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Old 14-08-2008, 14:06   #1
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Tearing Out The Nav Station - Ideas??

Ok, so winter is just around the corner for us in the Northern Hemisphere.

I am preparing to install the Little Cod wood stove in our new catamaran.

I have located only two areas that it could even possibly work. Those are: 1) In place of a hanging locker we have on the bridge deck and 2) In place of our nav station which is completely unused.

I have selected the nav station option because it's down lower (heat rises) and is unused. We use the hanging locker all the time.

I started to carefully disassemble the nav station and have run into some issues. Let me just start by saying wood work is not my forte (notice it's not listed on my website!! ha ha!!)

Anyway, I have started taking out all the brass screws holding my nav station between a couple of hanging lockers and onto the cabin sole.

As I got way to the back, I noticed that both the desktop of the nav station and the housing for the 3 drawers that goes with the nav station are glassed to the hull!

Not only that, every single little piece of wood work is both glued and screwed with brass screws that look brand new. This makes it challenging to take them apart - I already cracked a piece of trim!

Does anyone know if:

1) it is OK to cut through the tabbing of the desktop and the drawer structure with an angle grinder or something to release them from the hull?

2) there is any way to release the little pieces of wood that form the nav station from each other, considering they are glued and screwed?


My overall plan is to keep the nav station and have it be simple to install again, should I (for some reason) have to sell the boat.

PS: I bought a boat that was overbuilt and solid... Didn't imagine that could be a *problem*, but it is! ha ha
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Old 14-08-2008, 14:32   #2
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If it's tabbed in it might be that it helps the rigidity of the hull.
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Old 14-08-2008, 14:37   #3
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If it's tabbed in it might be that it helps the rigidity of the hull.

That was my concern as well.

It is part of a series of cabinetry that runs from a forward bulkhead (main support for entire vessel including the chainplates) to the bulkhead that is between our main living area and the head.

The forces it would seem to resist would be forces that would fold the bow up to the stern, breaking the boat in half, with the crack from the breakage running across the beam of the boat.

The odd part is that everything - all cabinetry - is tabbed in.

Sure wish I could figure this out...

Winter is coming, and we will surely need heat!
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Old 14-08-2008, 15:56   #4
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Sully,

Short answer - cut the fiberglass and pull the table. Use a chisel from the bottom to pull fiddles off. Use a wood block when hammering right on wood to keep from marring it.

Long answer - Most counter-top-style assemblies on boats are bonded to the hull with wide fiberglass tape. It's rare for furniture (which you nav table is) to be structural. Generally, boat layouts are figured and installed around the necessary structural bulkheads. Rather than use wooden cleats screwed into the hull, and then screwed in to furniture to hold it in place, it's easiest to just "glue" them with fiberglass. Strong, doesn't require fasteners, and is damn easy. So just cut the fiberglass with a box-cutter razor, or angle grinder if that won't do it, and pull it apart.

Best of luck!
Aaron N.
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Old 14-08-2008, 16:05   #5
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Hi Sean:

When taking the trim apart is helpful to have a number of wooden wedges. Start by removing scres. (brass screws shear easily) then take a chisel and start to pry out the trim. when you have enough space for a shim put it in and then slide the chisel down adding shims as you go. If the trim doesn't come off it is probably pinned. Try and figure what is pinning it and then remove that piece first. It is hard to take apart nice trim w/o breaking something. There are some nice tools that we in the Peoples republik of Kalifornia refer to as flat bars or wonder bars that make it easy to get behnd the wood. Good luck.
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Old 14-08-2008, 16:06   #6
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I would say if it's tabbed in it is probably srtuctural.
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Old 14-08-2008, 16:10   #7
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Thanks, Aaron!

I had the nagging worry that it could be partially structural, but even just one post to rest my fears is enough!

I'll start tearing it out right now!

