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Old 28-12-2010, 08:49   #31
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... People are strange animals, aren't we?
We certainly are. Some, more than others.
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Old 28-12-2010, 08:52   #32
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We certainly are. Some, more than others.

Hoi n de Polloi's its nice to have recognition
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Old 28-12-2010, 09:51   #33
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Thanks for the info guys. I've never had any personal contact with authorities up north either, though I did contact the Coast Guard once after watching a powerboat drag a precarious marker a couple hundred meters out of a tight channel. I've always found everyone on that side of the border courteous and helpful, it's triing to come home thats a pain. Both today and 35-40 years ago. Oh well,I feel much safer, ha. I think I'll forget it this year.
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Old 28-12-2010, 11:55   #34
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RE PCOC

See Operator Card (PCOC) - FAQ - Transport Canada

Do the Competency of Operators of Pleasure Craft Regulations apply to non-residents? The Regulations apply to non-residents if:
  • They operate their pleasure craft in Canadian waters for more than 44 consecutive days or,
  • They operate a pleasure craft that is licensed or registered in Canada (including rented or chartered boats).
The Regulations do not apply to non-residents who operate their pleasure craft (licensed in a country other than Canada) in Canadian waters for less than 45 consecutive days. Please note that a proof of residence will be required on board at all times.
If you require more information on how Canadian requirements apply to non-residents visit the Requirements for Foreign Recreational Boaters In Canadian Waters.
What is acceptable proof of competency for non-residents?

For non-residents, proof of competency can take one of three forms:
  1. A Pleasure Craft Operator Card;
  2. A completed boat rental safety checklist (for power-driven rental boats); or,
  3. An operator card or equivalent which meets the requirements of their state or country.
Also please note the PCOC, Pleasure Craft Operator Certificate is a certificate, not a license.

There is a common mis-conception that you must have a card. You are required to have Proof of Competency.

If you hold any certificate on the List of Certificates of Competency, Training Certificates and other Equivalencies as Proof of Competency when Operating a Pleasure Craft, you already meet the requirements of the Competency of Operators of Pleasure Craft Regulations you just need to make sure you carry your certificate on board. Proof of certification may include original documentation or a copy of the certificate.



Tip: Certificates for boating safety courses completed before April 1, 1999 will be recognized. If you've already taken a course prior to these regulations - and have proof - then that course certificate or card will be accepted as proof of competency!



Also if you are stopped for inspection, the Enforcement Officer will likely be your local police. In the Sidney BC area it is the RCMP who are doing the inspections. Transport Canada rarely gets involved in pleasure vessel inspections. The RCMP were very active last summer, even inspecting commercial crab vessels and returning the vessels to the dock because the operators did not have their Restricted Operator Certificates for their VHF radios as required by law.



On the August long week-end, there was an enforcement campaign on Shuswap Lake. I believe 264 boaters were stopped and inspected. Only 4 were fully compliant with all the Regulations!!
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Old 28-12-2010, 17:27   #35
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[QUOTE=Captainbruce;586526]See Operator Card (PCOC) - FAQ - Transport Canada

Do the Competency of Operators of Pleasure Craft Regulations apply to non-residents? The Regulations apply to non-residents if:
  • They operate their pleasure craft in Canadian waters for more than 44 consecutive days or,
  • They operate a pleasure craft that is licensed or registered in Canada (including rented or chartered boats).
The Regulations do not apply to non-residents who operate their pleasure craft (licensed in a country other than Canada) in Canadian waters for less than 45 consecutive days. Please note that a proof of residence will be required on board at all times.
If you require more information on how Canadian requirements apply to non-residents visit the Requirements for Foreign Recreational Boaters In Canadian Waters.
What is acceptable proof of competency for non-residents?
For non-residents, proof of competency can take one of three forms:
  1. A Pleasure Craft Operator Card;
  2. A completed boat rental safety checklist (for power-driven rental boats); or,
  3. An operator card or equivalent which meets the requirements of their state or country.
Also please note the PCOC, Pleasure Craft Operator Certificate is a certificate, not a license.

There is a common mis-conception that you must have a card. You are required to have Proof of Competency.

If you hold any certificate on the List of Certificates of Competency, Training Certificates and other Equivalencies as Proof of Competency when Operating a Pleasure Craft, you already meet the requirements of the Competency of Operators of Pleasure Craft Regulations you just need to make sure you carry your certificate on board. Proof of certification may include original documentation or a copy of the certificate.



Tip: Certificates for boating safety courses completed before April 1, 1999 will be recognized. If you've already taken a course prior to these regulations - and have proof - then that course certificate or card will be accepted as proof of competency!

Hmmm, are they saying that after 44 days of being in their society one of the above proofs of compitancy are needed? Or is it that proof of comitancy is needed and after 44 days you need the operators card? If your state or country doesn't require an operator card I guess the whole thing doesn't apply anyway...or does it? Guess you could always leave and take your money elsewhere.
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Old 28-12-2010, 17:34   #36
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Read it slower. You'll get it.

