All about the Colregs no 3 - single handed sailing and keeping a look out

[boatman61]

If you think your lights or radar reflector are gonna be spotted by a ship in anything over a 3 metre sea think again..
I was headed for Portugal in my Corribee and got to just N of Ushant where I spent 3 days and 2 nights tacking against a SW wind waiting for it to change so I could get round the corner..
Around 2 am of the 3rd night I spotted a small freighter headed straight for me on the inshore route.. I called him up and asked if he'd seen me.. he had not

He did not see my lights till about 500 metres off my beam in spite of having told him my GPS position.. I did not show against all the clutter on his radar..
It had been a steady F6 for the the time I'd been hanging out there waiting for things to go my way.. and the tides are strong causing confused seas in that area.
But.. keep on dreaming lads of it makes you feel better..

[CSY Man]

. But considering the alternative there's a better chance a single hander seeing the last flare when he is on the ocean than being a landlubber becouse he's not allowed to sail alone..

Wow, that is new one and it sure justifies sleeping while you should be on watch...

[Exile]

Originally Posted by Wrong

Running lights typically have a red and green light. Red denoting port side. Green denoting starboard side. The running lights I mentioned are at the mast head. Masthead running lights. If you go shopping for a masthead running light it will probably be referred to as a tri-colour. The third colour is white and is the stern light. Why nit-pick? If I'd meant a steaming light I'd a said so...

For sure my old incadescent anchor light was very bright. The l.e.d. anchor light isn't nearly as bright. But generally speaking you're going to have to be nearer to see the red/green colours. Still, having been in a crossing pattern with another sailboat more than once - seeing a green and red, one or the other informs me of what action to take. A single white light tells me no such thing. And I want an approaching vessel when I am hove-to to have the same information...

Just some confusion on my part from reading your last post on this. Not trying to nit-pick. On the contrary, comments & advice from people who have sailed solo around the world get my full attention and I just wanted to be sure I understood.

[FamilyVan]

Originally Posted by boatman61

If you think your lights or radar reflector are gonna be spotted by a ship in anything over a 3 metre sea think again..
I was headed for Portugal in my Corribee and got to just N of Ushant where I spent 3 days and 2 nights tacking against a SW wind waiting for it to change so I could get round the corner..
Around 2 am of the 3rd night I spotted a small freighter headed straight for me on the inshore route.. I called him up and asked if he'd seen me.. he had not

He did not see my lights till about 500 metres off my beam in spite of having told him my GPS position.. I did not show against all the clutter on his radar..
It had been a steady F6 for the the time I'd been hanging out there waiting for things to go my way.. and the tides are strong causing confused seas in that area.
But.. keep on dreaming lads of it makes you feel better..

I so agree with this comment. That's why I thought the small wooden boat comments were, well, not that well thought out. It's hard enough to see another ships lights in rough conditions.

I was once on a SAR call for a boy in a disabled 15 foot aluminum boat. Me and three other seamen searched for him from just after dusk til just after dawn. We had state of the art equipment, RADAR, Gen 2 nightvision goggles and FLIR. A Hercules spotted him (cold but otherwise fine) shortly after dawn, because in the absence of dark there's light.

When we picked the boy up the next morning he reported wed been within several hundred metres of him several times- which stood to reason as our lines were so tight.

Sea state was maybe 1-1.5 metres.

Sent from my SGH-I547C using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

[Wrong]

Unless sunlight is reflecting off the sails a small boat on the big ocean it will be pretty hard to see. I've strained to see another sailboat I knew was there, just ahead, behind or abeam. Same thing goes for boats with masthead running lights. You've got to strain to find them and most often cannot. So, at best wearing lights MAY alert others to your presence. In truth, probably not.

But, while it was uncomfortably close, I've been alerted to the presence of a properly lit sailboat sailboat many times.

[TeddyDiver]

Originally Posted by CSY Man

Wow, that is new one and it sure justifies sleeping while you should be on watch...

Nope, but it's a counter argument for your argument, you know silly question silly answer

[Exile]

Originally Posted by boatman61

If you think your lights or radar reflector are gonna be spotted by a ship in anything over a 3 metre sea think again..
I was headed for Portugal in my Corribee and got to just N of Ushant where I spent 3 days and 2 nights tacking against a SW wind waiting for it to change so I could get round the corner..
Around 2 am of the 3rd night I spotted a small freighter headed straight for me on the inshore route.. I called him up and asked if he'd seen me.. he had not

He did not see my lights till about 500 metres off my beam in spite of having told him my GPS position.. I did not show against all the clutter on his radar..
It had been a steady F6 for the the time I'd been hanging out there waiting for things to go my way.. and the tides are strong causing confused seas in that area.
But.. keep on dreaming lads of it makes you feel better..

This is consistent with the few times I've called up ships on nighttime passages to try & insure that they've seen my lights. More often than not the answer is negative, and it's usually been in conditions more benign than what Boaty described.