Just hope my bumbling woodworking skills won't destroy it. I'll try (as you suggest) to use a chisel to break out the glue and to use something to soften my hammer blows.

Thanks again...

Quote:
Originally Posted by blahman View Post
Sully,

Short answer - cut the fiberglass and pull the table. Use a chisel from the bottom to pull fiddles off. Use a wood block when hammering right on wood to keep from marring it.

Long answer - Most counter-top-style assemblies on boats are bonded to the hull with wide fiberglass tape. It's rare for furniture (which you nav table is) to be structural. Generally, boat layouts are figured and installed around the necessary structural bulkheads. Rather than use wooden cleats screwed into the hull, and then screwed in to furniture to hold it in place, it's easiest to just "glue" them with fiberglass. Strong, doesn't require fasteners, and is damn easy. So just cut the fiberglass with a box-cutter razor, or angle grinder if that won't do it, and pull it apart.

Best of luck!
Aaron N.
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Old 14-08-2008, 16:12   #8
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Hi Sean:

When taking the trim apart is helpful to have a number of wooden wedges. Start by removing scres. (brass screws shear easily) then take a chisel and start to pry out the trim. when you have enough space for a shim put it in and then slide the chisel down adding shims as you go. If the trim doesn't come off it is probably pinned. Try and figure what is pinning it and then remove that piece first. It is hard to take apart nice trim w/o breaking something. There are some nice tools that we in the Peoples republik of Kalifornia refer to as flat bars or wonder bars that make it easy to get behnd the wood. Good luck.
Ha ha ha!! People's Republik of KA... ha ha !

I will try this method as well.

Thank you.

PS: PM me if you need any more help on that WiFi setup. It should all be there now - Buffalo, Antenna and Amplifier.
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Old 14-08-2008, 16:20   #9
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Sean I just thought of one more thing. If you can get to the area that is glued run a utility knife along the edge and do this multiple times until you cut most of the glue. I'll let you know when I go to install the wifi.

Charlie
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Old 14-08-2008, 16:32   #10
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I would tear it out and put that wood stove in before you freeze your ass off. If you think the structural integrity will be breached, try to do something that will compensate for your evil deed.

Be sure to take pictures and post. I especially like heating with wood.

PS. I guess you will have to remove the water tanks to make room for the chain saw and "Monster Maul"

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Old 14-08-2008, 16:59   #11
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Ha ha ha...

Good idea, Paul.

I started taking pictures today. I'll post some "before and after" shots.

Right now, I'm demo-ing the nav station. I snapped a photo of it mostly still intact.

I'll snap a photo of the empty space, then photos of the building of the heat shielding, Little Cod installation, chimney and final product.

Stay tuned!


Quote:
Originally Posted by Morgan Paul View Post
I would tear it out and put that wood stove in before you freeze your ass off. If you think the structural integrity will be breached, try to do something that will compensate for your evil deed.

Be sure to take pictures and post. I especially like heating with wood.

PS. I guess you will have to remove the water tanks to make room for the chain saw and "Monster Maul"

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Old 14-08-2008, 18:21   #12
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Just use the monster maul for the removal job. much quicker and you'll have some wood for the stove!!
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Old 14-08-2008, 19:04   #13
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Joinery tabbed to the hull (as it should be) adds rigidity and you need to consider that removing it would allow the hull to flex at that point and flexing ultimately leads to failure.

All the joinery on Shiva was tabbed to the hull and this is especially important near areas where there are chain plates and lots of rigging loads which will be distorting the hull without the lateral stiffening, which is where the tabbed in joinery is important.

With that in mind decide how important the joinery is in THAT location before you remove it.
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Old 14-08-2008, 20:37   #14
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I love my fine FEIN for this kinda work
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Old 14-08-2008, 22:11   #15
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Most wood glues are disolved by alcohol. You can take a syringe and inject it into the joints. The syringes for this are sold at most good wood working shop. If they used epoxy, you are on your own.
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