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Old 10-11-2008, 17:08   #16
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Anchors are not moorings

Am I 'off' on my thinking here? An anchor is not a mooring. Moorings are relatively permenant and anchors can be hauled aboard when its time to go. I would think that law is made to keep someone from coming out and just randomly dropping a 500lb mushroom.
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Old 10-11-2008, 17:48   #17
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You don't need a lawyer. A couple of passes at dictionaries (and there's probably a definitions section in the AL code which supercedes those) will tell you that a vessel may be "moored" to a mooring, or to a bollard at a dock, or to an anchor.

And some basic history will teach you that everything belonged to the sovereign, including the land and submerged land, and that "we the people" (who are not "the state") have no rights to any lands unless they were given to us.

Find out who Alabama was stolen or bought from, and find out the terms of the land transfer, and you'll probably find the submerged lands are property of the state under the terms of your state constitution or some similarly subversive and discreditable document.

Law says: The ignorant pay the fines.

Sounds like your situation is fully in line with all state and federal codes regarding anchoring, navigation, and land ownership, and there's nothing unreasonable OR unusual about them.

You can't park your car on the town green all summer just because your garage is full. Same thing here, you can't park your boat on the town bottomland just because you don't want to pay for a storm storage. Same same, in every way.

Hurricane warning? Fine, anchor it there, keep onboard in order to maintain a proper watch, and then move it as soon as the storm passes. That's still illegal--but the marine police might see it as "reasonable" to wait out the strom there and give you THAT much of a break.
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Old 10-11-2008, 18:06   #18
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So.......it's illegal to anchor in Alabama? Or ride out a cat 5 hurricane on board?
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Old 10-11-2008, 18:20   #19
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Originally Posted by capn-d View Post
So.......it's illegal to anchor in Alabama? Or ride out a cat 5 hurricane on board?
No, what it says is long term is prohibited. It specifically says
"beyond any immediate
water transit needs necessitating a temporary cessation in such
transit
"
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Old 10-11-2008, 19:39   #20
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Regarding anchoring in Florida; Read this: Florida state's proposal: http://www.floridaconservation.org/boating/Docs/Boating2009.pdf

According to this document the State of Florida is drafting a law which will allow counties to pass an ordinance that will fine you $50 for anchoring your boat in that county for more than 30 days consecutively or 120 days non-consecutively regardless of whether you move your boat in that county during the 30 days. See line 472 in the Boating2009.pdf document. Their argument is that they want to make anchoring law uniform throughout the state prevent local governments from passing laws which make it a crime to anchor longer than their specified time period.

This law isn't fair to residents who want to moor their boat in front of their property rather than putting it in a marina where it is prohibitively expensive. Also, Florida marinas are being sold to condos; therefore, there are fewer slips available while the boats that were formerly in those marinas are forced out with no where to go.
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Old 10-11-2008, 19:54   #21
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"So.......it's illegal to anchor in Alabama?"
No, but if you can draw that conclusion from what I said, you'd better spend an hour or two consulting with an Alabama Admiralty attorney before trying to secure a boat in that state. Rights of passage (not to be confused with rites of passage) and rights of navigation have nothing to do with mooring or anchoring rights.

Whether the laws are legal or illegal, they're usually pretty clear. IF you learn what the terms mean. That's the difference between passsengers, crew, captains, and masters: The learning curve. If you intend to be captain and master--you've got to do your homework.
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Old 10-11-2008, 23:30   #22
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Like Florida how? By Florida state law, anchoring is allowed pretty much anywhere. The beaches and coastal waters are all public. If a municipality attempts to limit anchoring, they are in violation of state law. If you get cited in Florida, take it to court and you'll win.
The POLICE don't CARE if they are VIOLATING state or federal law. They DON'T GIVE A RAT'S REAR! Sure, take it to court if your rich, and eventually win, after months of time and aggrevation. In the meantime the LOCAL Police have confiscated your boat, arrested you, and made your life a living hell. Is it a violation of your rights? HELL YES! Do the PIGS care? HELL NO! Just ask the Daytona Shores Pigs about how they treat boaters anchored in the ICW more than three days. Just go ahead, ask them. Why don't YOU anchor there and make sure they know? Maybe YOU can beat them in court. I'll root for you all the way.

