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Old 09-05-2016, 15:28   #31
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Re: Tool for removing nuts on VERY long keel bolts

A few more comments on this: I am not sure what size these keel bolts are but they are not little bitty things as some people here are thinking. Now a general rule that millwrights use is ĺ inch bolt or bigger then use 3/4 drive to break it loose and torque it back on. I think itís fair to say that these are much bigger than ĺ.

The pass through sockets are basically junk tools, lightweight and pretty worthless in the bigger scheme of things. There is no extension for the pass through socket wrench. How you gonna extend it?

The idea of hot bending a pipe to make a socket will work just fine to remove a special sending unit from an engine block or something of that sort but will you put a couple hundred pound feet of torque on it? Think of loosening the Budd nuts on a tractor trailer. You do that with a hammered piece of pipe or a really good strong socket? I would never dream of putting a poorly fitting wrench on a bolt head that was not a throw-away and easy to remove with the torch, because you will probably need to use the torch anyway if something goes wrong.

This is a job for a big drive socket and you will have to build your own or have a machine shop do it for you. A good shop would charge an hour labor, no more, of you bring the parts or at least bring the socket or even two.
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Old 09-05-2016, 15:33   #32
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Re: Tool for removing nuts on VERY long keel bolts

Crow's foot wrench set :

Great deal on SK Hand Tool 42365 at ToolTopia.com

Use with long extension.
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Old 09-05-2016, 16:20   #33
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Re: Tool for removing nuts on VERY long keel bolts

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Originally Posted by um saudade View Post
A few more comments on this: I am not sure what size these keel bolts are but they are not little bitty things as some people here are thinking. Now a general rule that millwrights use is ĺ inch bolt or bigger then use 3/4 drive to break it loose and torque it back on. I think itís fair to say that these are much bigger than ĺ.

The pass through sockets are basically junk tools, lightweight and pretty worthless in the bigger scheme of things. There is no extension for the pass through socket wrench. How you gonna extend it?

...
The sole response to this is... maybe and maybe not. First, no need to speculate as to sizes or thinking, determining the correct size is easy. Drop a socket (bare sockets are all pass through) over the bolt to the nut. If the bolt will not pass through a 1/2" drive opening, try a 3/4" or even a 1" or simply use a box or open end (if one will fit in the space) to determine the bolt nut size. Once this is done the rest is simply a matter of research and economics. Buy a socket of sufficient size (including the drive opening) along with a correctly sized pass through extension or extensions of sufficient length, and a breaker bar and/or a ratchet of the correct size and adequate strength. Viola. As the alternative, determine the sizes and lengths and have the tools fabricated. OH, do not forget that depending on the details, including your physical location (nearby large boat yards, oil industry servicing, heavy manuacturing, mining, as examples) your problem is not unique, and you may be able to borrow, rent, or buy the perfect tools for the job.
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Old 09-05-2016, 18:09   #34
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Re: Tool for removing nuts on VERY long keel bolts

ďThe sole response to this is... maybe and maybe not. First, no need to speculate as to sizes or thinking, determining the correct size is easy. Drop a socket (bare sockets are all pass through) over the bolt to the nut. If the bolt will not pass through a 1/2" drive opening, try a 3/4" or even a 1" or simply use a box or open end (if one will fit in the space) to determine the bolt nut size. Once this is done the rest is simply a matter of research and economics. Buy a socket of sufficient size (including the drive opening) along with a correctly sized pass through extension or extensions of sufficient length, and a breaker bar and/or a ratchet of the correct size and adequate strength. Viola. As the alternative, determine the sizes and lengths and have the tools fabricated. OH, do not forget that depending on the details, including your physical location (nearby large boat yards, oil industry servicing, heavy manuacturing, mining, as examples) your problem is not unique, and you may be able to borrow, rent, or buy the perfect tools for the jobĒ.


Please explain what a pass through extension is. Never heard of it, never seen it, canít visualize how the bolt is going through the drive hole and then you use it for an extension at the same time? If you are talking about a socket that has an outside hex that can be driven with a wrench, those are specialty tools such as spark plug sockets, not regular sockets and I have yet to see an impact socket forged that way.

My rule stands and I am not speculating about drive sizes. When you get to bolts bigger than three quarters of an inch you generally need the bigger, beefier ĺ drive sockets and longer handles to deal with the torque. This is not rocket science and I will freely admit I have used BIG sockets on little tiny drive sets but I accepted the possibility of calamitous results.

I would not question the original owner as to his ability to determine the size of the nuts involved.

