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Old 17-10-2013, 04:27   #286
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Re: Boarded by the Coast Guard..Terminated Voyage

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Originally Posted by skipmac View Post
Regarding foreign flagged vessels that would exempt from these rules, the local law enforcement agencies seem to be completely unaware of this issue. I have seen several reports and complaints of dinks from overseas cruisers getting stopped for not showing registration numbers, including MarkJ when he was in Key West.
Foreign flagged "Documented" vessels are exempt from State Registration for a certain time period... Not dinghies.

Some people falsely believe that dinghies are some how registered under the documentation of their sail or power boat. That is not true.

It is a Catch 22, but if a state requires registration, then you have to have it, even as a foreign flagged vessel.
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Old 17-10-2013, 06:32   #287
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Re: Boarded by the Coast Guard..Terminated Voyage

I am a retired merchant seaman worked on ships with NOAA....did all the drills. every week .so I know all about safety on a ship.....it is drill in my head...most people that I see in the water on boats take safety not so. a lot of them get in real trouble when **** hits the fan....so when I had my boat inspected by the c.g..they didn't say anything because I had all of the above...2 gumby suites...1 epire....I 6 man ocean raft...1 radio..6 lift vest..wear them on boat...that is me...and every thing I could think of about safety....better to be prepard than not...that is my thoughts on the matter...my spelling is not that good.....sorry can't spell.....I have no engine so I have 4 fire ex...on hand..just in case..fire breaks out...have out board ....just be safe when out on water..bullshit with them about stuff . we jused to deal with gov all the time..abs..they ding you on **** that is stupid...but they have a job to do...the c.g. is the same way...they are very young kids....trying to impress the capt. on the boat....say thank you and be on your way....that all she wrote?
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Old 17-10-2013, 06:44   #288
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Re: Boarded by the Coast Guard..Terminated Voyage

I don't think that with cruisers that the issue is not having equipment on board, but that it goes past expiry date without being noticed. I've got my "gumby" suit aboard as well and more than sufficient flares and extinguishers and med kit, but I am not as diligent as I should be in checking use-by dates on the meds or on the extinguishers.
Last year in St. Martin the Dutch side coast guard was on the lookout for money and was boarding the boat on the Dutch side of the lagoon and no matter how diligent the captain was they always managed to find something.
For example, the rubberized flexible tubing for propane lines (usually just the connection from boat to gimballed stove) has a restricted lifetime - but only on U.K. flagged boats; U.S. boats have no such problem with the same tubing. This is just an example of things that few sailors would think about replacing. I found out when I sold the previous boat and the surveyor put it on the "critical" list.
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Old 17-10-2013, 10:44   #289
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Re: Boarded by the Coast Guard..Terminated Voyage

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Originally Posted by estarzinger View Post
^^

Just to be more specific ..... Your text does not say "you need to notify when you have moved to a new CBP jurisdiction, but only then". That is what you are suggesting is they rule, and what I was asking for evidence if.

My text, which is on the CBP site FAQs say essentially "notify whenever you move." With no qualification about changing CBP zones.
I checked with the foreign boat I'm familiar with. I was wrong, you are correct. Even with a cruising license, the rule is to call the number and report each time the vessel is repositioned (but not a day sail back to the same location). Hence, you give them a slip number, they want to know if you move to a different slip.
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Old 17-10-2013, 12:53   #290
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Re: Boarded by the Coast Guard..Terminated Voyage

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ghostrider-
The boarding you describe would be against the USCG's own published standards, and it endangers their personnel. Unless they had a good reason for running black, they are supposed to identify themselves by shining a light on their "stripe", on the ensign, and turn on various lights along with hailing the vessel they are closing on.
You would be doing them and us all a favor by sending in a formal protest to the District Commander in charge of that area, and the USCG Commandant's office, and probably CCing a copy to your own MP and Secretary of State or Admiralty. One good letter passed around to the usual suspects, and someone often gets a disciplinary note in their file. And, the outright dangerous behavior may get changed.
Since this happened a while back - we were happy to still be breathing. They operate in the black down there alot. I understand they are looking for smugglers - they're just not going to find them on a 50ft cat.

