Dont declare firearms in the Bahamas, Ouch!

[RTB]

Originally Posted by skipmac

I have a question about the stop and inspection. The article said,

Coral Harbour Base, 17 August 2015 (RBDF): Her Majesty’s Bahamian Ship P-44 apprehended a foreign pleasure yacht for failing to declare the firearms it had on board at its first port of entry on Tuesday 11th August 2015.

To me it is not clear if the boat had not cleared at all. For years it has been common for cruisers to wait and clear in at their final destination port in the Bahamas and was allowed by the Bahamas as long as the vessel didn't stop in transit. However recently they have been enforcing the rule strictly and requiring boats to clear in at the first port on their route.

The way the article is worded it is possible that the boat had not yet cleared into the Bahamas and was planning to do so at their first stop. If they had not yet cleared then they obviously had not had the opportunity to declare the guns.

Or they could have cleared in and not declared the guns.

Anyone know which it is?

It looks like they checked in on Tuesday 11th at it's first port of entry, and got boarded on the 17th.

Ralph

[jkindredpdx]

Originally Posted by micah719

I'll be sure to declare my guns before I anchor in a movie theatre. How much scope, and should I use all-chain rode for that?

OK, perhaps I was a bit hyperbolic, my point however was, if I am a liar by not declaring weapons what should the authorities assume about my intentions? And, if you assume I can't do much damage with only 100 rounds of ammo, I think you are naive.

[jwcolby54]

Originally Posted by PortClydeMe

Just out of personal interest, which university did you attend?

One that teaches that I do not have to have a gun to be a man.

As an aside, I grew up hunting. I got my first hunting license (and gun, my 410 shotgun) when I was 8 years old and hunted dove, quail, rabbit, pheasant, duck and deer. I owned a 410, a 20 ga, a 12 ga, a 22 and a 30.06.

I eventually joined the US Navy where I was (kinda) trained to fire a 45. Since I left high school, I have never owned a weapon. I gave all of my stuff to my nephew who to this day takes deer with that old 30.06.

As for me, I leave law enforcement up to the law enforcers. I am 61 years old. I have never been robbed, never been threatened with a weapon, and never been in any situation where I felt I needed a weapon. Simple as that.

It is exactly and precisely the JOB of law enforcement to enforce laws. To do that they NEED to carry weapons. It is NOT my job. I have never been deputized, carried a badge, asked by law enforcement to enforce the laws, nor needed a gun for protection. The VAST majority of Americans feel the same way. A SMALL (but VERY VOCAL) minority of Americans feel otherwise.

To me, it is sad that they feel that way.

The rest of the world does not even think about the issue.

[skipmac]

Originally Posted by SailingJeeper

Are you sure ? LOL JK

I am curious as to how many people carry out there.... has anyone ever needed to carry or wish they had something? ( I just keep thinking of Capt Philips)

I look at carrying like a life raft on the ship .... Hopefully it's never needed, but in case it is.....It's there. Both would stay put away except in an extreme emergency.

I used to always keep some kind of gun on board. Don't do it anymore. Never needed one, even cruising out of the way places including Caribbean coast of South America during the 70s-80s when the Columbian and Cuban cocaine cowboys were running wild.

Only one time did I ever consider the need for self defense. 1982 we were on the way back to FL from USVI in the Santeren Channel (gap between the Cay Sal Banks and the Bahamas Banks) when we were approached by a FL keys lobster boat with three men on board coming in from the west. They stopped about a mile off when they saw us, made a large circle and went on a couple of miles east of us then turned and came straight up to us.

I was on board with my wife, 2 year old daughter and my wife's best friend. Made me very nervous and I had everyone go below out of sight when the boat started getting close. Wondering if they were checking us out for robbery or hijacking.

They came up and asked if we had seen another sailboat in the area, which we hadn't. Pretty sure they were out to meet someone and offload some undeclared cargo. I responded, they said thanks and motored away. End of story.

[Pipistrelle]

I just find this whole discussion, and the one yesterday that was stopped by the moderator, extraordinary.

No guns on board and it is highly unlikely that anyone will be hurt. With guns on board there is every chance that someone will be hurt or killed. We have been cruising the oceans for 7 years. In that time nobody has shown us any aggression, and we are totally unarmed, and always will be.

[jb cruzan]

Originally Posted by FlyingDiver

Quite true. I had to remove a dive knife from my bags once boarding a cruise ship. I was lucky that the cruise terminal security company held if for me until we returned. Otherwise I would have had to toss it. They do their diligence to make sure passengers don't bring weapons aboard. And I'm sure they do declare whatever weapons the ship security officers have aboard.

Apples to oranges. You are substituting your cruise screening (with cruise line personnel) for small island destination customs and immigration services. What gets by the cruise screen you can freely take in to destination. My point is, these small islands look the other way when the big ships come in for the $.


Sorry for going OT or at least parallel? topic to the OP.

For the record I am pro the captain being accountable for not following rules in a foreign country, just pointing out the double standards and how easily a few hundred thou in tourist revenue will get these guys to not worry so much about their principles.

[crabcake]

Originally Posted by northwestsailor

If you have to resort to any weapons your mind and heart have already failed you. Having arms or feeling like you need arms is a sign of weakness not strength.

You would find the same consequences bringing arms into Canada so it is not unique to the Bahamas.

I think you miss the point. You assume the person carrying the weapons are the offending party. You assume that because you are carrying a weapon you are weak.

Those assumptions are patently without any merit whatsoever. All one has to do is to search this, and other cruising websites to learn how innocent people were either seriously injured or killed by persons invading their boat. Your argument does not account for those instances. There is no redress if you are killed by a criminal who wants to take your electronics or dingy (at gunpoint), cash or whatever. You are dead.