You are correct that someone else may have the tool. Another owner of the same boat might well have one. There is a possibility that a shop might have one. This would depend on how much time you wish to spend in locating a tool that should be a part of the boatís tool set. Then you borrow or rent but you still donít have the tool. I like to have the tools I need and if that means spending a few bucks to make a lifetime tool that stays with the boat, that makes sense to me.

You are not going to buy this off the shelf, It has no part number. It will be shop built by someone.

I could make the thing in my shop in less than an hour. It does not have to be a machine shop or a marine welding shop or an oilfield pipeline welder or any specialty anything. You just need someone with a lathe, a cut off saw and a some kind of welder and if you are really lucky the pipe to socket fit will be close enough to just weld. I never get that lucky hence I said mill to fit. TIG, or MIG or stick would all do the trick.
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Old 09-05-2016, 18:32   #35
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pirate Re: Tool for removing nuts on VERY long keel bolts

Box Spanners...
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Old 09-05-2016, 19:38   #36
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Re: Tool for removing nuts on VERY long keel bolts

All of the above suggestions would work.

There's plenty of pass through extensions. Heck, I've got one kicking around somewhere in my garage. They're hollow rods with the ends machined for the pass through sockets and wrenches.

Pic from sears's web site (the first google hit I got):


Now, if ya got a welder - of course weld a pipe to a socket. If you don't have one, maybe a pass-through would work. A crowsfoot may work but personally I don't like using them on stuff that's highly torqued, and they really don't measure tightening torque accurately.

Be interesting if the OP posts back with what they ended up doing.
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Old 09-05-2016, 20:56   #37
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Re: Tool for removing nuts on VERY long keel bolts

Ok, I guess I learned something new! But I could not find a pass through extension in anything buy 3/8 drive.

The box spanner is nice for taking the handles off of a bathtub fixture but they simply donít have the strength to do what needs doing here. My limited experience with keel bolts, even on fairly small sloops leads me to the conclusion that most are pretty darn big. Hang a couple tons of lead to the bottom of the boat and the bolts are good sized. I remember working with 1 and Ĺ inch sockets on a project boat and my own boat has either 9 or 11 bolts, I think, with 1 and 7/16 nuts.

This stuff all requires either big wrenches or a ĺ drive socket set.

Yes it will be interesting to see how it gets resolved. If Gamechanger (original poster) has not been driven off, it would be nice to know what size bolts and nuts he is dealing with on his Irwin.

I have been wrong before!
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Old 09-05-2016, 21:43   #38
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Re: Tool for removing nuts on VERY long keel bolts

Quote:
Originally Posted by um saudade View Post
[B]

Please explain what a pass through extension is. Never heard of it, never seen it, canít visualize how the bolt is going through the drive hole and then you use it for an extension at the same time? This is not rocket science and I will freely admit I have used BIG sockets on little tiny drive sets but I accepted the possibility of calamitous results.

I would not question the original owner as to his ability to determine the size of the nuts involved.

You are correct that someone else may have the tool. Another owner of the same boat might well have one. There is a possibility that a shop might have one. This would depend on how much time you wish to spend in locating a tool that should be a part of the boatís tool set. Then you borrow or rent but you still donít have the tool. I like to have the tools I need and if that means spending a few bucks to make a lifetime tool that stays with the boat, that makes sense to me.

You are not going to buy this off the shelf, It has no part number. It will be shop built by someone.

I could make the thing in my shop in less than an hour. It does not have to be a machine shop or a marine welding shop or an oilfield pipeline welder or any specialty anything. You just need someone with a lathe, a cut off saw and a some kind of welder and if you are really lucky the pipe to socket fit will be close enough to just weld. I never get that lucky hence I said mill to fit. TIG, or MIG or stick would all do the trick.
I do not wish to be overly caustic, but just because you have not heard of it does not mean it ain't so. As to your ability to make the tool, good! but not all of us have the equipment you mention, nor necessarily the experience or ability if we did.

I urge you to visit the original post and the earlier replies. Also visit the tool sites mentioned, or conduct a Google search for the term "pass through ratchet," and or "pass through" extension.

As to having a tool for a lifetime, many would agree (I have most of the wrenches and sockets I received for my 16th birthday, and I am now in my 70's) but others might not agree about a specialty tool they may only use once -it is a personal choice depending upon the individual, much like sailing itself and the many options that always exist once one leave the view of the public bureaucracy.

BTW, had you noticed the OP apparently would more or less share your take on the subject? 'Nuff said. -B
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