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Old 10-11-2017, 17:12   #46
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Re: What would you do for a mast?

You are making some points that I do not quite get.

1000 miles to Florida, to get a mast (???) - sounds insane.

Going to Martinique WHERE THE MAST IS COSTLY (???) - I understand you reference to Florida, not BVI? It cannot be more costly than at BVI anyways.

The point is you are not in Florida. And I do not think you are going to Martinique, from BVI, without a mast.

My own reasoning would be something like this:

Plan A) fix the original mast (if the mast is the problem).

Broken masts can be sleeved and riveted. Level: easy.

Plan B) cannibalise a less lucky boat.

Your next mast does not have to be like the original one. Enough if it is similar enough.

Plan C) have one built where they are cheap, cut in half, ship, fit.

I hope you will find a way. It would suck if you had to skip a season. Fingers crossed. Hope to meet you out there this winter.

Cheers,
b.
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Old 10-11-2017, 17:16   #47
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Re: What would you do for a mast?

Plan D

;-)

Fly out to St Martin. Go to the lagoon. Can you see like five dozen masts sticking out from the water??? One may fit your boat.

I say no more. Those boats are gone but their masts are still standing.

Like Elton John ;-)

Cheers,
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Old 10-11-2017, 19:31   #48
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Re: What would you do for a mast?

O dear, lots of good intentions here, but this thread now looks like it's getting a little 'pissy'; all the OP wanted to know was if he/she should consider a 2k mile passage to motor his mono-hull home to get a new spar. It morphed into a discussion on how to jury-rig to enable her/him to sail back.
These responses offered all kinds of suggestions & advice with one respondent taking the liberty of referring to the OP as "mate" ... &, as we all know, this being an international forum, sometimes a response can be perceived as more of an insult by a person reading it in a different part of the world. In this case, the person using the term 'mate' is located in Scotland where, such use of the term in that country is often regarded as a form of endearment.

Yes, I know, we think we all speak English & we 'think' we know what was said but, with the distances between us we do not see the smile on the writers face & a word can be so easily be misinterpreted as an insult when in fact, nothing could be further from the truth. So, settle down lads, try not to take offence. I'm quite sure the wee laddie from Scotland did not intend to offend.

To the OP: I think what the fellow was trying to explain is the fact there is no need to perform any welding on an aluminum mast when you sleeve it.
Not knowing your 'level of expertise' when it comes to working with aluminum, maybe I should explain ... hopefully, without sounding like I'm talking 'down' to you... If a tool will cut wood, it will also cut aluminum ... Aluminum is best cut with a Chop-Saw, having an 80, 90, or 100 tooth, Carbide blade (the more teeth, the smoother the cut). Do not use a Grinder.
Some metalworkers install the blade 'backward' to enable it to cut with the back of the teeth ... this to prevent 'hooking' the metal. As for me, I much prefer to install the blade in the conventional manner, using a slow but steady pressure when advancing the cut. This way, it reduces the possibility of knocking the carbide tips off which is more likely when cutting with the back of the teeth.
On completion of a cut, do NOT raise the blade until motor is switched OFF and the blade has come to a complete standstill.

Used as suggested above, the Chop Saw will provide a clean cut, precise angles, and provide you with perfect-fit joints; Good dry fitting, a bench drill and some Monel pop rivets will provide you an excellent result. Sleeve-ing is the "industry accepted" way of either lengthening, or repairing, an aluminum extrusion. DONE CORRECTLY, it could even be considered your permanent repair.
There are hundreds of sleeved masts out there, you may even find some amid all that chaos that currently exists in the local marina that you might view for encouragement to at least 'have a go' at it. If not, there are lots of books on this type of repair, & I'm sure you can Google it for further explanation.
As I previously commented, sometimes, just the very thought of doing something unfamiliar to you, can be very intimidating, particularly if you have never seen it done & yet; like many other jobs, it is relatively simple once you "know how". I should add, the sleeved section becomes stronger than the adjacent sections of the spar.
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Old 10-11-2017, 20:11   #49
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Re: What would you do for a mast?

