why should boats be any different? It is only every 5 years and it is all about risk evaluation. Surely the insurance company has a right to know the probability of a claim being made?
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Old 16-09-2015, 19:10   #22
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Re: List of insurers that don't require a survey

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Seems to me this is a cost of the their business. If the insurance company wants this kind of (fairly useless) information, then they should pay for it.
They can make you pay for it up front or they can add it to the cost of the premium. One way or another the buyer pays.
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Old 16-09-2015, 21:35   #23
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Re: List of insurers that don't require a survey

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They can make you pay for it up front or they can add it to the cost of the premium. One way or another the buyer pays.
Agreed, but then market competition would be allowed to operate. As it is now, they just off-load a cost of their business (create an externality) onto boat owners. I know ... it's what businesses do. But we don't have to agree with it.
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Old 16-09-2015, 22:03   #24
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Re: List of insurers that don't require a survey

Depending on your experience, a survey can be a good thing. A surveyor will see and check things you don't. Larger boats - probably too big to trailer - won't get insurance w/o a survey because of the cost to contain oil and raise a sunken boat.
For a classic boat, try https://www.hagerty.com/Insurance/Cl...Boat-Insurance.
They insure pleasure for all US & Canadian waters to 12 miles out.
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Old 17-09-2015, 04:20   #25
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Re: List of insurers that don't require a survey

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Agreed, but then market competition would be allowed to operate. As it is now, they just off-load a cost of their business (create an externality) onto boat owners. I know ... it's what businesses do. But we don't have to agree with it.
The world is flat !
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Old 17-09-2015, 05:58   #26
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Re: List of insurers that don't require a survey

Apologies for a bit of drift, but is there a discerning company that will insure small cruising boats? Survey or no, I've basically been laughed at by the likes of Pantaenius who say my boat does not meet their underwriting requirements. $220/annually for BoatUS liability only. But hull coverage would be 8%/yr!
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Old 17-09-2015, 06:26   #27
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Re: List of insurers that don't require a survey

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Apologies for a bit of drift, but is there a discerning company that will insure small cruising boats? Survey or no, I've basically been laughed at by the likes of Pantaenius who say my boat does not meet their underwriting requirements. $220/annually for BoatUS liability only. But hull coverage would be 8%/yr!

It depends on your navigational boundaries. At the moment we are insured through Boat US and the cost for hull coverage is about $250/annually but we are only insured for the Pamlico/Albermale sounds. If your plans are for coastal US and the Bahamas, try Geico, they gave us a good rate on our last boat.


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Old 17-09-2015, 06:57   #28
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Re: List of insurers that don't require a survey

^^ FWIW . . . . . GEICO owns BoatUS
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Old 17-09-2015, 07:14   #29
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Re: List of insurers that don't require a survey

There are two stages, and we all hope to only go thru the first: Buy insurance.

The second stage is to file and obtain a claim. There are many many reasons for a company to deny a claim if the boat was not surveyed or its state was unknown or baselined, specially an older boat. Aggravations we only find out when we need them most.


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International Marine Insurance Services (IMIS) said they do demand a survey, even for liability-only insurance. And the representative made it pretty clear they don't like the idea of liability-only.
In my case no insurance company wanted to even talk to me unless I had a recent survey. Well, I have a 47 year good old boat, so I saw it coming....
But I only wanted liability and could not find a company that would sell me this, had to get the whole package - it seems there are more options in the US.
Mike are you insured just in Canada or internationally with IMIS? Do you know what the underwriter is?
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Old 17-09-2015, 07:32   #30
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Re: List of insurers that don't require a survey

mariners insurance group is a good insurer for third party international insurance.
there is no survey requirement. was easy to get this done.
remember if you cruise mexico you will have to have 3rd party insurance from a company with feet in mexico. rules out progressive, boat us, and many others--state farm, allstate, etc do NOT have feet in mexico.
happy sails.
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