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Old 03-02-2007, 05:23   #16
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why put an equivalent amount of time and money into something that will still be a second hand boat when you could have the new thing
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Old 03-02-2007, 07:04   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pblais
Lori will at least know where you are. We might even come up with a party to launch it so long as you promise good weather.
Oh I'll know where he is alright because I will be right there working on it, too! This is a project we have discussed at length and my only condition was that I be allowed to put on my steel-toed shoes and work along side him.

I have seen how Rick builds things (almost everytime my company sends me away I come back and discover our home has grown an appendage ) No shortcuts, no compromise in quality. Will there be rough patches? Of course! I don't think either one of us expect it to be smooth going all of the time, but we'll get through it.
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Old 03-02-2007, 07:26   #18
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Oh I'll know where he is alright because I will be right there working on it, too! This is a project we have discussed at length and my only condition was that I be allowed to put on my steel-toed shoes and work along side him.
BUT! No power tools for you! Hah!
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Old 03-02-2007, 08:20   #19
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BUT! No power tools for you!
Drills really are a lot of fun.
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Old 03-02-2007, 08:57   #20
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Originally Posted by knottybuoyz
BUT! No power tools for you! Hah!
There's nothing like hand sanding to strengthen a relationship.

My wife did about 20% of the refit with me last year. She stripped all the doors, the companionway slats, did all the Cetol on deck (and the outside of the compainionway slats), did covers for the salon cushions, and generally cleaned up my construction mess from time to time.

Working together was great. Now she's ready to give the bosun's chair a try, since I'd just be clinging to the mast for dear life, dropping tools and shaking a lot.

Plus, she's right about 100lbs, so she's an easy hoist.

Building that boat together will be very rewarding...
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Old 03-02-2007, 09:47   #21
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I want a clone of Lori!!!!! With that attitude and determination, planning and craftmanship, I have no doubt that you two will build a fantastic boat! And, you'll have done it together!
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Old 03-02-2007, 10:33   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pblais
Drills really are a lot of fun.
I knew it!! The power tool thing is still under negotiation!

Lori
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Old 03-02-2007, 11:46   #23
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Cat-man-do...I don't want to get off the topic but you are wrong about commanding a higher price for a home built. You can hardly sell one. Not even worth my time to discuss this.

It's not labor or the stuff Rick can build...It's the stuff he has to purchase. A builder ordering 50 galley stoves a year, for the past 20 years, is going to get a lot better price then Rick, who only wants one. Same with all materials.

The hull is the easy part.

The boat they showed as similar is a 500k boat, USED. 350k is in fittings and hardware. Nobody can build it for 60k. You can build a 60k boat for 60k.
YachtWorld.com Boats and Yachts for Sale=
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Old 03-02-2007, 11:58   #24
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There's nothing like hand sanding to strengthen a relationship.
Or tear it apart :-)

Quote:
My wife did about 20% of the refit with me last year. She stripped all the doors, the companionway slats, did all the Cetol on deck (and the outside of the compainionway slats), did covers for the salon cushions, and generally cleaned up my construction mess from time to time.
And the remaining 80% was bringing you beers and cooking meals and putting another log on the fire huh?:-)

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I want a clone of Lori!!!!! With that attitude and determination, planning and craftmanship
Not to mention the stunning good looks.
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Old 03-02-2007, 12:41   #25
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All good points Kap and that's what I've been hearing a lot of. I've looked at a few older boats, guestimated what it'd take to bring them back to shape and really can't see myself getting into that. I've read a few horror stories of hidden rot, crapped out engines running on STP etc. As much as it may get us a bigger boat I really feel it'll bring bigger headaches in the long run. We have friends who went this route a few years ago. The first summer they launched, second time out, their lehman went *poof*! $20K later for a new cummins and they were finally underway.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kapena
It's the stuff he has to purchase. A builder ordering 50 galley stoves a year, for the past 20 years, is going to get a lot better price then Rick, who only wants one. Same with all materials.
There is a boatbuilding Co-Op in Ontario. I'll be joining up. Have thought about setting up a business w/letterhead to bypass the retail markup, dunno if I need to though, might be more headaches than it's worth. I've been scanning the web and sourcing materials and have a pretty good idea what's available and for what prices.

http://www.ccg-gcc.gc.ca/kbii/summary.htm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kapena
The hull is the easy part.
Well not easy but probably easier than the fit out. We can start aiming for a workboat finish and over the course of a few years, as time and money allow bring that up to a fairly high level of finish. My brother's a cabinet maker so his skills will play into this as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kapena
The boat they showed as similar is a 500k boat, USED. 350k is in fittings and hardware. Nobody can build it for 60k. You can build a 60k boat for 60k.
We'll see!

