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16-05-2012, 17:19
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#16
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cat herder, extreme blacksheep
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: furycame alley , tropics, mexico for now
Boat: 1976 FORMOSA yankee clipper 41
Posts: 18,967
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Re: Tilting boat
Quote:
Originally Posted by troppo
Haha. At first I thought it was because the spare fuel tanks and spare water containers were on that side but when they were empty and I had extra water on the other side, the problem was still there.
Oh hang on. When I am on the port side it tilts that way and when I am on the other side it tilts to that side. Just because I weight 200 kg it should not be doing that, should it? Nah, joking. The problem is always the port side is lower and I have taken into consideration the moveable weight.
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200kg is a lot of weight. way lot of weight. ye tall also????
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16-05-2012, 17:38
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#17
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cruiser
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Tampa Bay area
Boat: Hunter 31'
Posts: 5,731
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Re: Tilting Boat
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ex-Calif
If I really wanted to get after this I would remove everything from the boat that is not nailed down. I would then stick a bubble level on the transom, the longer the level the better.
I would then evaluate what isn't removed and where it is located. Galley on one side? What does the galley cabinetry weigh? Battery location? Mast straight?
If everything check out good I would make a mental note one how I prefer to load the boat.
One my small boat crew position is way more important than basic boat trim. And don't think it doesn't matter on bigger boats either. I've seen 47 footers in races butt down cuz 8 people are in the cockpit.
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Thanks, but I'm familiar with the contents of my boat and where everything is, and it isn't accounted for by what is on the boat. As I said, the great bulk of storage is on the PORT side. There's also a 35 gallon water tank on the port side. When the water tank is down and I'm relatively low on diesel (much smaller, 18 gal tank), the boat still tilts, and it tilts the same amount. Whatever is on the boat is having a negligible effect on this. The mast itself is straight. The whole boat tilts.
Based on these observations, I would not undertake the huge task you propose (it's a live-aboard boat). I, and a marine surveyor, and a naval architect have all looked at this.
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16-05-2012, 17:41
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#18
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cruiser
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Tampa Bay area
Boat: Hunter 31'
Posts: 5,731
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Re: Tilting Boat
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ex-Calif
If I really wanted to get after this I would remove everything from the boat that is not nailed down. I would then stick a bubble level on the transom, the longer the level the better.
I would then evaluate what isn't removed and where it is located. Galley on one side? What does the galley cabinetry weigh? Battery location? Mast straight?
If everything check out good I would make a mental note one how I prefer to load the boat.
One my small boat crew position is way more important than basic boat trim. And don't think it doesn't matter on bigger boats either. I've seen 47 footers in races butt down cuz 8 people are in the cockpit.
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OK I don't think you're really getting all of this. There's just me on this boat. If I'm OFF the boat it still tilts. You couldn't fit 8 people on this boat -- big living space = smaller cockpit. Four's the limit, but this has been observed by many people when I'm not on.
I appreciate the feedback, but I'm past trying to fix it. it's not a performance issue and the boat is structurally sound. It's just a weird fact about my boat.
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16-05-2012, 17:49
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#19
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Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Ohio
Boat: Now boatless :-(
Posts: 11,580
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rakuflames
Thanks, but I'm familiar with the contents of my boat and where everything is, and it isn't accounted for by what is on the boat. As I said, the great bulk of storage is on the PORT side. There's also a 35 gallon water tank on the port side. When the water tank is down and I'm relatively low on diesel (much smaller, 18 gal tank), the boat still tilts, and it tilts the same amount. Whatever is on the boat is having a negligible effect on this. The mast itself is straight. The whole boat tilts.
Based on these observations, I would not undertake the huge task you propose (it's a live-aboard boat). I, and a marine surveyor, and a naval architect have all looked at this.
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Sorry - responded to the wrong post. Meant to respond to Troppo.
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16-05-2012, 18:10
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#20
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Rockhampton, Australia
Boat: No boat, looking again.
Posts: 360
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Re: Tilting boat
Quote:
Originally Posted by zeehag
200kg is a lot of weight. way lot of weight. ye tall also????
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Hahahah. That's good.
Just because I have a plank running from the v-berth to the quarter berth to give a flat stretch of 15 feet don't mean I am tall. : ).
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16-05-2012, 18:13
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#21
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: B.C.,Canada
Boat: 29'
Posts: 2,423
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Re: Tilting Boat
It is possible that the hull is not equal-sided too, so a measure from keel to sheer might be in order. IE: the mast IS square to the deck but the deck is attached to an unequal hull...
OR the chopper gun went wild on one side..=weight. ...or the resin was kicking off and so was thicker....(late on a Friday and nobody wanted to open a new barrel).
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16-05-2012, 18:13
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#22
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cruiser
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Tampa Bay area
Boat: Hunter 31'
Posts: 5,731
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Re: Tilting boat
Quote:
Originally Posted by troppo
Hahahah. That's good.
Just because I have a plank running from the v-berth to the quarter berth to give a flat stretch of 15 feet don't mean I am tall. : ).
