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Old 12-12-2012, 16:50   #31
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Re: Ways to Keep Boat Bottom Clean?

I've discussed this before on here, when you are next anti-fouling, add some (half a cup?) of round-up weed killer. That's what it's called in Australia. It definitely works. A friend did half the hull as a trial to see what would happen and wished afterwards that he had done the whole thing!
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Old 12-12-2012, 17:32   #32
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Re: Ways to Keep Boat Bottom Clean?

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Originally Posted by Blue Crab View Post
That oughta slow things down. But Matt, consider turning those seasons around.

JackB: I'm sure you know or will eventually hear about tin-based paints. When you do, please raise the issue on SailNet or better, Sail Arnachy but not here. It's like a line you do NOT want to cross. Plus they're illegal among civilized peoples.
I've been researching all ideas, and have read about the outlawed tin paint,
and now copper is about to be outlawed. My big OP question is/was where to find a review of all methods, I've found this and that, nothing comprehensive.

Since my other post hasn't come through yet, and the freshwater thing mentioned, there is an approach/product that creates a "moat" around the boat to isolate it from the ocean water. It must open to move the boat of course, but if it sits in the moat for 6-9 months and keeps off the growth,
it would be sort of what I'm after, and why wouldn't you use them in your slip too? It probably doesn't really work.

I'm thinking what does the growth need to grow? take something away that it needs it won't grow.
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Old 12-12-2012, 22:50   #33
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Re: Ways to Keep Boat Bottom Clean?

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But if these really worked, wouldn't everyone be using them by now?
Here's another robot:



The reasons systems like this will not gain wide popularity or usage are many. Among them:

They are not fast. In fact, a diver can clean a boat in half the time claimed for the some of these devices.

They will not clean your waterline, rudder, the bottom of the keel or any other area of the hull in close proximity to a hard edge.

They will not clean thru-hulls or transducers.

They will not clean your running gear.

They will not replace anodes.

Ablative paint requiring a soft touch? Older paint needing a little extra elbow grease? Sorry, with these devices, it's one-size-fits-all.

The bottom line is when it comes to below-the-waterline maintenance, there is still nothing that can do it as well as a human.
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Old 15-12-2012, 11:59   #34
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Re: Ways to Keep Boat Bottom Clean?

The key is to minimize the requirement of a human's work, not necessarily to eliminate it. If you can cut the need for a diver by 1/4, that would be worthwhile,
or reduce the frequency of bottom jobs.
Of course the alternative can't cost thousands. I used to clean my pool by hand,
before I got a pool cleaner, under $500, well worth it, but I still must do manual work to keep my pool clean.
For this robot is appears to require a human to operate it, so not sure what advantage it offers.

No comments on the bag moat approach? Seems it won't really isolate from ocean water unless you are in a very calm marina, but there are such places, like deep inland canals.

I'm thinking what might work well is to create a brushing system that travels from bow to stern that conforms to the hull shape. It could be run every day with a very light touch.
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Old 15-12-2012, 21:53   #35
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Re: Ways to Keep Boat Bottom Clean?

I'm surprised that no one has mentioned the device called (IIRC) a "Boat Bath". This was a system of long skinny floats (like pool noodles) that held up a "bag" made of heavy PVC material. It was closed at one end and had sort of draw strings to close up the other end once one drove the boat into the bag. Some folks in marinas would simply pump out most of the salt water enclosed and replace with fresh from the hose (a somewhat tedious process), but most would drop in a pool chlorine tablet or two.

They worked very well at protecting the boat. But, they had nothing to protect them from fouling, and they would (in the SF Bay where I sailed at the time) rapidly develop a marine garden on their outer surfaces. Eventually (a few months or so) the weight of all that growth would sink the floats and sea water would enter and the game was up.

Some hardy folks tried to drag the bag ashore and clean it, but that was a Herculean task and few persisted for long. Thus, one seldom sees the bags in use today.

So, Nimble, the whole maritime world is anxiously awaiting the results of your research. Seriously, don't you think that the thousands of folks worldwide who face fouling problems have given it some thought? Maybe a lot of thought? Believe me, if a useful solution existed, we would all be ecstatic and be using the hell out of it.

I wish that it were so, mate, I wish that it were so! (Then fstbttms could get an honest job! (just joking!)).

Cheers,

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Old 15-12-2012, 22:23   #36
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Re: Ways to Keep Boat Bottom Clean?

Jim, I think the difference from the past,
is that today copper bottom paint is becoming too toxic and alternatives
must be found rather than the old way of paying starving
divers to help pollute the water.
And also that microelectronics are now cheaper than plastic sheeting.
If my pool cleaner is $400, a boat hull cleaner can't be too difficult?
And now we have robot lawn mowers and carpet cleaners. wasn't so 10 years ago.

JackB

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Originally Posted by Jim Cate View Post
I'm surprised that no one has mentioned the device called (IIRC) a "Boat Bath". This was a system of long skinny floats (like pool noodles) that held up a "bag" made of heavy PVC material. It was closed at one end and had sort of draw strings to close up the other end once one drove the boat into the bag. Some folks in marinas would simply pump out most of the salt water enclosed and replace with fresh from the hose (a somewhat tedious process), but most would drop in a pool chlorine tablet or two.

They worked very well at protecting the boat. But, they had nothing to protect them from fouling, and they would (in the SF Bay where I sailed at the time) rapidly develop a marine garden on their outer surfaces. Eventually (a few months or so) the weight of all that growth would sink the floats and sea water would enter and the game was up.

Some hardy folks tried to drag the bag ashore and clean it, but that was a Herculean task and few persisted for long. Thus, one seldom sees the bags in use today.

