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Old 13-01-2012, 13:55   #226
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Re: Washington State Copper Paint Law

I guess it's time to stock up on "do it yourself cans of copper bottom paint" and go to Idaho up the Snake river to apply it on the hard there. I may need to change my CG documentation to an Idaho address but that is rather easy. Idaho ( a republican state ) on the Snake river is not concerned about boat polution they don't have pumpouts at 95% of there marinas even on the WA part of the Snake River above the first dam 15 miles from our home port, they say just go out into the main current and dump and if there is pumpouts there only open a few months a year due to freezing like our newly built 10 year old marina where were moored on the Columbia River, where they says just go dump 6 months a year in the fast current ( honest they said that )
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Old 13-01-2012, 14:14   #227
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Re: Washington State Copper Paint Law

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Originally Posted by webejammin View Post
I guess it's time to stock up on "do it yourself cans of copper bottom paint" and go to Idaho up the Snake river to apply it on the hard there. I may need to change my CG documentation to an Idaho address but that is rather easy. Idaho ( a republican state ) on the Snake river is not concerned about boat polution they don't have pumpouts at 95% of there marinas even on the WA part of the Snake River above the first dam 15 miles from our home port, they say just go out into the main current and dump and if there is pumpouts there only open a few months a year due to freezing like our newly built 10 year old marina where were moored on the Columbia River, where they says just go dump 6 months a year in the fast current ( honest they said that )
Remind me never to swim in Snake River.
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Old 13-01-2012, 14:21   #228
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Re: Washington State Copper Paint Law

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Originally Posted by webejammin View Post
I guess it's time to stock up on "do it yourself cans of copper bottom paint" and go to Idaho up the Snake river to apply it on the hard there. I may need to change my CG documentation to an Idaho address but that is rather easy. Idaho ( a republican state ) on the Snake river is not concerned about boat polution they don't have pumpouts at 95% of there marinas even on the WA part of the Snake River above the first dam 15 miles from our home port, they say just go out into the main current and dump and if there is pumpouts there only open a few months a year due to freezing like our newly built 10 year old marina where were moored on the Columbia River, where they says just go dump 6 months a year in the fast current ( honest they said that )
Really even easier for me. I am now out of the sound and moored in Oregon across the river from where I live. I am hauling this summer to paint the top sides and do a bottom paint. I will probably haul in Astoria as this is a do it yourself yard. Wonder what kind of paint I will use on the bottom?
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Old 13-01-2012, 14:55   #229
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Re: Washington State Copper Paint Law

Perhaps this will be a good money maker for the state, fine people who paint on copper bottom paints.
We could setup roving patrols to check for copper content and issue expensive citations. Look at what they want to make you pay for creating just a 'sheen' on the water. When they decide federally that copper is really awful for poor itsy bitsy marine bacteria and zooplankton, watch out. Plenty of greens would prefer the boating population simply disappear.
Ways to do this are create onerous fines and regulations and boating procedures centered around the clean water acts and general boating usage. Look how much the cities pollute, dumping in raw sewage, yet boaters get in serious trouble when they run afoul of the tiny amounts they might dump in the waters.
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Old 13-01-2012, 15:03   #230
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Re: Washington State Copper Paint Law

I really don't understand why people use the title "green" as though it's wrong to care about the environment. In my mind the "non-green" should be very grateful that there are people who care enough about the environment to make it a priority in their lives, in particular if you care about the planet your grandchildren will live in.
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Old 13-01-2012, 15:14   #231
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Re: Washington State Copper Paint Law

I partly disdain the 'green attitude' cause it is so hypocritical.

Just a few quick examples

Like the raw sewage dumping into the water from city sewers yet boaters face huge fines or no dumping zones.

Like E10 fuel which is not green at all but it used to be pushed hard that way.
If you look into E10 it is really very environmentally destructive.

