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Old 02-02-2007, 18:00   #1
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Question What would you do

if you were in my position? I've been discussing our plan to build our own boat and have been getting a few differing opinions. Such as:
  1. Why build when you can buy an old boat and fix it up?
  2. Just buy a new one and go!
  3. Do you really want to spend two years of hard work doing this?
  4. You won't get anything for it if you go to sell it, why throw your money away?
The list goes on but these seem to be the most common sentiments.

Buying new isn't an option especially when you look at boats like the new C-Ranger 25' pocket trawler with a retail list of $110K US plus options. It's probably doable for us but I don't think it's a good value for such a small boat and toss in depreciation on top of that I really don't believe that represents good value. Buying new in the size we're considering to build would be anywhere from $125K - $200K US. I'm pretty sure, as some of you have seen in previous discussions on the budget, that we'll be able to build the boat for $60K - $70K Cdn.

Well I have a short list of why's vs. why nots. Mostly it's because of:
  1. It's a lifelong dream to build my own boat
  2. I believe I'll get good value for my money if we build as opposed to bying an old boat
  3. I don't like working on old boats (been there done that) it's just not for us
  4. We'll use a proven design with a proven construction method using the best materials available
  5. Through my work I have access to many marine professionals, naval architects & engineers most of whom owe me a favor or five (I have Tyvek coveralls & epoxy rollers with their names already printed on them) ;o)
  6. It'll be fully inspected by Transport Canada for registration and will be compliant with all their small vessel construction standards
  7. I (we) aren't affraid of hard work, not even two years of it or more
  8. We feel we're able to build this boat, out of pocket quite comfortably, over the course of a couple of years and not have to borrow to do it and be able to keep our house.
It's not about just buying a boat and going cruising. It's about the whole experience especially the pride in accomplishment and satisfaction that goes with having done it ourselves! Besides if I build it and it breaks I should be able to fix it, right? Then when this one is done we'll start the next one but BIGGER! Any and all comments welcome and appreciated.
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Old 02-02-2007, 18:19   #2
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You've already convinced yourself Rick, and your decision is sound.

Bloody hell it's only 25 ft X 1, easy.

Should have her knocked out in a couple of months

I thought you were originaly going for more the Nigel Irens Range Boat look, waterline is cheap if keeping the accom. the same.

Untitled Document

Going that bigger second version can be a bit taxing though.


I love the smell of epoxy in the morning.

Dave
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Old 02-02-2007, 18:24   #3
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I'm building now, it may not be the most sensible way to get a boat, but it's cheaper than therapy.
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Old 02-02-2007, 18:27   #4
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Originally Posted by dana-tenacity
I'm building now, it may not be the most sensible way to get a boat, but it's cheaper than therapy.
I think i'll need some before i'm done.

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Old 02-02-2007, 18:32   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cat man do
Should have her knocked out in a couple of months
Should be able to knock the hull together pretty quick. Not so sure about fitting her out, probably a full year to get her in the water and work on the details later as time and money permit. That's my plan anyways.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cat man do
I thought you were originaly going for more the Nigel Irens Range Boat look
That Rangeboat is a lot like the Shannon SRD. 38' powerboat SRD by Shannon Yachts

Sweet looking boats. I figure if I offer 'nuff beers & bratworst I'll get a a few of you fella's comin' to help with the glass & epoxy work.
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Old 02-02-2007, 19:05   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by knottybuoyz
1. It's a lifelong dream to build my own boat
Rick, that's the only real reason you need. Its your life, its your dream. I don't know much about building boats, but I believe living your dream is the best life you can live. -Louise
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Old 02-02-2007, 19:09   #7
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I have to agree with the common sentiment. Rick, I think you have the right resources at your disposal as well as the right outlook going into it. You also have an attention to detail that is obvious in your postings and the work you do on computers. That attention to detail will translate well into a boat building process.

Also, for what it's worth... I wish I was able to build our boat. I would have done a backyard build myself, had I owned a backyard.
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Old 02-02-2007, 19:17   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by knottybuoyz
What would you do? if you were in my position?
Bloody well exactly what I wanted to, whether anyone else thought it was a good idea or not . And then second guessed myself


Have always fancied building a boat, but I know I lack the skill and time to do it in the way I would demand of myself.
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Old 02-02-2007, 19:22   #9
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Quote:
You've already convinced yourself Rick, and your decision is sound.
It's not looking like a huge crowd that want to beg you not to try it Rick. In the end it's more about what you want than the money saved. I doubt you'll save much money but you might get more than that out of it. So long as we get all the pictures it sounds great to me. Lori will at least know where you are. We might even come up with a party to launch it so long as you promise good weather.

Measure twice and cut once and all the rest of those rules of the road.
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Old 02-02-2007, 20:24   #10
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I would definitely recommend building over rebuilding. In all the years I have spent rebuilding, I can't remember how many times I have thought "It would have been easier and cheaper to start from scratch. Nothing to move out of the way, no cabinetry to carefully remove. no hidden rot to miss.
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Old 02-02-2007, 21:10   #11
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Rick:

I'm going to disagree with everyone . Here's the reason b/c I don't want to build any boat bigger than a stitch and tape nesting dinghy. When I am old (well older) and grey (well greyer) its not going to bother me a bit as I sit telling stories of my life and the boat that I didn't build.