FL registration for more than 90 days visitation is baloney. Go to the Bahamas for a couple of days (keep the fuel receipts) and return for another 90 days. First it's not about safety but MONEY. Technically if you have a documented/foreign flagged vessel or out of state registered vessel you are a visitor until you get a job.

My wife was told by FWC on her delivery run (34' PDQ) from the Bahamas - the vessel needed to pay taxes and be registered before entering the St Johns. Instructed to use the quarantine dock - she waited until they went off shift and proceeded into the river and delivered the vessel. The new owners then went about to register the vessel and nothing was said about taxes.

I swear it's easier to do business in any state exc Florida.
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Old 17-10-2013, 13:33   #291
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Re: Boarded by the Coast Guard..Terminated Voyage

A lot of "law" enforcement varies with the place and time. And of course, who got up on the wrong side of the bed. For every hardass who has tried to be overzealous, I've also met someone who cut me some slack and was simply reasonable. It is not an easy job, being either an LEO *or* a civilian these days. Best thing you can do, is know the rules, hold 'em to the rules, and try to make them smile, because "have a nice day" is something no one ever really gets enough of. The experience--not the greeting.

I have yet to meet a border guard who didn't smile and waive me on through when he asked "Purpose of your visit?" And I said with a straight face "Invasion and conquest, but if you'll just line up all the women and gold and cattle so I can pick them up on the way out, we can skip all the messy plundering and looting and burning part."

Funny thing though, the women and gold and cattle are never there when I'm on the way out. They cheat me every time!
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Old 17-10-2013, 16:45   #292
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Re: Boarded by the Coast Guard..Terminated Voyage

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Since this happened a while back - we were happy to still be breathing. They operate in the black down there alot. I understand they are looking for smugglers - they're just not going to find them on a 50ft cat.
Not uncommon to see the CG and other agencies running around south FL with no lights. I was stopped by Customs in the ICW in Ft Lauderdale and they were totally blacked out.


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Originally Posted by ghostrider View Post
FL registration for more than 90 days visitation is baloney. Go to the Bahamas for a couple of days (keep the fuel receipts) and return for another 90 days. First it's not about safety but MONEY. Technically if you have a documented/foreign flagged vessel or out of state registered vessel you are a visitor until you get a job.
Fee for over 30' boat to clear into the Bahamas, $300. One year registration fee for a boat in FL, about half that.

Foreign flagged as far as I know are exempt. Any US owned boat every state on the east coast I know has the same rules. Stay there more than 90 days you have to register your boat. 100% confirmed that in FL and RI as I have dual residence.

Same rule applies to driving. "Visit" the state more than 90 days you're supposed to get a local license. Again, not just FL.
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Old 17-10-2013, 18:18   #293
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Re: Boarded by the Coast Guard..Terminated Voyage

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Originally Posted by skipmac View Post
Same rule applies to driving. "Visit" the state more than 90 days you're supposed to get a local license. Again, not just FL.
This is not true in Florida. You are not required to register your car there unless you become a resident. Some things automatically make you a resident, such as taking a job or putting your kids in school, but as long as you don't do those things you can stay in florida as long as you like without registering your car or getting a Fl drivers license. You can do the same with an RV, but you cannot do it with a boat. IMO discrimination pure and simple.

This is not true insome other states. In NC for instance if you keep a car in the state for 183 days a year you are supposed to register it in NC. You do not however need to get an NC drivers license unless you become a resident. I have no information on other states
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Old 17-10-2013, 21:23   #294
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Re: Boarded by the Coast Guard..Terminated Voyage

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Not uncommon to see the CG and other agencies running around south FL with no lights. I was stopped by Customs in the ICW in Ft Lauderdale and they were totally blacked out.




