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Old 18-08-2014, 17:22   #106
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Re: Florida Boaters Unite: defeat HB 955 and SB 1126

Sorry I have to disagree with 50% of the posts. The boaters who anchor do NOT add to the economy. They are net consumers of services. They rarely purchase good or services, yet use facilities. Take for example the "rustic" sailboat that has been anchored in Lake Boca for a few months. If that boat breaks free, the local PD will need to secure it, haul it and deal with the owner. If the thing tears loose on an outgoing tide it will snag on the bridge... Once again a FL resident expense.

On the other hand there are those that use marinas, consuming good and services- adding to the economy.

This is not a have vs have not issue. It is a simple finance issue. One cannot consume the use of pump outs, assume medical services will be there for you, assume police protection, without contributing to the economy. If you don't, I am....
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Old 18-08-2014, 18:08   #107
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Re: Florida Boaters Unite: defeat HB 955 and SB 1126

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Originally Posted by ka4wja View Post
BandB,
You made me smile!!!
Not sure, but sounds like you're down by the Las Olas Isles....
I grew up just a few miles North of there (the Landings/Lake Estates/Bay Colony), just a few houses off the intercoastal.....
And when our neighbor got rid of their 45' Bertram (?) and came home with a new sportfisher (a big 70' Striker I think), it was a tight squeeze as he pivoted that thing around 180* in our narrow canal!! (myself and my Dad were out there "helping"....fending him off our boat!)
The Rio Grande between Hendricks and Isle of Venice is the most insane canal. But you can go in either direction on the ICW and find hundreds of similar canals.
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Old 18-08-2014, 18:22   #108
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Re: Florida Boaters Unite: defeat HB 955 and SB 1126

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Originally Posted by Snore View Post
Sorry I have to disagree with 50% of the posts. The boaters who anchor do NOT add to the economy. They are net consumers of services. They rarely purchase good or services, yet use facilities. Take for example the "rustic" sailboat that has been anchored in Lake Boca for a few months. If that boat breaks free, the local PD will need to secure it, haul it and deal with the owner. If the thing tears loose on an outgoing tide it will snag on the bridge... Once again a FL resident expense.

On the other hand there are those that use marinas, consuming good and services- adding to the economy.

This is not a have vs have not issue. It is a simple finance issue. One cannot consume the use of pump outs, assume medical services will be there for you, assume police protection, without contributing to the economy. If you don't, I am....
The sailboat you refer to is not typical of those who anchor however. While all people don't contribute equally to the economy, they all add something and decisions need to be based on more than just the financial aspect. You want to talk finances and you'll have less dredging, bridge schedules reduced, municipal marinas closed. Some people spend millions, some spend hundreds, but they all count and all add. Do we eliminate museums because most don't go to them? Do we eliminate public beaches because no one pays to use them? Parks? Shut the schools as some of us don't go and don't have children and could afford private schools? I'm sorry but I don't like an elitist attitude where those who bring less to the economy are considered less important. And to characterize them by one example doesn't make sense.

I do understand your point that some spend less than others, but they still count. Most cruisers who anchor do use and pay for some land services. Even if it's just groceries, it contributes. I don't feel somehow superior because I buy more fuel or pay for dock space.

The abandoned derelict boats are negatives to those who anchor too. They don't like being associated with them, losing ability to anchor because of them, or dealing with this issues anymore than anyone else.

The ICW was built for commercial traffic. Now that it's used less for commercial should we just let it build up and close it?

Take society as a whole. The person who makes $20,000 a year doesn't contribute financially as much as the one who makes a million. Should we cut off all services to them?

There is no reason to start putting down those who choose to anchor the majority of the time. I'm glad to share the waterways with them.
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Old 18-08-2014, 19:00   #109
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Re: Florida Boaters Unite: defeat HB 955 and SB 1126

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There is no reason to start putting down those who choose to anchor the majority of the time. I'm glad to share the waterways with them.
PLEASE do not put words into mouth!!!

I did not put anyone down. I simply stated facts. I even avoiding insulting you for misquoting me :>)
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Old 18-08-2014, 19:06   #110
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Re: Florida Boaters Unite: defeat HB 955 and SB 1126

I think that you did not actually state facts, you stated your opinion. They are not always the same, but are often thought of as such.

Coops.
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Old 18-08-2014, 22:19   #111
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Re: Florida Boaters Unite: defeat HB 955 and SB 1126

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Originally Posted by Snore View Post
Sorry I have to disagree with 50% of the posts. The boaters who anchor do NOT add to the economy. They are net consumers of services. They rarely purchase good or services, yet use facilities. Take for example the "rustic" sailboat that has been anchored in Lake Boca for a few months. If that boat breaks free, the local PD will need to secure it, haul it and deal with the owner. If the thing tears loose on an outgoing tide it will snag on the bridge... Once again a FL resident expense.