Like the new bulbs containing mercury which if they break send toxic voltilized mercury into the air. Mercury which environmentalists say is so bad they want to destroy the coal industry.
Energy from incandescent bulbs is not wasted as they do heat the house slightly. Energy from less efficient fridges is the same and that is an efficient heat pump, yet they tell you to stop using your old fridge and buy a new one to save power and the environment. That old fridge heats your house. the energy is not wasted.
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Old 13-01-2012, 15:25   #232
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Re: Washington State Copper Paint Law

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Plenty of greens would prefer the boating population simply disappear.


Look how much the cities pollute, dumping in raw sewage, yet boaters get in serious trouble when they run afoul of the tiny amounts they might dump in the waters.
In the marina where I live, I'd say that 80%-90% or more of sail boat owners are "greens", it's generally only the powerboat owners who are not. The only people here who seem to have any interest in making the boating population disappear to me are the rich folks who own multi million dollar houses on the hills looking over the sound and don't want "their" views obstructed by boats anchoring off their beaches. I wonder what their political affiliations trend towards...
I believe most cities treat sewage before dumping it, hence "sewage treatment plant". You can do exactly the same thing with your boat by using a Lectra-San or equivalant to treat your own sewage in a similar fashion.
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Old 13-01-2012, 15:32   #233
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Re: Washington State Copper Paint Law

Quote:
Originally Posted by sdowney717 View Post
I partly disdain the 'green attitude' cause it is so hypocritical.

Just a few quick examples

Like the raw sewage dumping into the water from city sewers yet boaters face huge fines or no dumping zones.

Like E10 fuel which is not green at all but it used to be pushed hard that way.
If you look into E10 it is really very environmentally destructive.

Like the new bulbs containing mercury which if they break send toxic voltilized mercury into the air. Mercury which environmentalists say is so bad they want to destroy the coal industry.
Energy from incandescent bulbs is not wasted as they do heat the house slightly. Energy from less efficient fridges is the same and that is an efficient heat pump, yet they tell you to stop using your old fridge and buy a new one to save power and the environment. That old fridge heats your house. the energy is not wasted.
You're blaming the wrong people. E10 fuel is not a measure that has anything to do with environmentalist. It came about as a result of the US corn lobby.

Light bulbs and fridges to heat a house? Not much can be said about that.
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Old 13-01-2012, 15:42   #234
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Re: Washington State Copper Paint Law

Quote:
Originally Posted by sdowney717 View Post
I partly disdain the 'green attitude' cause it is so hypocritical.

Just a few quick examples

Like the raw sewage dumping into the water from city sewers yet boaters face huge fines or no dumping zones.

Like E10 fuel which is not green at all but it used to be pushed hard that way.
If you look into E10 it is really very environmentally destructive.

Like the new bulbs containing mercury which if they break send toxic voltilized mercury into the air. Mercury which environmentalists say is so bad they want to destroy the coal industry.
Energy from incandescent bulbs is not wasted as they do heat the house slightly. Energy from less efficient fridges is the same and that is an efficient heat pump, yet they tell you to stop using your old fridge and buy a new one to save power and the environment. That old fridge heats your house. the energy is not wasted.
If you aren't green already, sailing SF Bay will make you one. On New Years day 2 Harbor Porpoises were playing in our wake, jumping out of the water. They have been absent from the bay since 1939, and re-appeared a couple of years ago. Over the intervening decades, the bay was treated as a dumping ground and sewer until the 80s when things began to change. It's taken a good 30 years of work to get the water back to a quality where the bay is in sufficient health for them to return.

Sewage most definitely doesn't get poured into the bay untreated, except when a major storm overwhelms the plants.
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Old 13-01-2012, 15:46   #235
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Re: Washington State Copper Paint Law

just a quick look, and just a tiny amount of rain.