Before trying any of the jury rig options or motoring to Florida, you might like to ask your insurance company (presuming you have one) what they think of any of these ideas. You may lose the boat and not be covered.
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Old 10-11-2017, 21:46   #50
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Re: What would you do for a mast?

Sailorbob - thank you for taking the time and effort to reply. I appreciate your effort to try and explain that "mate" isn't a derogatory term. I didn't take it as such. But when in the very next breath the poster asks if I have, or know how to use a compass he can sod off. Every. Single. Time. In my book that's completely out of line - and apparently triggered simply by not agreeing to do what HE suggests to repair MY boat.

One of my considerations was brought up by Martin, insurance. What do you think my chances are of getting coverage from my insurance company after sleeving a mast they've already declined coverage on because it's 20 years old, hmm? Along the same lines, since I'm not on the island to go scrounging around myself, how much do you think would be reasonable for me to budget to hire someone to do that? How many times do you think I should pay a crane to pull and step masts? (Hint: I'd like to do it exactly once during the next 20 years or so.) How much of my time should I dedicate to chasing owners of sunken boats, then their insurance companies, then the salvage company the boat will ultimately be passed off to in order to try to make a deal on a used mast which may or may not pass inspection and may or may not be insurable? There are a lot of considerations I didn't type out and a lot of questions I didn't ask. But still... I appreciate all the opinions and suggestions everyone has shared here (except one - you know who you are)
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Old 10-11-2017, 22:14   #51
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Re: What would you do for a mast?

Am I reading this right, your insurance company has refused to cover the cost of the repair because the mast is 20 years old, or is it because the damage was caused by a named storm in a hurricane area?

Either way your next question to the forum ought to be how much does a mast spar for a yacht cost including the fitting. I suspect that might have a bearing on the decision you make.

Pete
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Old 11-11-2017, 01:34   #52
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Re: What would you do for a mast?

Mika, I think the majority of folk responding would truly like to help but, we are not there either and can only offer what we believe to be viable ideas. I'm sure if some of us could even get there, we would do our best to assist as brother sailors. If you are not even on the island yourself, then I can at least try to understand & commiserate with your predicament although I'm not fully understanding as to why your insurance company is not helping. I do wish you luck in your endeavour.
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Old 11-11-2017, 04:40   #53
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Re: What would you do for a mast?

Have not read the whole thread so this might be redundant. Duty varies among the various islands. Don't know about Martinique but some of many of the French based islands have no duty for boat parts. Trinidad is very good at allowing "Yacht in Transit" duty free importation but you willl have to pay VAT on anything bought locally.

Grenada has an arrangement with the marine hardware stores wherein a foreign boat can buy marine items (everything in the store?) both duty and VAT free. No Yacht in Transit for imported items but can get a reduced 2-1/2% duty (and I think VAT exemption) but you have to hire an agent for $150US to get that rate.

I swould think shipping to Trinidad would be the cheapest given all the oil industry activity there. Have heard shipping from Florida is not that bad if you're willing to waith the 3-5 weeks for it to get there on a ship or barge.

Good luck in your "new adventure"
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Old 12-11-2017, 01:58   #54
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Re: What would you do for a mast?

What happened to your old mast??
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Old 13-11-2017, 16:15   #55
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Re: What would you do for a mast?

It was taken down by the winds of Irma - folded and broken at the first spreader. I'm waiting on estimates from riggers on the island and some from surrounding areas and was contemplating the feasibility of motoring it somewhere for repairs if quotes and scheduling came back more conducive. Clearly, if all other factors are equal, I'd prefer to have it repaired in place. But if there's a big enough difference to make it worthwhile, I'll splash it and go.