Fee for over 30' boat to clear into the Bahamas, $300. One year registration fee for a boat in FL, about half that.

Foreign flagged as far as I know are exempt. Any US owned boat every state on the east coast I know has the same rules. Stay there more than 90 days you have to register your boat. 100% confirmed that in FL and RI as I have dual residence.

Same rule applies to driving. "Visit" the state more than 90 days you're supposed to get a local license. Again, not just FL.
We (me Brit and her American) arrived in Florida April 2012, both with UK Drivers licenses. We were told we both needed to take a Florida driving test to obtain our licenses, me because I had never held a US license and my wife because her last one, issued in Indiana and long expired after 25 years living in the UK, had vanished from the computer system. We were able to buy, register and insure two vehicles, registered to our cruising address at St Brendan's Isle and did not obtain our required Florida driver licenses until May 2013. Prior to that I was pulled over once for a minor driving infraction (when I pulled out of a side road and got honked at by a speeding truck that had to brake for me that had a police car right up behind it and that they chose not to stop ) and they accepted my UK license but were a bit miffed " they could not even run it", oh dear,what a shame I thought, but there was no animosity nor any instruction to "Go get a FL license" or you will be in trouble". We in fact got FL licenses mainly to drop our insurance premiums a promise from our insurers that they broke (and therefore just lost our renewal business to a competitor who basically halved our total premium over a year ) Still my license has proved a useful photo ID to present in the store when I buy some non-alcohol beers and wines.

Quite why we were required to pass a FL driver test I know not, because their test would be passable by a dyslexic two year old, the practical part was not even on the roads, but in an enclosed marked out parking lot. and the local licensed drivers here IMO rate as the worst in the world, so not a high standard to meet. But hey we live here and want to conform and comply with regulations both ashore and afloat.
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Old 18-10-2013, 06:20   #295
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Re: Boarded by the Coast Guard..Terminated Voyage

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This is not true in Florida. You are not required to register your car there unless you become a resident. Some things automatically make you a resident, such as taking a job or putting your kids in school, but as long as you don't do those things you can stay in florida as long as you like without registering your car or getting a Fl drivers license. You can do the same with an RV, but you cannot do it with a boat. IMO discrimination pure and simple.

This is not true insome other states. In NC for instance if you keep a car in the state for 183 days a year you are supposed to register it in NC. You do not however need to get an NC drivers license unless you become a resident. I have no information on other states
I had based my 90s on old information that was given out in orientation for new students at UF, which was a few years ago. Checked FL DMV and seems like their latest rules are in between our two opinions. Following quote from DMV website.

You must get a Florida license within 30 days of becoming a resident. You are considered a resident of Florida if you:
1. Enroll your children in public school, or
2. Register to vote, or
3. File for a homestead exemption, or
4. Accept employment, or
5. Reside in Florida for more than six consecutive months.


From this it seems that they will consider you a resident for purposes of a drivers license after six months regardless. Boat registration is 90 days so yes, that looks like discrimination against boaters to me as well.
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Old 18-10-2013, 07:14   #296
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Re: Boarded by the Coast Guard..Terminated Voyage

I know this post is very old, but we too were boarded in South Carolina. They also asked us about guns onboard. I brought it out while they were doing there inspection. The Coasties that board us were "all business" until after the inspections. I believe they were training a couple of new guys. It was also our first trip on Millie C Moore. We did do the CG Aux. inspection. As we were new to the game and wanted to be safe. We do it everytime it expires. It also helps us keep up with all the new stuff that is required to meet all the regs. Since, this reply is a couple years later, I hope your experiences with the Coasties have been on a better note... happy sailing
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Old 18-10-2013, 08:15   #297
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Re: Boarded by the Coast Guard..Terminated Voyage

Are you from the future? This thread is only 2 weeks old, not 2 years.