Perhaps if a cop takes an oath to uphold and defend the constitution, and then tramples on individual rights, gleefully I might add, they should swing for treason.

Do you want to know how I really feel about the Daytona Police?
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Old 11-11-2008, 05:57   #23
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I can appreciate the principle of not anchoring on the "King's bottom", however the wording of the "rule" is arbitrary and capricious. There are no specifics as to what "immediate water transit" or "temporary cessation" actually mean. Anyone with a badge can assign a numeric for "immediate" or "temporary" and arrest you for dropping your anchor overnite in some pristine creek. Then there is the principle of "riparian rights". Then there is the fact that this "rule" is not published, propagated or codified. It's a secret rule which can be applied as required but not uniformly enforced. I'm just pissed.
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Old 11-11-2008, 06:46   #24
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I question authority all the time. I do think using the term PIGS is pretty derogatory. There's good & bad in all facets of life. Just like there are some rotten apples in the boating community too.

When I first arrived in Daytona from the Caribbean. I didn't know the laws here, I was stopped by the water police a couple of times, and met nothing but employees following policy. Now & then you will run into the power trip fella, but that's in all of life.....i2f
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Old 11-11-2008, 07:25   #25
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capn, I highly doubt arrest is part of the regulation unless YOU escalate the situation by refusing to move and then the law is stated for other situations than anchoring. Most likely a citation and fine but i doubt arrest. If you don't like the law do something to change it. As a citizen of the state go to your legislatures and get the regulations changed. Get other boaters and folks in the marine industry involved. Otherwise you need to live with it or move to a boater friendly state, although they are getting harder and harder to find.
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Old 11-11-2008, 07:28   #26
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capn, you'd have a hard time arguing that "immediate transit" and "temporary cessation" have no meanings. Federal and state laws allow for "transit" and generally agree that there are valid reasons to stop, like throwing a prop shaft, or exhaustion after severe rx. Temporary as opposed to indefinite is also a no-show, I doubt you'd get osmething this clearly phrased to be thrown out as "arbitrary and capricious" since it is reasonably clear as to being the least time necessary.

Riparian rights are for riparian (adjacent land) owners, some sailor who wants to park his boat somewhere doesn't benefit from them. Unless, he contracts with the land owner to use that owner's dock, etc. And there's your solution: Rent a dock.

But you can't just park it on the town common. Heck, in most places you can't even park a car on the street for more than 24 hours without moving it. Laws got made by the folks that live there.
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Old 11-11-2008, 09:20   #27
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I DO rent a dock, but I can't stay there during hurricane season. I pay slip fees for three months with no use of the slip nor "riparian rights". I think it's unfair.
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Old 11-11-2008, 10:45   #28
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This being the tail-end of hurricane season I was going to move it about 1November, but that is apparently not soon enough for the enforcers.
So did you move?
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Old 11-11-2008, 11:37   #29
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Yep, I moved to Pensacola to do a bottom job. I'll go back to to my slip next week.
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Old 26-11-2008, 09:11   #30
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The bottom doesn't belong to the state, it belongs to you, us... WE ARE the state.
State coastal law is interesting stuff. One of my required classes in college was "Coastal Zone Management" which partially involved studying a series of court cases pertaining to coastal laws, and the resulting interpretations of the laws.

During one of our lessons, we actually watched a segment of TV Nation Volume 2, produced by Michael Moore. In the episode, Janeane Garafolo decides to challenge the citizens of Greenwich, CT on their claim that they own Greenwich Beach, and require town citizenship to access the beach:

Adventures in a TV Nation, Vol. 2, Michael Moore, Audio Book - Barnes & Noble

After a failed attempt at bringing a large bus full of non-Greenwich people onto the beach over land (they are turned around at the gate), they attempt to take the beach by water. Janeane, and the army of people, row boats to the shore.

During their approach to the beach, the Coast Guard boxes them in using boats from the seaward side, and the local police arrest them while still in the water just before they walk ashore.

The arrest was appealed to a higher court, and it turned out it was illegal for the police to arrest them while still in the water, because below the high tide line in Connecticut is public property. Also, the town was wrong in claiming the beach is theirs. According to Connecticut law, any resident of Connecticut can access Greenwich Beach, not just town residents.

This was just one of countless examples I learned of people abusing coastal law to fit their (usually wealth induced) desires.
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