On the otherhand if I were you and had a life long dream of building a boat and having it paid for in two years . . . stories of my (I mean your) life wouldn't taste right if I( I mean you) didn't build it.
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Old 02-02-2007, 22:12   #12
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Rick,

I have also considered building, but have elected not to, just yet. Notwithstanding my naval background, we have no idea whether I'll enjoy "cruising" let alone if the wife or kids take to it. It would be very disheartening to pour as much time and effort as would be required to build our dream boat, just to find that we either don't like the boat, or don't like the lifestyle. So our plan now is to buy a boat (probably more modest than we would like for a circumnavigation) and commit to one year of cruising in the caribbean/eastern seaboard. If after a year we wish to continue, then we will likely upgrade, which includes the possibility that we will build. We think in doing it that way, we will have enough experience to know what we need and want in a boat, and end up with a boat that would accommodate our needs for several years. As opposed to compromising and making do. Given that you've had similar boats to the one you wish to build, I would think you're in a good place to know what layout, features etc you would want to build into your boat. And your CG background should help plenty as well. So I think you are in an ideal situation to build your own boat.

Besides, you'll post lots of updates here, so we can learn from your experiences - or be entertained

Kevin
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Old 03-02-2007, 01:07   #13
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Just a warning....2/3 of a boats cost is in the hardware. I realize you are building a PB. The electronics, steering, engine(s), props, and galley alone will total more then your budget. Price one engine, fuel system (filters, tanks and valves), prop shaft and prop, electrics for the engine (battery, switch, charger)--- Now exactly how are you going to stay within $60K canadien?
Add $10k for electronics, lights, electrical panel, marine grade wire, vhf.
Galley? Stove...with propane tanks, regulator and hoses. Refrigerator? AC? Heating? Water heater? Head, holding tank, macerator, valves? Anchor and rode? Wait until you price a steering system. Interior, Exterior covers and bimini, sound system, .... we haven't even discussed the material costs for the hull...bottom paint and barrier costs, stainless rails, hatches, etc.
So to keep in your budget you will not have somethings, scrimp and use low quality on other items, maybe even use automotive parts as they are so much cheaper.
Does anyone not understand why there is little resale on home builts? I would never buy one.

You would do much better buying a 30k boat and spending 30k, WISELY, in fixing it up. JMO
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Old 03-02-2007, 01:28   #14
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Seriously...

1) It's a lifelong dream to build my own boat.
The boat that you have chosen would make an excellent labour of love.
2) I believe I'll get good value for my money if we build as opposed to bying an old boat.
That depends. If you are logical and sensible there are some excellent bargains out there.
3) I don't like working on old boats (been there done that) it's just not for us.
New boats are just the same, only there is more work.
4) We'll use a proven design with a proven construction method using the best materials available.
All designs have faults, all construction methods have problems and quality materials are freqently heavily overpriced.
5) Through my work I have access to many marine professionals, naval architects & engineers most of whom owe me a favor or five (I have Tyvek coveralls & epoxy rollers with their names already printed on them) ;o).
Are you really planning to build a boat as a work project?
6) It'll be fully inspected by Transport Canada for registration and will be compliant with all their small vessel construction standards.
Are you planning to jump through flamming hoops when the lion tamer cracks his wip?
7) I (we) aren't affraid of hard work, not even two years of it or more.
Its not the hard work that gets you. Its the effect on relationships and finances.
8) We feel we're able to build this boat, out of pocket quite comfortably, over the course of a couple of years and not have to borrow to do it and be able to keep our house.
Its going to be expensive, isn't it.
The boat that you have at the moment would seem to be perfectly suitable for what you want to do. The boat that you are planning to build will not do it a lot better.
The real reason that we build a boat or take on a big renovation is we cannot afford the boat we really want.
Looking back someone who has "retired", at your age I was approaching my professional peak (I was a slow learner) so in 5 years or so you will be planning your retirement.
So what I am suggesting is this. Look in your heart, the dream is not the boat, the dream is an activity. What you may find that you really want is 5 or 10 years down the track.
So, get your money together and look at boats with your wife. One of them will sing to you.
If you can't afford it, build or restore it.
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Old 03-02-2007, 03:24   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kapena
Just a warning....2/3 of a boats cost is in the hardware. I realize you are building a PB. The electronics, steering, engine(s), props, and galley alone will total more then your budget. Price one engine, fuel system (filters, tanks and valves), prop shaft and prop, electrics for the engine (battery, switch, charger)--- Now exactly how are you going to stay within $60K canadien?
Add $10k for electronics, lights, electrical panel, marine grade wire, vhf.
Galley? Stove...with propane tanks, regulator and hoses. Refrigerator? AC? Heating? Water heater? Head, holding tank, macerator, valves? Anchor and rode? Wait until you price a steering system. Interior, Exterior covers and bimini, sound system, .... we haven't even discussed the material costs for the hull...bottom paint and barrier costs, stainless rails, hatches, etc.
So to keep in your budget you will not have somethings, scrimp and use low quality on other items, maybe even use automotive parts as they are so much cheaper.
Does anyone not understand why there is little resale on home builts? I would never buy one.

You would do much better buying a 30k boat and spending 30k, WISELY, in fixing it up. JMO
Bollock's,

Well designed and well built home built boat's can and do regulaly fetch more money than production boat's.

Reason being is they are usually built for a pupose and a particular need not a market.

Other people with similar need's pay a premium for them as they may not find an equivelant in the production market

All the bit's you mention above will be in another production boat, with the associated mark up added in.

If Rick is doing a lot or all of the labour himself he won't be paying for wages and profit, so can use quality fitting's and premium materials if so inclined.

Dave
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