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Old 18-10-2013, 08:46   #298
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Re: Boarded by the Coast Guard..Terminated Voyage

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Are you from the future? This thread is only 2 weeks old, not 2 years.

Mark
It just feels like two years Mark!

On a side note, not sure how many of you guys are following my other thread, "Sunk At The Dock". The boat tried to leave to go to Florida yesterday with no life jackets, no nav lights, no horn or whistle, no fire extinguishers and really no safety equipment at all. And the captain asked which side the reds should be on on the way down..Makes you wonder how the Coasties missed a 65 foot Viking coming from New Jersey with nine plastic 55 gallon drums of fuel on the fish deck. Maybe because the blue drums had red painted stripe around them it was ok..
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Old 18-10-2013, 09:00   #299
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Re: Boarded by the Coast Guard..Terminated Voyage

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Originally Posted by skipmac View Post
I had based my 90s on old information that was given out in orientation for new students at UF, which was a few years ago. Checked FL DMV and seems like their latest rules are in between our two opinions. Following quote from DMV website.

You must get a Florida license within 30 days of becoming a resident. You are considered a resident of Florida if you:
1. Enroll your children in public school, or
2. Register to vote, or
3. File for a homestead exemption, or
4. Accept employment, or
5. Reside in Florida for more than six consecutive months.

From this it seems that they will consider you a resident for purposes of a drivers license after six months regardless. Boat registration is 90 days so yes, that looks like discrimination against boaters to me as well.
I guess we were considered 'residents' since we had established a Florida mailing address a year before we arrived because without a US address we could not US Document/register the boat we had bought to be our liveaboard home as we actually bought it about 10 months prior to our physically moving from England We also had to have a valid US address in order to get insurance cover on that boat, because without a US zip code they didn't want to know. so technically we became legally 'Florida residents' whilst still living n England and with me still try going through the process via with US Immigration (via the US Embassy in London) of getting my green card to be able to make the move, even though I was married to a US citizen and for 25 years. My lovely wife had even registered to vote when we set up the FL address so thrrefore doubly counting as resident. We subsequently met many people here on out of state licenses and who told us they too didn't get their Fl ones for many months, so it seems that in practice nobody bothrers much about doing it within 30 days as the rules say. They use the same' ignore it' type philosophy about running read lights, speeding and using cellphones whilst driving so it seems that with a vehicle pretty much anything goes but not so with a boat. we were advised by our insurance agent to make sure we obtained really good insurance cover on our cars because there are so many people driving around FL who are uninsured and even many having no license (illegal immigrants).
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Old 18-10-2013, 18:00   #300
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Re: Boarded by the Coast Guard..Terminated Voyage

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Originally Posted by Sid at SailAway View Post
It just feels like two years Mark!

On a side note, not sure how many of you guys are following my other thread, "Sunk At The Dock". The boat tried to leave to go to Florida yesterday with no life jackets, no nav lights, no horn or whistle, no fire extinguishers and really no safety equipment at all. And the captain asked which side the reds should be on on the way down..Makes you wonder how the Coasties missed a 65 foot Viking coming from New Jersey with nine plastic 55 gallon drums of fuel on the fish deck. Maybe because the blue drums had red painted stripe around them it was ok..


To inject a bit of controversy, maybe Captain Dozy was not from the USA and was used to the international buoyage in the rest of the world which has red port hand marks left to port as you enter a channel the way the incoming tide or current would go As a Brit I have to think constantly about this in the ICW and when we had a trawler I even stuck some colored shapes by the wheel on the flybridge as a reminder to myself. Going between a port and a starboard mark in a channel is obvious, passing a lone marker of whatever flavor takes some thought ,as an instant instinctive move by someone used to the international system could lead to embarassing errors!
As to the other points, lifejackets, horn, whistles,etc., none of those would actually prevent an incident from ocurring although they could be useful if one did. SAfety is first and foremost of a sate of mind IMO not something that you can go out and buy at a discount from West Marine or Walmart.
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