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Old 12-01-2010, 11:24   #76
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Thanks for the Links David.
Now I didn't look too hard, but I'm sure if I had, I would have found that these guys sell drugs also.
Look at their prices! I guess the cost of the investment in their graphics/web site is driving their prices up.

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Old 12-01-2010, 12:50   #77
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Its probably the difference between commercial grade dayshapes and yachtie dayshapes (Plastimo). Vessels over 20 meters must display dayshapes that are no less than 0.6 meters. They also must be more rugged since they are used more frequently.

Under 20 meters dayshapes must be "proportional" to the size of the vessel.

For a yacht I would buy the Plastimo ones or make some that collapse out of black ABS plastic.

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Old 12-01-2010, 13:04   #78
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Its probably the difference between commercial grade dayshapes and yachtie dayshapes (Plastimo). Vessels over 20 meters must display dayshapes that are no less than 0.6 meters. They also must be more rugged since they are used more frequently.

Under 20 meters dayshapes must be "proportional" to the size of the vessel.

For a yacht I would buy the Plastimo ones or make some that collapse out of black ABS plastic.

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Yes, your probably right .....
That along with the crack down on the Drug Trade

Can you give anymore definition to "proportional"?

Thanks,
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Old 12-01-2010, 13:15   #79
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I was going through lockers after we bought the new boat and found this black fabric cone. Scratched my head for a moment then realized what it was. It has a metal ring on the large end and a metal d-ring at the small.

Haven't used it yet though. Generally speaking when the motor is running the sails are down or being struck. We don't motor sail much.
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Old 13-02-2010, 11:33   #80
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In France, the cone and the ball have been mandatory on yachts for a long time, until there was a big change in the regulations. Then, I got one of each when I bought my boat pre-owned.

When motorsailing, many yachts abstain from displaying the cone, considering that furling or dousing the genoa is enough. I have been told that the Belgian Coast Guards are more severe than the French and many boats have been heavily fined up north. When teaching, I often display the cone, just to remind the trainees of the ColRegs. But when motorsailing with main and genoa up, the cone is not visible on both sides.

When anchoring during the day, I take care to display the ball, because I know how disturbing it is for other skippers to see a yacht yawing close to a channel.

Alain
We do use the ball and the cone, everytime it is requested by the regulation...but we are kind of exception in France, where the use of these signal is not very well apply by leisure boat, usually (to not say never...).

As said by Alain previously, we also noted that in Belgium, the motoring sailboats are always using the cone while entering or leaving the harbour with their engine.

We noted alson that the fishermen where always having their visual signal for "under fishing" raised on the boat even if they were not fishing at all !

Although the regulation is the same everywhere in the world normally.
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Old 13-02-2010, 15:55   #81
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G'Day all,

Haven't seen many responses re the South Pacific area, so here's our experience for the past 20 years in this area:

Anchor balls -- very few yachts display them. Those that do are often from European origins. More often seen on larger yachts and those with professional crew.

Motoring cones: Never yet seen in use.

Personal view: No problem with the anchoring ball... easy to do, potentially useful to other vessels. But the cone... seems (realistically) to be awkward, with the need to raise and lower it repeatedly in some scenarios, and in fact to be difficult for others to see behind foresails whilst motorsailing. Without getting into either moral or legal arguments about this practice, it is difficult to see that not displaying the cone will lead to collisions. Seems that the most likey result is simply that an actually privileged vessel will have to give way to what should be a burdened vessel. BFD.

And back to the use of "garden lights" as anchor lights... it is a very common practice around Australia these days, and is something to be discouraged. They are not just illegal, they are essentially useless.

Another pet peeve: vessels that display "diver down" and "engaged in fishing" signals 24/7 as they move about or lie at their moorings, and then expect them to be honored in use. Grrr!

Off the soapbox now, so

Cheers,

Jim and Ann s/v Insatiable II lying Broken Bay, NSW, Oz
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Old 16-02-2010, 20:47   #82
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I had balls once, but after being married for 25 years.....
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Old 27-03-2010, 14:34   #83
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may be of some use to some one.
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Old 27-03-2010, 15:11   #84
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Old 27-03-2010, 15:14   #85
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Jim,
Many people, including Latitude 38, will disagree with your discouragement of "garden lights" to SUPPLEMENT not replace regulation anchor lights.

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Originally Posted by Jim Cate View Post
And back to the use of "garden lights" as anchor lights... it is a very common practice around Australia these days, and is something to be discouraged. They are not just illegal, they are essentially useless.
Anchor lights at the masthead of a saiboat are not easy for small boats going fast through anchorages to see. We position a rechargable garden light at each corner of our catamaran when anchored near a channel or where small boat traffic is heavy in addition to burning the anchor light, making us much more visible.

Maybe we are saying the same thing about using them instead of anchor lights, though.
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Old 27-03-2010, 15:34   #86
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Old 27-03-2010, 16:39   #87
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Jim,
Many people, including Latitude 38, will disagree with your discouragement of "garden lights" to SUPPLEMENT not replace regulation anchor lights.



Anchor lights at the masthead of a saiboat are not easy for small boats going fast through anchorages to see. We position a rechargable garden light at each corner of our catamaran when anchored near a channel or where small boat traffic is heavy in addition to burning the anchor light, making us much more visible.

Maybe we are saying the same thing about using them instead of anchor lights, though.
G'Day mate,

I'll stand by my personal observations, even if they disagree with Lat 38! We do lots of night sailing and have all too often come into anchorages where many boats rely solely on the garden lights. Many of them are simply invisible, especially if accompanied with background shore lights. While some of the better examples are reasonably bright in the early evening, by the wee small hours their brilliance has diminished and they fade away. Few of their proponants have botherd to get into their dinghies at 0400 and gone off to check them out!

I have no problem with their use to supplement proper anchor lights, and I agree that masthead lights are not always the best answer in crowded anchorages. We now use a VERY bright LED light (Bebi lights from Fiji) hung about 10 feet above the w/l, often in combination with a masthead light. The LED light has a built-in light sensor which switches it off and on more reliably than I do, and at about 45 bucks USD, not that much more expensive than the garden lights.

Cheers,

Jim and Ann s/v Insatiable II lying Coasters Retreat, NSW, Oz
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Old 27-03-2010, 18:49   #88
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Don't see them on recreational vessels down here either!G'day
Saw anchor balls twice lastw week on recreational boats in Bum's Bay on the Gold Coast (an Aussie Lagoon cat & US mono) maybe ex navy
I want some balls
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Old 27-03-2010, 18:55   #89
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We've got a ball and an inverted cone. We use the ball when anchored most of the times. But we also always wear our life jackets out of the harbor or at night, so we're kind of safety dorks.
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Old 27-03-2010, 19:51   #90
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I seem to be the only person dumb enough to be anchored in this small exposed cove. The wind has piped up. Currenly I'm all out of balls. Let out a good deal of chain and 2 snubbers are hooked in. Tomorrow I'm buying some more balls and I think I'll hang them from a halyard. If anyone is coming up the rhode river that 44' sailboat with the anchor light on the only one here. im close up on the shore. The one that's not moving but doesn't have any balls well I'm anchored. If you need me tie a ball to a halyard to convince you I can't all the balls have been used.
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