Is an ICC Necessary for UK - Canaries - Jamaica?

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by Zanshin

.....

Almost all the other EU countries require a boating license of some type in order for their residents to operate their (EU-registered
Since you are on a U.S. vessel and are not a resident of the EU they cannot make any stipulations as to licensing as long as you are legal for your boat's flag country.
This has been custom for many years - imagine the chaos and problems if each country were to require a local license for visiting captains and boats.

This isn't strictly true, for example if you intend to take your foreign vessel up the Rhine you must have an ICC irrespective of nationality.

But you are correct in general, least we mislead our impressionable young ex-colonials . No country requires an ICC from a foreign boat. Some countries require proof of competency. Some port officials interpret that as the ICC .

These comments do not apply to charter boats either local or foreign.


The ICC is not a " local" license though. It's a UN sponsored cert.
Dave

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

Jeepers Johnny, what has the RYA done to deserve your ire.

You dont need a RYA cert to get an ICC, you can do the direct assesment exam and receive it without having any other qualification.

The ICC is not the child of the RYA, the ICC grew out of a European desire to harmonise the requirements for boat competency, especially on busy Inland commercial waterways. The UK signed up so as to allow its citizens to access such a qualification.

Dave

Right.

The UK is a kind of bureaucratic paradise for sailing, and this ire is certainly off base. The UK does not require any kind of license either from its own or visiting skippers or from visiting skippers, nor does it require any kind of registration of boats. The only scrap of paper you might theoretically need in UK waters is something showing VAT status of the vessel, in case you stay beyond the 18 month grace period for non-EU yachts. I have been sailing in UK waters for two years and have never been asked for anything.

The RYA is a non-profit association whose mission is to help sailors. It has the world's best program of training and qualification. It offers ICC tickets only to make life easier for us in more bureaucratic countries. Holding any RYA qualification from, I believe, Day Skipper or above gives you the right to have your ICC without any kind of exam. If you don't have any RYA qualification, you can take a simple exam, as others have said.

And in general, you should study the - absolutely free - RYA resources for anything you want to know about bureaucratic procedures in Europe. RYA.

Noonsite is another good resource. The forums are a great place to discuss these questions, but for definitive answers go the source.

[David_Old_Jersey]

As you are on a Forum with a heavy North American membership many folks genuinely are confused about folks who don't have a piece of paper from a Govt saying they are free. and one to say they are "safe". It's a cultural thing I guess.

Having said that, your attitude doesn't mean you won't sail off a cliff. But that's what makes me free.

[Johnny Mercer]

The RYA is a non-profit organisation but it doesn't change the fact that the sailing companies affiliated to the RYA all charge allot of money to do a ICC. It is perhaps more a matter of continental bureaucracy than British bureaucracy. People keep on saying that the test is cheep but the cheapest I can find is £120 does anyone know a club (rather than a private company) that does one for cheeper? I am pretty sure I would pass, especially if I did it on my own boat when I am well acquainted with it. Would I need to insure my boat before in order to do the test on it? The problem there is that having a ICC will cut down on insurance costs so would want to get insured after, rather than before is possible!

[atoll]

icc is not nessacary in uk waters,probably due to the fact that we have the RNLI,which is free,
saving lives of any idiot who chooses to go out on the water,whether they are qualified or not.

in europe generally you will be charged for your rescue/tow in,
the icc evolved to try to keep idiots off the high seas in small boats with little or no knowledge.

this is one of the great benefits of socialism, allowing an idiot to become, AN IDIOT WITH A PIECE OF PAPER.............

[Dockhead]

I would like to remind everyone that the Forum rules do not allow political ranting and raving, particularly that which is unrelated to sailing and cruising. Take it outside, boys. There are plenty of good forums devoted to the interesting subject of politics, political systems, and political philosophy. Cruisers Forum is not one of these.

[VirtualVagabond]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

I would like to remind everyone that the Forum rules do not allow political ranting and raving, particularly that which is unrelated to sailing and cruising. Take it outside, boys. There are plenty of good forums devoted to the interesting subject of politics, political systems, and political philosophy. Cruisers Forum is not one of these.

Fair comment Dockhead. I was wondering when the mods were going to step in

Johnny, I got your full post via email, but just to fill in some background, CF has strict rules regarding using CF as a soap box for political debate. It's a good rule because things in the past have become heated, personal and ugly, conflicting with the other CF rule of 'be nice'...
In this case it didn't get too personal or ugly, which is a credit to all involved, but rules are rules (for the good of all ) ... sorry, couldn't resist that

I think all of us who are choosing the cruising life are at a point of accepting that we can't do much as individuals to change the status quo, but we sure as hell can choose to live life on our own terms to a greater extent 'out there'.

I think you're going to love the life, and the offer of a beer still stands. I'll pay, because I haven't found a country yet that gives it away for free

Vic

[Nomadsailor]

We plan(ned) a trip to the Med and bumped into ICC & CEVNI.
My marina in Flanders told me "the ICC is in its infancy". No need there. Belgium doesn't have ICC and you are neither able to get it there. On top of all other taxes they have a "water tax for boaters" and that is for everyone: locals and foreigners with or without ICC.

