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20-06-2015, 12:49
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#1
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Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Denmark (Winter), Helsinki (Summer); Cruising the Baltic Sea this year!
Boat: Cutter-Rigged Moody 54
Posts: 33,764
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Keeping a Proper Lookout -- A Cautionary Tale
I'm not sure whether this was discussed on CF or not, but there is a tragic case which is relevant to our recent discussions and the COLREGS obligation to keep a "proper lookout": http://www.southamptonvts.co.uk/admi...Orca_Flyer.pdf
The full MAIB report is really instructive: https://assets.digital.cabinet-offic...ort10_2015.pdf
This happened just last year, off Felixstowe in the North Sea.
The skipper of the yacht went below for just a moment to take a leak.
The dredger, which was only 1.6 miles away when the skipper of the yacht went below, altered course and ran down the yacht. The skipper's wife and dog were killed. The skipper survived -- barely.
Neither vessel was keeping a "proper watch" when the accident happened, with tragic results.
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20-06-2015, 12:58
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#2
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Aboard the Ocean wave
Boat: 55' sloop.
Posts: 1,426
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Re: Keeping a Proper Lookout -- A Cautionary Tale
Had not seen this. Thanks for posting. Terribly sad. Rule 5 is absolutely the MOST important of the COLREGS.
__________________
‘Structural engineering is the art of modeling materials we do not wholly understand into shapes we cannot precisely analyse as to withstand forces we cannot properly assess in such a way that the public at large has no reason to suspect the extent of our ignorance.’
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20-06-2015, 13:06
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#3
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Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Denmark (Winter), Helsinki (Summer); Cruising the Baltic Sea this year!
Boat: Cutter-Rigged Moody 54
Posts: 33,764
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Re: Keeping a Proper Lookout -- A Cautionary Tale
Quote:
Originally Posted by Muckle Flugga
Had not seen this. Thanks for posting. Terribly sad. Rule 5 is absolutely the MOST important of the COLREGS.
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Who out of us doesn't go below for a minute to take a leak, or make a cuppa? There but for the grace of God go I . . .
This case is deeply disturbing.
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20-06-2015, 13:24
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#4
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Aboard the Ocean wave
Boat: 55' sloop.
Posts: 1,426
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Re: Keeping a Proper Lookout -- A Cautionary Tale
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dockhead
Who out of us doesn't go below for a minute to take a leak, or make a cuppa? There but for the grace of God go I . . .
This case is deeply disturbing.
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Indeed, luck is a component in any success. The trick is to woo her effectively. Unusually this involves being surprisingly boring. And, you know, I've never understood the (otherwise rather lovely) "but for the grace of God" thing, as it implies that while that grace saved "I", it really screwed the other bugger!
__________________
‘Structural engineering is the art of modeling materials we do not wholly understand into shapes we cannot precisely analyse as to withstand forces we cannot properly assess in such a way that the public at large has no reason to suspect the extent of our ignorance.’
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20-06-2015, 13:56
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#5
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Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Denmark (Winter), Helsinki (Summer); Cruising the Baltic Sea this year!
Boat: Cutter-Rigged Moody 54
Posts: 33,764
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Re: Keeping a Proper Lookout -- A Cautionary Tale
Quote:
Originally Posted by Muckle Flugga
. . . . as it implies that while that grace saved "I", it really screwed the other bugger!
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Exactly!!!
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20-06-2015, 14:33
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#6
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Long Range Cruiser
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Australian living on "Sea Life" currently in England.
Boat: Beneteau 393 "Sea Life"
Posts: 12,822
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Re: Keeping a Proper Lookout -- A Cautionary Tale
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dockhead
Who out of us doesn't go below for a minute to take a leak, or make a cuppa? There but for the grace of God go I . . .
This case is deeply disturbing.
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I don't go below if something is that close. Plus my AIS alarm should sound
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20-06-2015, 15:30
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#7
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Caribbean
Boat: Oyster 66
Posts: 1,333
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Re: Keeping a Proper Lookout -- A Cautionary Tale
What a tragic fug up.
Gormless pilotage on the dredger, awful procedures and systems in dealing with a blind spot on the bridge and no use of radar alarms. Inexcusable.
The poor yacht skipper thought they were safe, but they were near danger. It was not a time to take a pee.
Blame for what little my opinion is worth: 90% to the dredger 10% to the yacht. 100% to a sloppy safety culture.
Be safe everyone.
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20-06-2015, 16:11
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#8
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Eternal Member
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 848
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Re: Keeping a Proper Lookout -- A Cautionary Tale
Quote:
Originally Posted by poiu
The poor yacht skipper thought they were safe, but they were near danger. It was not a time to take a pee.
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No need to go below to take a leak, either...
About a buck @ Harbor Freight, attach a lanyard to be able to toss it over the side to rinse... Doesn't get much simpler than that...
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20-06-2015, 16:36
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#9
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Home port Kemah, TX Currently in Brunswick Georgia
Boat: Hunter 36
Posts: 1,524
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Re: Keeping a Proper Lookout -- A Cautionary Tale
The 5 minute absence by the captain of Orca was a bit long for a pee, no?