I won't have the overhead that a production boat builder does, no staff, no craftsman, no journeymen, no marketing people, no front office people, no shipping, no insurance, no facilities, no taxes yadda yadda yadda. Makes you wonder just exactly how much a new boat costs to build. I wouldn't be surprised that all the overhead quickly outweighs the actual costs of raw materials and equipment!
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Old 03-02-2007, 12:45   #26
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I knew it!! The power tool thing is still under negotiation! Lori
No it ain't! Quit encouraging her you guys! *biting my tongue*
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Old 03-02-2007, 13:25   #27
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Originally Posted by knottybuoyz
No it ain't! Quit encouraging her you guys! *biting my tongue*
So how BIG is this boat?



Depending on your view of "the world", Power Tools may be an idea after all
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Old 03-02-2007, 13:27   #28
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Rick - I've built a couple of small boats and restored 4 larger ones and I know of several others who built larger boats from scratch and I have a few observations

Take a serious look at your budget and go out and price every item you can think of that you'll require. This includes any tools and accessories. Then price out similarly sized boats both new and used and estimate of dollars required to upgrade the used ones. If you are still within budget to build from scratch proceed to next step - if not - re-evaluate building versus buying used and upgrading. BTW - we don't tend to put any dollar value on our labour when calculating these amounts however this is a serious consideration as you will see with a couple of stories I relate later.

Estimate the time required realistically - you probably have a time frame - I suggest you multiply it by at least 2 - and don't count on much help from others - not including Lori - my wife helped sand the entire hull inside and out of a classic 25 foot mahogony sailboat - that's commitment! - of course she wasn't that keen to work extensively on later boats - and no offense Lori but wifes and mothers have much more to do than husbands realize and you may not be able to devote as much time as initally you would like - we're talking about several years. As for friends - whether they owe you or not - they are great at first as visions of lazy summer afternoons out partying on your boat dance through their heads but sooner or later as it becomes tedious for them and they will drop off the radar leaving you and Lori to do most of the work.

Next how difficult and time consuming will it be to get all the materials

What about where you're building - heated shed or enclosure, access for later moving of the boat, power supply, tools.

Next consider your level of expertise - do you have the knowledge/skill to do all of the work or will you have to contract some of it out - add dollars if so.

I know of several friends and others who have followed their dream of building boiats from 14 feet to 63 feet. Some made it - most didn't because life got in the way or the money ran out or they became ill or the marraige ended or .... on and on. The 63 footer has been 30 years - they lived on it while they worked on it and each had a full time job as teacher - summers off too. Still isn;t finished - sits at the dock - is beuatiful and extremely well made but probably he will never sasil it as most unfortunately he now has cancer.

I'm trying to be realistic here and not stamp out your dream. It is definately do-able but in all things you need to be strictly practical and realistic about the huge commitment you two are making - if after that you still wish to proceed - and I can offer any advice - let me know for I too have gone down the path you are embarking on and had the same dreams and did it - an still doing it by restoring and upgrading my current boat. I will probably never stop because it is also creating something that is totally satisfying both in the work and challenges you will face and then finally enjoying the end result

Good luck on your decision.
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Old 03-02-2007, 13:28   #29
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Well good luck to you Rick...I know you will enjoy the work and that may be the most important part. Last boat I built was from a prefab fiberglass hull I purchased in 1985. It was good therapy. I hope it works out for you.
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Old 03-02-2007, 13:44   #30
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Won't have the overhead?

I worked at a boat factory for a little bit. I didn't see a lot of overhead. 90% or more were just us $10/hr workers. There was only about 5 office types that I recall. It would have been great fun to get into the records and see where the cash was spent. But I was just a grunt and not allowed anywhere. (And I doubt the records were all that accurate)

I can understand wanting to build your own boat. Sheesh, I've been wanting to do that for years. More than that, one of my big dreams has been to start a boat buliding company.

I think it would be great to build the boats that -I- thought were cool. Done "right" etc etc. But then I'd have to sell these perfect boats and I've noticed, very few people agree with me on what the perfect boat is.

If your going to build a boat, what is your plan for a starting point?

A) Pile of lumber
B) Pile of steel
C) Pile of fiberglass and a few barrels of resin
D) Bare steel hull
E) Bare Glass hull
???

One of my favorite boat building projects : THE BIG SAILBOAT PROJECT

I been watching these girls build their boat since it was just a pile of steel plates.

Have fun, keep us updated with your project!

-jim lee
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