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Old 03-06-2011, 20:44   #91
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Re: Washington State Copper Paint Law

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Originally Posted by michaeldsusa View Post
so tell me again why boats over 65' are exempt?
And why do boaters as a general group keep voting democrat???
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Old 04-06-2011, 05:39   #92
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Re: Washington State Copper Paint Law

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Originally Posted by senormechanico View Post
And why do boaters as a general group keep voting democrat???
A quick warning, folks... the last few posts have been flagged up as political, and as you probably know, the rules say:

Quote:
Discussion of politics, weaponry and religion is permitted only in association with the topic of this forum and will be closed or removed if they become disruptive.
So far the discussion is very much on track, and I am interested... but please be careful not to step outside the boundaries of what is fact, and be careful when expressing your opinions.

Thanks, folks.
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Old 04-06-2011, 09:07   #93
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Re: Washington State Copper Paint Law

I am desperately trying to think of something to contribute to this thread that is not political but words fail me so I'l shut up... Capt Phil
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Old 04-06-2011, 10:06   #94
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Re: Washington State Copper Paint Law

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Definition of POLITICS

1
a : the art or science of government
b : the art or science concerned with guiding or influencing governmental policy
c : the art or science concerned with winning and holding control over a government
2
: political actions, practices, or policies
3
a : political affairs or business; especially : competition between competing interest groups or individuals for power and leadership (as in a government)
b : political life especially as a principal activity or profession
c : political activities characterized by artful and often dishonest practices
4
: the political opinions or sympathies of a person
5
a : the total complex of relations between people living in society
b : relations or conduct in a particular area of experience especially as seen or dealt with from a political point of view <office politics> <ethnic politics>
Origin of POLITICS

Greek politika, from neuter plural of politikos political
First Known Use: circa 1529
Any discussion outside a boat itself can be construed as political. This post was political from the get go, just in the title alone "Washington State".
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Old 04-06-2011, 10:11   #95
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Re: Washington State Copper Paint Law

It is a political discussion and pertinent to boating. However, a comment that reads like a political campaign speech is not permitted. Steve B. tossed a quick one off but it will be the last shot.
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Old 04-06-2011, 10:17   #96
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Re: Washington State Copper Paint Law

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Steve B. tossed a quick one off but it will be the last shot.
Wayyyy too much info..........
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Old 04-06-2011, 10:24   #97
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Re: Washington State Copper Paint Law

Del, There is a difference between saying, "I wish we could get Washington to spend more money on dredging" and "Members of party xx are to blame and are all stupid a-holes."

The problems start when the discussion degrades into partisan politics.
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Old 04-06-2011, 10:54   #98
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Re: Washington State Copper Paint Law

I guess it's time to buy a wet suit and good cleaning tools but what am I saying were not in salt water very much and it's not far ( the other side of the lake ) to Oregon where I can buy good bottom paint so far.
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Old 05-06-2011, 07:03   #99
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Re: Washington State Copper Paint Law

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Originally Posted by doug86 View Post
Del, There is a difference between saying, "I wish we could get Washington to spend more money on dredging" and "Members of party xx are to blame and are all stupid a-holes."

The problems start when the discussion degrades into partisan politics.
Indeed.
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Old 05-06-2011, 10:02   #100
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Re: Washington State Copper Paint Law

The facts as I have come to know of them in the last few weeks. If you already own your boat you will not be affected at all. If you want a new manufacture boat you will be affected. This came from Joe the owner of Bottoms Up Marine service in PT.

In my own case I reacted in a hysterical manner when I heard about the whole affair because I was literally going up in the yard for a paint job. It is a bad law and should be fixed but for most us it will not be a factor.

The concern about copper is related to concentration in a given area and there is no place more concentrated than a boat yard. The solution to the problem ultimately being sought will preserve businesses in boat yards by removing the copper and seeing us all hauled out every year due to ineffective bottom coatings. It's a perfect storm for boat owners. A natural alliance between "Greens" and business. We are a minority with atleast some means, therefore we will be compelled to pay. I doubt that any politics will save our wallets over time. There is money to be made.

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Old 05-06-2011, 11:44   #101
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Re: Washington State Copper Paint Law

We bought our boat at Mission bay CA last fall and there was divers leaving there bussiness cards on our catamaran listing there bottom cleaning services like they were mowing yards every 2 weeks. I guess there is some kind of Job Creating in this for scuba divers. I'll still need to buy my own wet suit I guess it'll be like buying a lawn mower for a yard.
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Old 05-06-2011, 12:32   #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by webejammin
We bought our boat at Mission bay CA last fall and there was divers leaving there bussiness cards on our catamaran listing there bottom cleaning services like they were mowing yards every 2 weeks. I guess there is some kind of Job Creating in this for scuba divers. I'll still need to buy my own wet suit I guess it'll be like buying a lawn mower for a yard.
Except that in many areas, they are also banning bottom scrubbing. It's already illegal in some harbors on the east coast.

The answer will come from paint manufacturers, who will introduce new paints. Large ships are already adopting alternates to copper paints.
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Old 05-06-2011, 12:36   #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doug86

Except that in many areas, they are also banning bottom scrubbing. It's already illegal in some harbors on the east coast.

The answer will come from paint manufacturers, who will introduce new paints. Large ships are already adopting alternates to copper paints.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/20...ernationalnews
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Old 05-06-2011, 12:55   #104
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Re: Washington State Copper Paint Law

If there was a viable alternative to copper in bottom paint, we would have heard about it and the praises would be being sung to the rafters for this product. There are alternatives but they don't appear to be meeting the challenge from those pesky barnacles. This is another thread on this forum about one of those new whiz bang botom paints that's not living up to the wishful thinking of the manufacturer. http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...int-61849.html

The idea that if you build a field and they will come is wishful thinking at it's most destructive. The legislators are passing laws to mandate replacement of copper without their being a viable alternative, as far as I can tell. Just because there is a 'percieved' need, doesn't mean that the need can be met. If it was possible to meet a need by the simply passing of legislation, we'd have cured cancer a long time ago. Mandating copper free bottom paint is one thing, finding a suitable substitute is whole big different thing that may not be possible.
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Old 05-06-2011, 14:48   #105
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Re: Washington State Copper Paint Law

How about skinning some sharks and slapping those skins under our hulls with 5200 ?!

I would love to see a test of non-TBT, non-copper anti-fouling vs latex wall paint for outdoors. I would not dare to put any money on the anti-fouling even though it'll cost 50-100 times as much.

It is really time for that inventor to step up and create us that hull cleaning robot, much like the pool-cleaning robot. We'll just slap a Teflon paint on and throw that robot overboard for cleaning duty once a week or so.

Until they have figured it out, I'm using the old fashioned Islands 44 with copper and TBT, made in U.S.A. or another equivalent ships paint (most ships are registered in countries where TBT is still allowed). It allows me 3-4 year periods between haul-outs / paint jobs.

ciao!
Nick.
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