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Old 15-12-2014, 09:22   #901
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Re: The Yard Guys

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Originally Posted by Polux View Post
Regarding crossing Oceans a well built boat is very important but also stability, as it is proved by that IP38 rolled several times and this recent case of an aluminium passage maker that was rolled and sunk. In what regards stability, price for price and in what regards new boats mass market main boats offer a lot more compared with the so called "bluewater brands" that in Europe are called luxury boats (nothing wrong in luxury, I love it)
Tao : sauvetage réussi en plein Atlantique
Do you have a link giving us details on the IP 38? Mr. Google doesn't want to provide one.

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Old 15-12-2014, 09:33   #902
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Re: The Yard Guys

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Do you have a link giving us details on the IP 38? Mr. Google doesn't want to provide one.

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Old 15-12-2014, 09:36   #903
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Re: The Yard Guys

I wonder to, any link about the ip 38 roll!! by the way, this cases only prove one thing, the north atlantic is serious stuff.

Im actually installing a new Facnor furler in a Pogo 10,5, got some pictures, the boat is well build it but seriously, not for cruising, its a racing baby with some cruising considerations but not even close to be a long term cruising boat, we arrive this morning at the boat and found the Carbon mast without any UV coating, bare carbón , and start to degradate in some points along the spar, very fast i guess, Owner swear to hit 15 knts regularly. Cheers.
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Old 15-12-2014, 10:22   #904
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Re: The Yard Guys

So, these yard guys post these photos and say "keel repair and preparation", and "hull repair and preparation" - but this is an Oyster! It is "one of the highest quality boats in the world" - and the standard of blue water yachts!

So...

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I promise myself not fed the trolls, nvm, i just see a nice Oyster with a recent painting job in the bottom?
Okay. They said "repair". What were they repairing? Stress cracks in these areas? Blisters? Osmosis damage? Delam? What?

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The question was, have you seen your boat when a bottom job was done (or maybe you have never had a bottom job done).

What did the prep look like (if you ever had one done)?

Were you there when it was done?

Your propensity for hyperbole stretches the credulity line. Most people (who have seen bottom jobs prepared) would comment about the fact care was taken to prep it properly.

As opposed to your comments as if to indicate that there was a major issue of some sort by innuendo. Dude, not kosher. Call the real things, don't do it in the manner that conspiracy theorists do, innuendo and bravado. Unless, of course, that is the image you feel important to enhance.
avb is now a Yard Guy that has the knowledge and experience to challenge the documented work of other professional Yard Guys? Okay.

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The photo captions say keel/hull/rudder "repair & maintenance" on an Oyster so Smack got all excited. Probably been Googling for days to find that one. At the very most it just looks like some pretty standard fill & fairing work prior to sanding for bottom paint, or maybe not even that. Just like another caption that says "propeller maintenance" and the photo shows a shiny prop that's been buffed. I can't wait to tell a noob never to buy a boat that requires this sort of "extensive" maintenance.

But this is supposed to demonstrate that one of the highest quality boats in the world is no different from Smack's Hunter -- or maybe Hunter's & other production boats don't require bottom jobs -- or something like that. Gettin' old, ain't it.
The fact that they use "maintenance" in some photos and "repair" in others doesn't count for anything? Remember, this is a company in the UK so I assume they have a fairly strong command of the English language. I'm betting that they understand the difference in the terms.

So, if it's an Oyster, there can't possibly be anything wrong with it - despite the photos and captions from qualified Yard Guys?

This is why the BWC arguments are not just silly - they are dangerous.

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Honestly all I see in those pics is a paint job being prepped but one must ask why extra attention is needed around the skin fittings and metal bits... overzinked maybe... well I zink so anyway..
Exactly. That would be the question...if, that is, one isn't blindly following the BWC.
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Old 15-12-2014, 10:34   #905
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Re: The Yard Guys

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Nope, nothing on that link about the IP38 that rolled.
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Old 15-12-2014, 10:37   #906
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Re: The Yard Guys

I just see a well Oyster with some primer spots in the trhu hulls . bow truster and keel áreas, nothing wrong with that, perhaps you have the repair pictures, no?
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Old 15-12-2014, 10:42   #907
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Re: The Yard Guys

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.....
avb is now a Yard Guy that has the knowledge and experience to challenge the documented work of other professional Yard Guys? Okay.......
Nope, not at all. But have consulted to many dealerships with bodyshops and know prep when I see it. Including the prep my yard did on my boat and others. The techniques are very similar, the compounds used are different.

So, the unanswered question remains, have YOU ever seen YOUR boat prepped. Have you ever had a bottom job done on your boat?

Have you been in a yard when someone elses boat was prepped?