So, Nimble, the whole maritime world is anxiously awaiting the results of your research. Seriously, don't you think that the thousands of folks worldwide who face fouling problems have given it some thought? Maybe a lot of thought? Believe me, if a useful solution existed, we would all be ecstatic and be using the hell out of it.

I wish that it were so, mate, I wish that it were so! (Then fstbttms could get an honest job! (just joking!)).

Cheers,

Jim
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Old 15-12-2012, 22:24   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nimblemotors View Post

As my original question, is there a source for reviews of all methods of keeping a boat hull clean? Google wasn't my friend.

Here are some things I found, ultrasonic cleaning (it works for auto parts),


Here is a "robot" that cleans hulls,


Here is just a manual brush, DRI-DIVER - Boat Hull Cleaner, Remove hull growth from the dock

Another maybe like the bag, is to put a "moat" around the boat,



But if these really worked, wouldn't everyone be using them by now?

I have my own boat situation, but in general the toxic bottom paint problem in marinas seems like it needs a solution, as many many boats just sit and collect growth.

JackB
Thanks for such an informative and enlightening post!
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Old 15-12-2012, 22:29   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ausaviator View Post
I've discussed this before on here, when you are next anti-fouling, add some (half a cup?) of round-up weed killer. That's what it's called in Australia. It definitely works. A friend did half the hull as a trial to see what would happen and wished afterwards that he had done the whole thing!
At 200 to 300 dollars a gallon, one hates to mess with the chemistry of a paint, and have it never dry, or fall off in clumps. What paint was this used with,?
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Old 16-12-2012, 23:20   #39
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Re: Ways to Keep Boat Bottom Clean?

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Thanks for such an informative and enlightening post!
Something else found doing this research is "BoatScrubber", which is like a drivethrough carwash for boats. Surprised nobody mentioned it.
They had a business model of selling yearly subscriptions where you get to use the "boat wash" as often as you like. It looked like it worked, but wasn't popular enough to make it viable. If you watch this video, the washer was fairly simple, yet very large and costly such that no way one could afford to have their own.
It is somewhat what I was thinking might work.

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Old 17-12-2012, 08:16   #40
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Re: Ways to Keep Boat Bottom Clean?

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Originally Posted by nimblemotors View Post
Something else found doing this research is "BoatScrubber", which is like a drivethrough carwash for boats. Surprised nobody mentioned it.
They had a business model of selling yearly subscriptions where you get to use the "boat wash" as often as you like. It looked like it worked, but wasn't popular enough to make it viable. If you watch this video, the washer was fairly simple, yet very large and costly such that no way one could afford to have their own.
It is somewhat what I was thinking might work.
In addition to having most, or all, of the drawbacks of the systems previously mentioned, with the drive-thru boat wash you have the additonal disadvantage of somebody (probably the owner) having to take the time to actually move the boat to and from the washer unit. When a boat owner hires a human hull cleaner, he can choose to be present or not and he doesn't have to move the boat anywhere. In a typical scenario, the owner would hire a hull cleaner, set up a cleaning frequency and the diver would simply come and service the boat on that schedule while owner remains at work, on vacation, at home warming his toes by the fire or whatever.

I fail to see how there are any advantages to eliminating or reducing having a live person do the work.
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Old 18-12-2012, 15:26   #41
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Re: Ways to Keep Boat Bottom Clean?

[QUOTE=Cotemar;1105322]A few have put bags over there props and that seems to work.
Why not just put the whole boat in a bag and let us know if that works.[/QUOTE
"Boat in a Bag"....I like that.....60' catamaran that's a very large bag
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Old 23-12-2012, 00:39   #42
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Re: Ways to Keep Boat Bottom Clean?

Another method is to lift the boat hull out of the water:



But just like the bag idea, the floats themselves will get growth on them.
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Old 23-12-2012, 01:42   #43
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Re: Ways to Keep Boat Bottom Clean?

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Originally Posted by Jim Cate View Post
I'm surprised that no one has mentioned the device called (IIRC) a "Boat Bath". This was a system of long skinny floats (like pool noodles) that held up a "bag" made of heavy PVC material. It was closed at one end and had sort of draw strings to close up the other end once one drove the boat into the bag. Some folks in marinas would simply pump out most of the salt water enclosed and replace with fresh from the hose (a somewhat tedious process), but most would drop in a pool chlorine tablet or two.

They worked very well at protecting the boat. But, they had nothing to protect them from fouling, and they would (in the SF Bay where I sailed at the time) rapidly develop a marine garden on their outer surfaces. Eventually (a few months or so) the weight of all that growth would sink the floats and sea water would enter and the game was up.
Adding more or larger floats could probably extend the duration of protection to a year but, ultimately, the bag would have to be replaced.

Someday, there will be autonomous robots to keep hulls clean. People have made similar arguments against robots in every sphere (never as good as humans, etc.) yet every year there are additional tasks which robots do more cost-effectively (and sometimes simply better) than humans can do. It's just a matter of time, but a robot that could do the job well would essentially be an electric (possibly tethered) submarine with some rubber rollers, a scrubber, some sensors, and quite a bit of intelligence. I don't expect them to be cost-viable in this decade.
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Old 23-12-2012, 11:12   #44
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Re: Ways to Keep Boat Bottom Clean?

Just scrub or scrape it yourself. Careen the boat during the ebb tide, get out and gitter done, refloat and careen the other way to get the other side on the next ebb. You will get wet but no scuba gear is needed.
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Old 23-12-2012, 11:16   #45
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Re: Ways to Keep Boat Bottom Clean?

go sailing. seems growth is not as active, even with "bad" paint when sailing.....
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