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Maybe you're just a restless sleeper.
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16-05-2012, 18:15
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#23
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cruiser
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Tampa Bay area
Boat: Hunter 31'
Posts: 5,731
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Re: Tilting Boat
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappySeagull
It is possible that the hull is not equal-sided too, so a measure from keel to sheer might be in order. IE: the mast IS square to the deck but the deck is attached to an unequal hull...
OR the chopper gun went wild on one side..=weight. ...or the resin was kicking off and so was thicker....(late on a Friday and nobody wanted to open a new barrel).
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I'll never know. It's just one of life's mysteries!
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16-05-2012, 18:16
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#24
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Rockhampton, Australia
Boat: No boat, looking again.
Posts: 360
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Re: Tilting Boat
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ex-Calif
Sorry - responded to the wrong post. Meant to respond to Troppo.
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I took it as to me : ) [troppo]. Seeing as I am gunna do quite a bit of cleaning and fixing and the boat is small, I reckon I might end up taking off the heavy stuff and doing the bubble level thing. That plus check the mast. With my background in small boats, even kayaks, I know how where the weight goes can be critical.
I will be re-organising the storage on Windchaser so I may as well do some checking of where the weight is now. Like the battery is on the port side but I want to put another one in and I think I will move both to somewhere central.
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16-05-2012, 18:21
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#25
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Rockhampton, Australia
Boat: No boat, looking again.
Posts: 360
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Re: Tilting Boat
This is a bit off topic, sorry Troppo. [oh, that's me so it's ok].
There used to be a tourist boat that went over to the Keppel islands and when over there the captain would put out boom nets and people would scramble down and hold on as the water rushed over them. Lots of fun.
One day the boat suddenly tilted seriously with one boom net lifting right up. It tilted because many of the people on board suddenly rushed to the other side. That was the side the lady had just lost her bikini to the rushing water.
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19-05-2012, 03:33
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#26
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Rockhampton, Australia
Boat: No boat, looking again.
Posts: 360
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Re: Tilting Boat
Well, I went out to my boat today and used the mainsail halyard from side to side to see if there was any difference. Bit hard to tell with the stretch in the rope but I am thinking there could be an inch difference. That does not seem much. Would that be enough to tilt the boat?
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19-05-2012, 08:48
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#27
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֍֎֍֎֍֎֍֎֍֎
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 15,136
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Re: Tilting Boat
It is not uncommon for boats to not be dead level.
The mast could be leaning to one side (measure for center on deck, while you're doing the halyard measuring) or it might even have been installed slightly off-center. Nothing's impossible.
But most commonly this is because there is variation in the weight of fiberglass layups, so one side of the boat might be heavier than the other, along with the weight differences from having heads, bulkheads, nav stations, electrical panels, all sorts of options installed. It would cost time and money for a builder to add those all up and balance the trim of each boat during the build.
So you poke around, measure whatever you can, and if your boat simply is out of balance, you either move things around, or add ballast (preferably lead since it will take up less space) or add equipment (extra battery<G>) to trim it out.
Or accept the lean, and recognize that's probably why you'll be slightly faster on one tack than on the other, among other things.
Once you fix the lean, you can work on the fore-and-aft trim. That one makes a speed difference too, depending on water conditions, so you need to be able to work that one in real time.
Of course, if you have really bad luck, a lean that you can't explain and can't trim out just might be caused by a keel problem. Keel damaged in grounding, keel rebedded lopsided...if there's nothing else that explains it and you can't trim it out, the keel IS literally the 800# gorilla in this scene.
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23-05-2012, 16:18
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#28
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Rockhampton, Australia
Boat: No boat, looking again.
Posts: 360
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Re: Tilting Boat
Did what Atoll suggested, drop a plumb bob from underneath the middle section of the mast step in the cabin down to the bilge. The boat was being held side-on to the wind by the tide so that may have encouraged the lean. I have yet to take everything out but I had moved some water containers to the higher side to see if it would even out. Still more to be done to find the reason.
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23-05-2012, 16:38
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#29
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Senior Cruiser
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: gettin naughty on the beach in cornwall
Boat: 63 custom alloy sloop,macwester26,prout snowgoose 37 elite catamaran!
Posts: 10,594
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Re: Tilting Boat
Quote:
Originally Posted by troppo
Did what Atoll suggested, drop a plumb bob from underneath the middle section of the mast step in the cabin down to the bilge. The boat was being held side-on to the wind by the tide so that may have encouraged the lean. I have yet to take everything out but I had moved some water containers to the higher side to see if it would even out. Still more to be done to find the reason.
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must be the 150 kg of coke the last owners concealed in the hull then lost their nerve when it came to selling it
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23-05-2012, 17:18
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#30
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Rockhampton, Australia
Boat: No boat, looking again.
Posts: 360
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Re: Tilting Boat
Quote:
Originally Posted by atoll
must be the 150 kg of coke the last owners concealed in the hull then lost their nerve when it came to selling it
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Nah, it was a bale of green leafy stuff which I fed to my guinea pigs. Still, even with that out there is still the lean.
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