HARLEM — The 200 million gallons of raw sewage that flowed into the Hudson River after a fire at Harlem's North River Wastewater Treatment Plant last week has been described as "calamitous" and "devastating" by environmental advocates.
But spilling raw sewage into the waterway is nothing new for the plant, according to experts. In fact, every time it rains — even as little as half an inch — untreated waste is expelled into the river.


Read more: Raw Sewage in Hudson a 'Continuous Problem,' Experts Say - DNAinfo.com
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Old 13-01-2012, 15:48   #236
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Re: Washington State Copper Paint Law

Quote:
Originally Posted by sdowney717 View Post
I partly disdain the 'green attitude' cause it is so hypocritical.

Just a few quick examples

Like the raw sewage dumping into the water from city sewers yet boaters face huge fines or no dumping zones.

Like E10 fuel which is not green at all but it used to be pushed hard that way.
If you look into E10 it is really very environmentally destructive.

Like the new bulbs containing mercury which if they break send toxic voltilized mercury into the air. Mercury which environmentalists say is so bad they want to destroy the coal industry.
Energy from incandescent bulbs is not wasted as they do heat the house slightly. Energy from less efficient fridges is the same and that is an efficient heat pump, yet they tell you to stop using your old fridge and buy a new one to save power and the environment. That old fridge heats your house. the energy is not wasted.
In winter the heat from the bulbs does heat the house and you are right, it's not wasted. However, in summer, you are paying double - once for the waste heat, and again for the A/C to remove it, plus a bit more for the inefficiency of the A/C.

Same goes for the fridge.

I don't remember ever being TOLD to get a new fridge. I did get a leaflet offering me a REBATE for a new fridge.

Therefore go ahead, and swap out the CFLs for incandescents in autumn, and back to CFLs for the summer, and while you're at it keep the old fridge for winter.
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Old 13-01-2012, 15:49   #237
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Re: Washington State Copper Paint Law

Quote:
Originally Posted by sdowney717 View Post
just a quick look, and just a tiny amount of rain.

HARLEM — The 200 million gallons of raw sewage that flowed into the Hudson River after a fire at Harlem's North River Wastewater Treatment Plant last week has been described as "calamitous" and "devastating" by environmental advocates.
But spilling raw sewage into the waterway is nothing new for the plant, according to experts. In fact, every time it rains — even as little as half an inch — untreated waste is expelled into the river.


Read more: Raw Sewage in Hudson a 'Continuous Problem,' Experts Say - DNAinfo.com
I expect you're exactly the kind of person who will be complaining when they add a surcharge to your water bill for constructing a better treatment plant.
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Old 13-01-2012, 15:56   #238
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Re: Washington State Copper Paint Law

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I really don't understand why people use the title "green" as though it's wrong to care about the environment. In my mind the "non-green" should be very grateful that there are people who care enough about the environment to make it a priority in their lives, in particular if you care about the planet your grandchildren will live in.
I think that is a very fair question. I believe most people want to live in a clean place not a garbage dump. It is when laws like the one we are discussing are unfair or stupid that people get angry. It gives the green movement a bad name. My industry is fighting with the state of California right now over The California 2020 initiative. They want 90% electric homes and have no idea where the extra electricity is coming from. Just stupid.
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Old 13-01-2012, 22:21   #239
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Re: Washington State Copper Paint Law

I don't want anyone to get me wrong if there was running water and a working pumpout in all months and all temps I would be the first one to use them.

On bottom paint what is good for boats over 65 ft is good for our boat because the 65 ft boat owners know best about bottom paint, Follow the big guys and commercial boats.
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Old 13-01-2012, 22:29   #240
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Re: Washington State Copper Paint Law

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Really even easier for me. I am now out of the sound and moored in Oregon across the river from where I live. I am hauling this summer to paint the top sides and do a bottom paint. I will probably haul in Astoria as this is a do it yourself yard. Wonder what kind of paint I will use on the bottom?
Knock yourself out. But the law doesn't even take effect for 6 years.
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