So by your reasoning, the poor criminals who want to take your goods and possibly do seriously injury to you and your crew, are just poor misguided unfortunates? The criminal is the gun owner? Horsefeathers!

Please spare us your moral indignation and pontificates. This thread is about declaring your weapons while clearing customs, not whether guns are moral or not.

For your information, Gun Violence in Canada is a serious issue despite their laws, see Washington Post article here.

In any event, I've never had a problem clearing in the Bahamas - but I declare my weapons on the proper form.

[FamilyVan]

Originally Posted by SailingJeeper

Thanks Dulcesuenos for the information. As a new squid here.... This type of information helps out tremendously, as I've never traveled abroad before. I've always wondered if guns were necessary while traveling out and abroad ..... or maybe just over in the Red Sea where pirating seems to happen more often. I'd like to think a small revolver would be good to carry in case of wildlife or general protection from whatever.... maybe a rifle if traveling to a country near or known for pirating.

What does everyone carry while out and about ?

During duck season I carry a 12 gauge in my canoe. Can't imagine duck hunting in a 35' sailboat, so I carry nothing when sailing.

Sent from my XP7700 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

[skipmac]

Originally Posted by RTB

It looks like they checked in on Tuesday 11th at it's first port of entry, and got boarded on the 17th.

Ralph

That was my assumption but just wondered if that was when they entered Bahamian waters but had not cleared. It's a common plan.

If they did clear and didn't declare then they have no defense. Of course the guns could have been in a passenger's possession without the captain's knowledge.

I have read that some professional captains ask crew and guests to sign a statement that they have no illegal drugs, guns, etc. Then if anything does turn up the captain has at least some defense.

Considering the possible ramifications I might consider the same, depending on who's on board my boat.

[FilBrown]

Originally Posted by ChrisTinaBruce

Always fascinates me that governments can use guns to protect their interest but their citizens are not allowed the same rights. Makes you go "ummm"

But that's what Goverments are.
Voted by the people to GOVEN.
We put them there and expect them to uphold the laws of the land you're in.
Why the general populace need firearms to protect themselves is beyond me. That's the job of the Goverment which was voted in to take care of. To make the land as safe and secure for its citizens to live in surely?

[Steadman Uhlich]

Originally Posted by SailingJeeper

Are you sure ? LOL JK

I am curious as to how many people carry out there.... has anyone ever needed to carry or wish they had something? ( I just keep thinking of Capt Philips)

I look at carrying like a life raft on the ship .... Hopefully it's never needed, but in case it is.....It's there. Both would stay put away except in an extreme emergency.

Friendly suggestion follows:

You are new to the forum. Welcome.

The Gun Threads have been frequent, many, lengthy, contentious, and full of varying options, opinions, anecdotes, and arguments.
You could spend many hours reading them all.

They often get closed down or locked due to hostility and politicization of the discussions.

My suggestion?
Use the google Custom Search function I told you about earlier, and search the forum on key words Guns and weapons.

[RainDog]

Originally Posted by jb cruzan

Apples to oranges. You are substituting your cruise screening (with cruise line personnel) for small island destination customs and immigration services. What gets by the cruise screen you can freely take in to destination. My point is, these small islands look the other way when the big ships come in for the $.

The vast majority of private yachts entering the Bahamas get no inspection either. You just walk to an office and fill out a form.

[woodenboats]

Originally Posted by ChrisTinaBruce

Smuggling??? Being a little hyperbolic aren't we? Two handguns with 100 rounds is not smuggling...it's protection.

In some European Countries they would be sentenced to 4 years in prison - minimum for first time offenders. Unfortunately not all countries around here have such consequent legislation.

[Steadman Uhlich]

Originally Posted by davecalvert

We live in the Bahamas and cruise and charter our 43 ft catamaran. We do carry a rifle aboard but are careful to claim this and each round of amo when clearing in. Last fall, we claimed over 250 rounds of amo because we carry all the amo on board as we are not allowed to have this in out house in the islands. This was never a problem before last year but now, they limit the amo at 250 rounds. The rest they took and gave us a receipt for. We can claim these in Nassau on the return to the US.
We have been boarded in the past and each round counted as well as the gun's serial number checked.
In the Bahamas, we are allowed the gun on the boat as ships equipment but, it is a serious offense if we took this to the house. As a resident, we are allowed to have a shot gun only, by filling out the proper forms and being approved.

Thanks for posting your comments above.

I have a few sincere and friendly questions for you, based on your experience. My questions are purely curiosity and I have no ulterior motive. Since you may have dealt with the authorities numerous times on the declaration of firearms in the Bahamas, I would like to know more, from your POV and experience.

The following questions are asked in a friendly, but curious tone of voice. I am not judging you.

What is the stated reason for having the rifle aboard the boat? Security? Hunting wild pigs? Target practice or entertainment while cruising? Do the officials ever comment on this or express opinions? Etc.

Do the local authorities make any comments to you about the rifle versus handguns? In other words do they say or confide or suggest that long guns or sporting rifles or shotguns are more acceptable on a boat in the Bahamas?

Is there ever any comment or question why you have 250 rounds of ammo onboard? How is it explained? Why have 250 rounds on a boat?

[jb cruzan]

Originally Posted by RainDog

The vast majority of private yachts entering the Bahamas get no inspection either. You just walk to an office and fill out a form.

Fill out a form, pay some fees, present your passports (and possibly those of passengers traveling with you) and answer any questions they may have vs walking off a ship because you were able to get on it. Like I said... different experience...