My boat sails under UK flag and maybe that makes a difference somewhere. Who knows...

It is a rather unclear situation it appears and that seems the way policy makers opted to introduce these assessments. (Posher) marinas and maybe soon insurance companies are catching up. Over time it might indeed be very well very difficult to find coverage but by then we have become all so scared of water we rather sail on PlayStation or study for the next test at home.

About ICC
About the ICC | The ICC and Proof of Competence Abroad | Boating Abroad | Information & Advice | RYA

About CEVNI
The ICC CEVNI Test | The ICC and Proof of Competence Abroad | Boating Abroad | Information & Advice | RYA


We still have not decided if we are going to make the trip to Spain. So far for Freedom of Movement within the European Union for its citizens.
Canal Routes to Med
Gentle Sailing Route to the Med

An other reason for our hesitation is that we read that if one stays for a total of more then 182 days in Spanish waters one is forced to register on Spanish flag at the cost of 12 percent of the value of the vessel. That is of course an other topic. One with a clearly more financial taste to it then the ICC and CEVNI tests that are able to add to the safety on board of ships.
Sailing & Boating in Almera & Granada - AngloINFO Almería (Spain)

[beneteau-500]

re- ICC i just recently checked into turkey in the port of Kas and had to use an agent there to check in i was asked for every piece of paper to prove who i was yacht insurance ownership papers radio cert you name it and then came the big crunch the ask for my sailing Qualifications and i didn't have them on me but quick thinking i pulled out my RYA membership card ( which just has my name and membership No on it ) and guess what he said oh that's good your are properly trained yachtsman ( at the same time my 14 yr old daughter started laughing her head off ) and the customs man politely asked what was funny and daughter replied i have more qualifications than my dad i have a power boat license and my dad doesn't and she duly showed them so the customs man and harbor master then said we will put you down as captain and your father as crew man then on the paper work .

but having survived that two french yachts where detained in port due to the fact they could not produce Qualifications i have not heard of this in other areas of turkey so far happening but only in kas so those who are of to turkey beware it may happen to you

[nelbem]

Originally Posted by Johnny Mercer

... After all, aren't most of these RYA courses for posho yachty types with enough money to blow (mostly stolen from workers labour), and to keep the RYA training companies in business? Convenient their particular product is part of a legal requirement, what ever happened to the days when someone could get a boat and head off into the sunset? Anyone dared not get an ICC, and cruised the world without the approval of the royal yachters?

My goodness... I haven't heard rhetoric like that since 1965. Lighten up, we are all equal here. Just people in love with sailing, willing to encourage and help each other. You won't go far with your political causes tattooed on your head. I hope you will visit many different countries and show respect for those countries. Keep your rhetoric to yourself, else you will embarrass all sailors and possibly end up in jail or worse in some countries.

[Nicholson58]

I wish we had an aquvilent to Yachtmaster in the US.

I have my Masters Credentials but screwed up on the medical form, admitting I have a heart murmer (since birth - 60 years) This throws me into a "special treatment" category so maintaining it costs me personally 4000 per year for nuclear cardio tests my cardiologist says are pointless. It would make sense for the USCG to offer a non-commercial credential without medical restriction. (Mush as the FAA offers a sport pilot license with greatly reduced medical oversight.) We need to have a certification of competancy for insurance purposes and for some foreign ports. I take professional operation of our vessel very seriously but I'm screwed.

[svlamorocha]

Originally Posted by Nicholson58

I wish we had an aquvilent to Yachtmaster in the US.

In fact you can do course and exam to get a (non-RYA!) Yachtmaster ticket from the IYT school in Ft Lauderdale almost every month and there are also some places that run RYA courses and exams in the US East coast a few tiems each year.. Citizenship is not an issue for both IYT and RYA schemes.

[circumnavbute]

hi, the Icc is apparently a european thingy I think. but my understanding of it is as follows: your country of residence or boat registration is the starting point concerning what you need in the way of qualifications?? to set sail in yer tub. In the UK we don't need anything yet?? so we don't need one!simple eh? but if we were portugese or spanish we might have to have one cos thats what the country expects of its nationals/tubs flagged there etc. so these people think we need one and so the confusion exist's. but i think i am correct in thinking that if you are from the uk or any country that does NOT require its tubs/nationals to have any qualifications in her waters then you dont strictly need an ICC. Mind I have been wrong about something once before so I stand here too be corrected.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by circumnavbute

hi, the Icc is apparently a european thingy I think. but my understanding of it is as follows: your country of residence or boat registration is the starting point concerning what you need in the way of qualifications?? to set sail in yer tub. In the UK we don't need anything yet?? so we don't need one!simple eh? but if we were portugese or spanish we might have to have one cos thats what the country expects of its nationals/tubs flagged there etc. so these people think we need one and so the confusion exist's. but i think i am correct in thinking that if you are from the uk or any country that does NOT require its tubs/nationals to have any qualifications in her waters then you dont strictly need an ICC. Mind I have been wrong about something once before so I stand here too be corrected.

No you are wrong. Countries do mandate tickets irrespective of whether your own country requires them. Croatia is a particular case in point.

Dave

[circumnavbute]

I am standing here corrected?? I think. nice weather isn' it.