Thanks for the suggestions I've gotten of places on nearby islands that are in operation which I didn't think would be. Taking it to Puerto Rico or St. Marten would be preferable to islands further away or FL. I've reached out and am waiting for estimates for comparison. I also appreciate the cautions about how uncomfortable any passage would be. That's certainly a factor.

As for insurance, I have coverage for named storms, but the policy depreciates coverage on the mast by 5% per year and the standing rigging by 10% per year from installation. I've disagreed with the insurer that a mast is a 'wear item', and tried to make the point that this storm took rigs down even on new boats because it was so severe - but that doesn't matter to them because it's in the policy. So, replacement it is...
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Old 13-11-2017, 16:41   #56
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Re: What would you do for a mast?

having Puerto Rico in the mixture is a good idea as in case of problems there is Cuba on the way back in case of trouble,if well Cuba is not longer a usual stop nevertheless in case of emergency should be OK,and certainly shortens the length of time at sea.
I bring this up as I remember reading this article not long ago on these sailors

https://www.sailmagazine.com/cruisin...orida-via-cuba
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Old 13-11-2017, 18:35   #57
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Re: What would you do for a mast?

Sleeved masts are not a hack fix. Many new masts add sleeved because their design length is greater than the available extrusion. Don't dismiss this option. Many race boats have sleeved masts
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Old 13-11-2017, 19:58   #58
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Re: What would you do for a mast?

Quote:
Originally Posted by rpjn59 View Post
I love the lattice mast, built in mast steps!
There is a german engineer who sold plans for such a lattice mast made from steel for a few bucks. And there are a few boats with this kind of mast.

http://yacht-mast.de/mast102.jpg
http://yacht-mast.de/imageOM6.JPG
http://yacht-mast.de/mast_01.jpg
http://www.yacht-mast.de/CIMG0008kl.JPG
http://www.yacht-mast.de/Eugenia%20Moll.JPG
http://www.yacht-mast.de/Saling.jpg

After he retired he closed this side business. But he was so kind to send the plans for free, when I asked for them. And he said, that there never were problems with this kind of masts.
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Old 13-11-2017, 20:50   #59
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Re: What would you do for a mast?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mika1 View Post
I wish it were a hypothetical question but it's not. It's my reality. While I'm waiting for quotes to come in from different places, I wonder how feasable it would be to motor my Irma-dismasted sailboat from BVI to somewhere else for a new mast and rigging. The rigging companies on the islands are overwhelmed with the amount of work and not likely to get it done in time to salvage the 2017 season (for a non-charter boat like mine). I also question the quality of work under the best of circumstances, let alone under the current conditions and certainly don't want carelessness or shortcuts to be taken. And that's not to mention the extra expense of having a mast shipped.



So, I wonder what would you do? Would you forfeit the hopes of a full season of sailing this year and pay whatever premium to have it done where the boat sits? (It is, btw, stored on the hard and thankfully stayed on the stands through the blow) Would you consider motoring the ~1000 miles to Florida to have the work done? Am I crazy for even thinking of it? What about taking her someplace like Martinique where the scheduling might be better but the cost would likely still be high due to shipping the stick?



I'm still waiting on estimates to start coming in and once they do it might make the decision obvious because cost is (needless to say) a major factor. In the mean time, I'd like to evaluate other options from a safety/cost/time standpoint and so I'd greatly appreciate the input and opinion of the collective. -TIA


Laminate one from timber install the rig and replace it when you can afford to.
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Old 14-11-2017, 00:13   #60
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Re: What would you do for a mast?

I thought I would reply to the topic using a little poem I have composed:

And I would do anything for a mast
I'd run right into hell and back
I would do anything for mast
I'd never lie to you and that's a fact
But I'll never forget the way you feel right now
Oh no, no way
And I would do anything for a mast
Oh I would do anything for a mast
I would do anything for a mast, but I won't do that
No, I won't do that

I hope this clarifies things.
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