Or is there a reason you are avoiding an answer.
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Old 15-12-2014, 10:48   #908
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Re: The Yard Guys

Lol, maintenance and repair, could be from a small blíster to spot primer sanded gelcoat , new truhulls ? primer. Where is the Oyster falling apart?
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Old 15-12-2014, 11:18   #909
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Re: The Yard Guys

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I just see a well Oyster with some primer spots in the trhu hulls . bow truster and keel áreas, nothing wrong with that, perhaps you have the repair pictures, no?
Well here is an example that is interesting to me:



The long, horizontal fill/prime along the keel. What is that line? Have you seen similar issues with other boats? Could there have been an issue at this joint?

So, yes, I know these are primer/fill spots. But they point to "deeper" work that was done beyond simply repainting the bottom. What was that work and why did it need to be done?

As El Pinguino says - one must ask. Even if it's an Oyster,
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Old 15-12-2014, 11:24   #910
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Re: The Yard Guys

Not really, quite comon to fill the keel joint with some caulking and spot primer, the Oyster have a masive keel stub and the keel is troughbolted to this stub, nothing wrong or weird Smack, this week we splash a bene 50 in the wáter, we opt for lift the boat in the crane and fill the small gap at the aft trailing edeg in the keel with some caulking , antifouling and ready ... do you call this a repair job or something like that?
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Old 15-12-2014, 11:26   #911
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Re: The Yard Guys

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Not really, quite comon to fill the keel joint with some caulking and spot primer, the Oyster have a masive keel stub and the keel is troughbolted to this stub, nothing wrong or weird Smack, this week we splash a bene 50 in the wáter, we opt for lift the boat in the crane and fill the small gap at the aft trailing edeg in the keel with some caulking , antifouling and ready ... do you call this a repair job or something like that?
I'll go with whatever you want call it since you're actually the Yard Guy that did the work. I trust your word. And I have absolutely no reason to discount it.

I apply the same standard to these other Yard Guys as well. They said "repair".
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Old 15-12-2014, 11:28   #912
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Re: The Yard Guys

They say repair, then we dont see any actual repair,so i take for granted spot primer and antifouling job, repair? for some dudes could be repair, to me is just another bottom prep job, Google, C&C keel smile. Quite normal in fin keels...
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Old 15-12-2014, 11:31   #913
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Re: The Yard Guys

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They say repair, then we dont see any actual repair,so i take for granted spot primer and antifouling job, repair? for some dudes could be repair, to me is just another bottom prep job, Google, C&C keel smile. Quite normal in fin keels...
Cheers.
Exactly. Thanks.
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Old 15-12-2014, 12:11   #914
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Re: The Yard Guys

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Do you have a link giving us details on the IP 38? Mr. Google doesn't want to provide one.
'Thank God we're alive!' says skipper - Yachting Monthly

Note that I am not saying by any means that the Island Pack 38 is not a seaworthy boat for his type in what regards stability. I am saying that in what regards new boats or recent used boats a mass market boat of the same price would be a much bigger boat with more stability.

Regarding the actual catalog from Island Packet the IP37 would be the equivalent boat. The IP 37 has a Loa of 37'10'' but a LWL of only 31'0', costs USD 429 950 about the same price of a Jeanneau 50DS that has a LOA of 49'5'' and a LWL of 43'0''.

The 50ft Jeanneau will have a much bigger stability and will be muck more difficult to knock down or roll then the similar priced Island Packet 37.

All small boats (meaning small yachts till 70ft or so) can be rolled, given the circumstances, but the ones with more stability (and that is connected with size) will be generally harder to capsize then the smaller ones.

That's just what I wanted to point out regarding a discussion about bluewater boats, where the money one has for a boat is an important part of the equation. The ones that don't have limits on a budget for a boat are very few, normally there is a limited budget and for one that wants a new boat the budget for a IP37 is similar to the one for a 50ft Jeanneau.
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Old 15-12-2014, 12:24   #915
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Re: The Yard Guys

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'Thank God we're alive!' says skipper - Yachting Monthly

Note that I am not saying by any means that the Island Pack 38 is not a seaworthy boat for his type in what regards stability. I am saying that in what regards new boats or recent used boats a mass market boat of the same price would be a much bigger boat with more stability.

Regarding the actual catalog from Island Packet the IP37 would be the equivalent boat. The IP 37 has a Loa of 37'10'' but a LWL of only 31'0', costs USD 429 950 about the same price of a Jeanneau 50DS that has a LOA of 49'5'' and a LWL of 43'0''.

The 50ft Jeanneau will have a much bigger stability and will be muck more difficult to knock down or roll then the similar priced Island Packet 37.

All small boats (meaning small yachts till 70ft or so) can be rolled, given the circumstances, but the ones with more stability (and that is connected with size) will be generally harder to capsize then the smaller ones.

That's just what I wanted to point out regarding a discussion about bluewater boats, where the money one has for a boat is an important part of the equation. The ones that don't have limits on a budget for a boat are very few, normally there is a limited budget and for one that wants a new boat the budget for a IP37 is similar to the one for a 50ft Jeanneau.
Thanks for that link Pol.

"Why British crew abandoned their yacht 400 miles NW of Ireland" - Because the much touted "comfort factor" and "safety in a storm" assurances may not be what the BWC tries to make them out to be.
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