On the other hand there are those that use marinas, consuming good and services- adding to the economy.

This is not a have vs have not issue. It is a simple finance issue. One cannot consume the use of pump outs, assume medical services will be there for you, assume police protection, without contributing to the economy. If you don't, I am....
I find it strange that you think people who use anchors don't contribute to the economy most people don't come by this lifestyle without somewhere along the line paying taxes. and working extremely hard. There boat is registered taxes they pay for food fule taxes there paid for the e boat it was taxed. Owning a boat and not paying a Martina certainly dose not mean no taxes thus they deserve all the rights we have as a home or boat owner. Marina or not.

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Old 18-08-2014, 22:58   #112
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Re: Florida Boaters Unite: defeat HB 955 and SB 1126

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The boaters who anchor do NOT add to the economy. They are net consumers of services.
You're aware that these two statements are a direct contradiction, right?

I mean, you must be. You wrote them.
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Old 18-08-2014, 23:12   #113
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Re: Florida Boaters Unite: defeat HB 955 and SB 1126

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Originally Posted by Snore The boaters who anchor do NOT add to the economy. They are net consumers of services.

You're aware that these two statements are a direct contradiction, right?

I mean, you must be. You wrote them.
It read to me that he was saying, they use more services than they pay for. He can correct if that's an erroneous interpretation.

I don't like that characterization.
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Old 18-08-2014, 23:38   #114
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Re: Florida Boaters Unite: defeat HB 955 and SB 1126

I think most understand his point, it's just not popular here, or politically correct.
Many things aren't anymore, but that doesn't change the basic premise.
Just the way our society is, some "contribute" more than others.

My personal observation is that the ones that bother me the most are the ones that are so wealthy that they don't "contribute" much at all.
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Old 18-08-2014, 23:59   #115
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Re: Florida Boaters Unite: defeat HB 955 and SB 1126

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It read to me that he was saying, they use more services than they pay for.
Even criminals contribute (in quite a large way, actually, certainly more than the stingiest honest cruiser) to economies.

So if his case is what you are suggesting it is, that cruisers pay for less than they consume, I hope he put more thought into his case than he did into stating it.

But from here, once you have that case stated accurately, it starts to fall apart.
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Old 19-08-2014, 00:32   #116
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Re: Florida Boaters Unite: defeat HB 955 and SB 1126

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Isn't it great to be able to look out and see all the boats anchored. To me that's a beautiful view. But then how does one retain that while also making sure the derelict houseboat doesn't sink again and get left by the owners next time.


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Old 19-08-2014, 03:50   #117
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Re: Florida Boaters Unite: defeat HB 955 and SB 1126

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I think that you did not actually state facts, you stated your opinion. They are not always the same, but are often thought of as such.

Coops.
Coops you may be right. But absent a competent third party research, that's all I got.

So absent facts I must yield
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Old 19-08-2014, 05:22   #118
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Re: Florida Boaters Unite: defeat HB 955 and SB 1126

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Originally Posted by Snore View Post
Coops you may be right. But absent a competent third party research, that's all I got.

So absent facts I must yield
Snore,

You've got no reason to "yield". You're spot on, especially with respect to the sedentary boats which seem to be able to spend months at anchor without visiting the local pump out. I would like to think that those boats are floating holding tanks, but sometimes I wonder...

Jacques
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Old 19-08-2014, 05:35   #119
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Re: Florida Boaters Unite: defeat HB 955 and SB 1126

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.
On the other hand there are those that use marinas, consuming good and services- adding to the economy.
You paint with a very broad brush. I've been anchored for months on the space coast. I buy food, fuel, pay for pump outs, rent cars, paid for an injector rebuild, dinner out from time to time, $$$ at Worst Marine, and of course Rum. The money I would have spent for a marina or a ball got spent in town instead.
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Old 19-08-2014, 07:10   #120
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Re: Florida Boaters Unite: defeat HB 955 and SB 1126

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Snore,

You've got no reason to "yield". You're spot on, especially with respect to the sedentary boats which seem to be able to spend months at anchor without visiting the local pump out. I would like to think that those boats are floating holding tanks, but sometimes I wonder...

Jacques
Sorry Jacques, coop was right I have no stats to back things up. See next

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You paint with a very broad brush. I've been anchored for months on the space coast. I buy food, fuel, pay for pump outs, rent cars, paid for an injector rebuild, dinner out from time to time, $$$ at Worst Marine, and of course Rum. The money I would have spent for a marina or a ball got spent in town instead.
Yes that is why I yielded there is no data to support either of our positions. Intrinsically I feel you are a statistical anomaly. But once again there is a adequate data.
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