If the idea of writing a very simple test and/or spending the $20-40 fee is a really big issue for you to be able to sail in our "society," then feel free to "take your money elsewhere" because the only conclusions i can draw is either
a) you fear you are such a poor sailor you will not be able to pass a simple competency test mastered by thousands of SeaRay owners, or
b) you haven't got $20-40. Or
c) You didn't read, understand, or qualify for the "other equivalencies," in which case you probably aren't welcome in any other country outside of the USA.
d) You simply like to complain.
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Old 28-12-2010, 17:42   #37
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I've recently been told the cards are not required for boats under ten HP. Any truth in that?
NEVER invite the mounties aboard. If you do, then they are allowed to go thru all your personal stuff. Refuse them permission to come aboard, and they have to get a search warrant to do so legally. Make sure they can see all the required safety gear without coming aboard.
I can show them all they need to see, without leaving or opening my wheelhouse.
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Old 28-12-2010, 18:03   #38
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Brent, there is no HP guideline for the PCOC, but a boat under 10 hp does not have to be registered in Canada. There is an age/hp restirction under the Boating Restrction Regulations but it has no impact on the requirement of an Operator's card, at least as i read the FAQs.
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Old 28-12-2010, 18:45   #39
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Read it slower. You'll get it.

If the idea of writing a very simple test and/or spending the $20-40 fee is a really big issue for you to be able to sail in our "society," then feel free to "take your money elsewhere" because the only conclusions i can draw is either
a) you fear you are such a poor sailor you will not be able to pass a simple competency test mastered by thousands of SeaRay owners, or
b) you haven't got $20-40. Or
c) You didn't read, understand, or qualify for the "other equivalencies," in which case you probably aren't welcome in any other country outside of the USA.
d) You simply like to complain.
Laugh a little. Don't you think it is silly that they are in fact saying that after being in the Canadian society for 44 days without a break you are no longer a safe boat operator without some form of card that says you are? You are fine for 44 days and in fact if you leave for an instance once every 44 days you are fine for ever but if you stay for 45 days you are no longer fine but potentially fined. What could the rule be about? Certainly not safety unless there is something inherantly unsafe about being in Canada for 45 consecutive days that will be cured by obtaining a card.. And futhermore it now appears that if your state or country don't require a card then you can forget the whole thing. Who's complaining? Just laughing.
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Old 29-12-2010, 15:20   #40
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They are saying that someone who arrives non stop, singlehanded, from Europe, Via Cape Horn, has not proven his competency as well as someone who has never set foot on a boat, but has completed a written test.
That's called "Bureaucrats intelligence."
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Old 29-12-2010, 15:26   #41
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They are saying that someone who arrives non stop, singlehanded, from Europe, Via Cape Horn, has not proven his competency as well as someone who has never set foot on a boat, but has completed a written test.
That's called "Bureaucrats intelligence."
That is somwhat of a quip, Brent, minimum qualifications like the The canadian one and the ICC in some EU countries are primarily aimed at a domestic audience. To ensure balance at a certain point a foreigner has to be subject to them, so there a simple line to be drawn.

Neither is comparing sailing the Horn in itself justification for giving someone a domestic competency cert. You are required to know and demonstate the knowledge required,( however simple or advanced) judging it on sea experience is a piece of string.

As the meerkats say simples...

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Old 02-01-2011, 17:26   #42
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You can blame the Sea-Doo crowd for this one.Or,rather,it gave the Powers-That-WannaBe the excuse.
The Nervously Inclined folk should note that using your DL not the best option as ID....because it may appear thinly-veiled as your card's number.

That all said,I needed a motivation to brush up on Buoys and Regs I never see in my puddle.
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Old 02-01-2011, 18:07   #43
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COOL, I have a power squadron certificate form 1967 Ive been meaning to copy, guess I'll just make 2 and keep one with the docs and passports. thanks
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Old 03-01-2011, 08:06   #44
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As a US Senior Citizen, I am exempt from needing a US operator's card. I also have the US Power Squadron Certificate from taking their class several decades ago.

Based on often spending more than 45 days in Canadian waters with a US flag on the stern, I am required to have a Canadian card. My solution was to get a copy of the Canadian booklet from the Canadian Power Squadron by mail, spending about an hour reading it, and then taking the Canadian test given by a local US Power Squadron. My Canadian Card arrived via mail.

Even with lots of decades of cruising experience, there are questions about trailer boats and pesonal watercraft (jet skis) that I would not have been able to answer without reading the booklet.

No one has ever asked me to show them my card, and I have never run a personal watercraft, but I am now ready for both. It was neither expensive or very time consuming. I hope that this information may help other US cruisers who go north.
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Old 03-01-2011, 14:31   #45
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The Canadian card really has nothing to do with competency.

It's a varying exam of T/F and multiple guess answers designed specifically to fill government coffers.

It's about knowing what buoy is what and what safety equipment to have on board. Not that this isn't important, but it is just rote memory. There are no minimum hours on the water with a licensed professional (like a drivers license or a USCG six-pack), it's just "can you answer these questions the way we want you to?"

There are no questions like, "You're in the Northern hemisphere and day anchored on the steep lee of an island when the wind backs 180 putting you on a lee shore. The wind pipes up from Force 2 to Force 5. You have a furling jib and a three reef main on a fractional sloop sailing vessel. No other sails are available to you. Your anchor starts to drag and your engine fails to start.

What is your sail configuration to beat off this shore and why?

With the wind backing and the appearance of jet stream cirrus clouds, what type of weather can you expect over the next 6-12 hours?"

It would be kind of cool if they did ask these type of questions though.
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