Ralph
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20-06-2015, 16:52
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#10
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Home port Kemah, TX Currently in Brunswick Georgia
Boat: Hunter 36
Posts: 1,524
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Re: Keeping a Proper Lookout -- A Cautionary Tale
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkJ
I don't go below if something is that close. Plus my AIS alarm should sound
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No AIS on my boat, but interested. Does the AIS alarm go off due to proximity only? Or would it go off once a collision was imminent due to Shoreway's course change. The vessels were only 1.6 miles apart when Orca's skipper went for a piss.
Ralph
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20-06-2015, 17:04
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#11
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: San Francisco Bay
Boat: Fantasia 35
Posts: 1,251
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Re: Keeping a Proper Lookout -- A Cautionary Tale
This report is total crap!!!
The dredger OOW failed to "clear" his intended course. This is such a basic function that not performing it should be considered total incompetence. It doesn't mater what type of vehicle you are maneuvering - be it a vessel, plane, or car - before making a turn you make sure that you aren't going to hit anything.
The fact that the dredge OOW was actively maneuvering his vessel places full burden
of his actions on him and no one else. If he had performed the most basic of seaman like actions there would not have been a collision.
Paul
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20-06-2015, 17:52
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#12
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Moderator and Certifiable Refitter
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: South of 43 S, Australia
Boat: C.L.O.D.
Posts: 20,301
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Re: Keeping a Proper Lookout -- A Cautionary Tale
Very sad. As with most accidents, a lot of errors all round. Once again the holes in the swiss cheese aligned with tragic results.
And yet one error seems to saved the skippers life; his lifejacket failed to auto-inflate (see section 2.7 of full report).
There are no certainties in life and at the best we can only minimise the risks, not eliminate them.
__________________
All men dream: but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds wake in the day to find it was vanity: but the dreamers of the day are dangereous men, for they may act their dreams with open eyes, to make it possible. T.E. Lawrence
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21-06-2015, 01:38
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#13
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Caribbean
Boat: Oyster 66
Posts: 1,333
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Re: Keeping a Proper Lookout -- A Cautionary Tale
Why didn't the report say that orca might have had radar or AIS equipment? If it had been fitted, it would certainly have been a contributory factor that it wasn't turned on. It would most probably have saved them.
I don't like compulsory anything, but there is a lot we have to do that is compulsory, particularly with safety equipment on Red Flag boats over 13.7m, so why not add this kit to the list and for smaller boats too like Orca? This was not the first nor will it be the last tragic accident that such equipment can protect from.
An analogy in aviation: Aircraft have transponders, which work a bit like AIS. All planes in controlled airspace near airports have to use one. About half of England is controlled airspace.
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21-06-2015, 02:01
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#14
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Marine Service Provider
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: La Paz, Mexico
Boat: 1978 Hudson Force 50 Ketch
Posts: 3,920
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Re: Keeping a Proper Lookout -- A Cautionary Tale
If you want to remove all risk in life, then I guess we could stay locked in the house. Well until that Tornado or earthquake hits. What bothers me is the knee jerk reaction to legislate after every accident as if all accidents can be prevented if we only mandated and passed the right laws. We all know that single handing is dangerous...so why not ban it? Why not make it illegal? Because there is there is this little thing called Freedom and assumed risk.
__________________
Rich Boren
Cruise RO & Schenker Water Makers
Technautics CoolBlue Refrigeration
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21-06-2015, 02:02
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#15
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Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Denmark (Winter), Helsinki (Summer); Cruising the Baltic Sea this year!
Boat: Cutter-Rigged Moody 54
Posts: 33,764
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Re: Keeping a Proper Lookout -- A Cautionary Tale
Quote:
Originally Posted by poiu
Why didn't the report say that orca might have had radar or AIS equipment? If it had been fitted, it would certainly have been a contributory factor that it wasn't turned on. It would most probably have saved them.
I don't like compulsory anything, but there is a lot we have to do that is compulsory, particularly with safety equipment on Red Flag boats over 13.7m, so why not add this kit to the list and for smaller boats too like Orca? This was not the first nor will it be the last tragic accident that such equipment can protect from. . . . .
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I think that a requirement that we broadcast AIS is inevitable. This will certainly help safety, but will also allow us to be tracked everywhere, all the time . . . That being said, I have a "transmit off" switch on my AIS which I've never used . . .
Whether AIS would have helped Orca or not is doubtful. One of the main points here is that the accident happened in broad daylight and good viz, and everyone was relaxed. The dredger had a perfectly good radar return from Orca. But the OOW wasn't watching it.
In the place where this happened, I would have had all my guard zones and AIS alarms switched off, because in the approaches to a port like here, the alarms will drive you crazy. SOP for me in such a place is to go to a higher state of watchkeeping constantly looking out visually and watching the instruments. But SOP for me allows me to go below for a pee (not for 5 minutes, but still). I would like to think that I wouldn't do it while another vessel was 1.5 miles away, but if it were apparently following a channel, and I were outside the channel, apparently well clear? Hmm.
This really shook me up. Maybe AIS alarms could be set with different parameters in ports, rather than switching them off. That can't be done easily on my system.
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