Although I would defer to those with more sea miles than me, I'm inclined to agree with Boaty that a debate whether to burn NUC lights, an anchor light, or some other combo -- in addition to burning the required running or masthead lights -- is rather specious. Seems to me that the emphasis should be on making your boat as visible as possible should circumstances warrant (e.g. when hove-to & asleep), and not on what may be technically "legal." If a white light is more visible than red, then probably spreader lights, deck floods, or illuminating one of the sails with a spotlight is the way to go.

[weavis]

Anti Single handing people:

I have a suggestion for you.

Concentrate on your own sailing efforts to improve your skills.

Single handing is not illegal and as such Im tiring of this harassment for that is what it is becoming.

Your opinions are duly noted.

Sheesh! Whatever it is that is eating you, it must be suffering horribly.

[Exile]

Originally Posted by weavis

Sheesh! Whatever it is that is eating you, it must be suffering horribly.

No doubt another lesson you've learned from that dang cat!

[MarkJ]

Originally Posted by weavis

Anti Single handing people:

I have a suggestion for you.

Concentrate on your own sailing efforts to improve your skills.

Single handing is not illegal and as such Im tiring of this harassment for that is what it is becoming.

Your opinions are duly noted.

Sheesh! Whatever it is that is eating you, it must be suffering horribly.

I agree.

[weavis]

Originally Posted by Exile

No doubt another lesson you've learned from that dang cat!

I have deep respect for people opinions. I might think that they are *****-but I respect the right to them.

Life will teach you that if it isnt illegal, move on. Sort it out in the courts but dont harass....... there are many things I think are dumb and dangerous but single handing is not one of them. Its a calculated judgement call. Someone else has the right to disagree. But after stating their opinion, they should never miss a good chance to shut up.

[Exile]

Originally Posted by weavis

I have deep respect for people opinions. I might think that they are *****-but I respect the right to them.

Life will teach you that if it isnt illegal, move on. Sort it out in the courts but dont harass....... there are many things I think are dumb and dangerous but single handing is not one of them. Its a calculated judgement call. Someone else has the right to disagree. But after stating their opinion,they should never miss a good chance to shut up.

Not only not illegal, but none of the anti-crowd have yet to come up with any credible negative impacts on other vessels. Just theoretical possibilities that have never occurred or are highly improbable, and many of those could and do equally befall those with crew.

May also be worth noting that, at the time the Colregs were adopted, recreational vessels had no AIS to transmit, no way to receive it (AFAIK), and I bet few had radar. So given today's access to readily available and reasonably affordable collision avoidance systems for recreational vessels, it puts the oft-repeated Rule 5 requirement of maintaining a look-out by sight & hearing at all times in a different context.

[weavis]

Originally Posted by Exile

Not only not illegal, but none of the anti-crowd have yet to come up with any credible negative impacts on other vessels. Just theoretical possibilities that have never occurred or are highly improbable, and many of those could and do equally befall those with crew.

May also be worth noting that, at the time the Colregs were adopted, recreational vessels had no AIS to transmit, no way to receive it (AFAIK), and I bet few had radar. So given today's access to readily available and reasonably affordable collision avoidance systems for recreational vessels, it puts the oft-repeated Rule 5 requirement of maintaining a look-out by sight & hearing at all times in a different context.

Please! STOP being so danged logical.

Anyways, tomorrow, weather dependent, I will be single handing down the Bristol Channel just as alone as I can be. I may be some time. I might return early, I might not.

And I dont give a fig!

[Exile]

Originally Posted by weavis

Please! STOP being so danged logical.

Anyways, tomorrow, weather dependent, I will be single handing down the Bristol Channel just as alone as I can be. I may be some time. I might return early, I might not.

And I dont give a fig!

It sounds like the approval of those two cats is all the legality you'll need!

Good travels, Weavis.

[Rustic Charm]

Originally Posted by Exile

Not only not illegal, but none of the anti-crowd have yet to come up with any credible negative impacts on other vessels. Just theoretical possibilities that have never occurred or are highly improbable, and many of those could and do equally befall those with crew.

May also be worth noting that, at the time the Colregs were adopted, recreational vessels had no AIS to transmit, no way to receive it (AFAIK), and I bet few had radar. So given today's access to readily available and reasonably affordable collision avoidance systems for recreational vessels, it puts the oft-repeated Rule 5 requirement of maintaining a look-out by sight & hearing at all times in a different context.

Very astute observation

Cruising Forum is a wonderful medium for expressing ideas and learning new things. But one of the problems I think is that it also becomes a medium for spreading false ideas and false concepts. Except for those who travel exceptionally widely, most of CF members should be focusing not on the COLREGS as a priority but on what their local laws are. Then there would be chores of 'it's not illegal here', instead of this constant erroneous interpretation of a convention. And until someone, anywhere can come up with a piece of legislation from any country that it's illegal to single sail, or be alone whilst sailing, then it's just opinions rather than fact.