Teak Toe Rail Advice

[Jim Cate]

I won't get into the bare vs varnish vs paint vs remove tussle, but from memory of the time when I had a low teak toe rail, I'd advise to use a durable and non-fussy finish. Toe rails, by their nature, take a continual beating, and are about the hardest bit of trim on the boat to keep pretty. If you have any hardware mounted on them (chocks, cleats, pad eyes, etc) then re-coating is a PITA, for a good job demands removal of all of that stuff and subsequent re bedding and re installing. So, think carefully of times yet to come when you would like to be sailing instead of refinishing the toe rail!

Jim

[MarkSF]

The only satisfactory way to proceed is 10 coats of quality spar varnish, sanding between coats.

The suggestion of having to choose between sailing and varnishing is fallacious. Usually brought up by people with neglected brightwork.

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by MarkSF

The only satisfactory way to proceed is 10 coats of quality spar varnish, sanding between coats.

The suggestion of having to choose between sailing and varnishing is fallacious. Usually brought up by people with neglected brightwork.

Or, as in this case, those with perforated aluminium toe rails...

Jim

[The Way]

Originally Posted by fjwiley1

PS.....be sure your "Epoxy" has UV protection. All epoxies do not.
Not to expensive is Minwax Spar Varnish....has UV protection.

BUT -- Minwax labels it "clear" but it has coloring in it -- makes the teak too orange for my taste.

Fair winds,
Jack

[IdoraKeeper]

Consider wet sanding with fine grit paper. Just get the hose running at a low volume..the water will wash that black gunk out as you sand. Depending on your climate, the epoxy first option may work...really the thing is, once you have it cleaned up and sealed you need to maintain the finish at an interval sufficient to keep it nice.

[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

Or, as in this case, those with perforated aluminium toe rails...



Jim

I wish my boat didn't have any exterior teak, really it's beautiful on other peoples boats though
But the boat we both liked had teak, so I feel almost honor bound to try to maintain it (that may change)


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[rbrentp]

Try Teakguard. I use it on my teak rub rail. DO NOT SAND! They have a cleaner you spritz on and hit with a plastic brush. The gray is bacteria poop. It eats teak oil. Varnish and many other coatings cannot survive on teak because the pores are filled with moisture and expand a lot in the sun. When the varnish gets older and brittle the expansion makes it pop and gives those little pin holes that begin the process of peeling and sanding. The teakguard is a synthetic teak oil the bugs can't eat. Takes about four hours the first time to do the rail around my 30ft cat. After that about an hour once or twice a year to put on a new coat. Never cracks, looks great. I use it on all my teak. I wish I had invented the stuff.

[Wind Souls]

After years of using different suppliers of teak finishes, I have concluded with a product called, "Honey Teak". This acrylic clear or stain type of finish outlasts another products I have ever used. The application labor involved is considerably less and the finish can be reapplied in areas that become damaged or scuffed by just cleaning, lightly sanding and applying. Check it out and you won't be disappointed.
PS: Oh yes, it is not petroleum based, so spilled oil or gasoline will not remove the finish. In addition, it can stand up to 2000 degree temps; no cigarette burns here.
Fair Sailing,
Richard

[HappyMdRSailor]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

I won't get into the bare vs varnish vs paint vs remove tussle, but from memory of the time when I had a low teak toe rail, I'd advise to use a durable and non-fussy finish. Toe rails, by their nature, take a continual beating, and are about the hardest bit of trim on the boat to keep pretty. If you have any hardware mounted on them (chocks, cleats, pad eyes, etc) then re-coating is a PITA, for a good job demands removal of all of that stuff and subsequent re bedding and re installing. So, think carefully of times yet to come when you would like to be sailing instead of refinishing the toe rail!

Jim

Jim's advice is spot on here.... Toe rails get the shiznit beat outta them...
Out of all of the products I've tried and used, Starbright Tropical gives the best satisfactory results...

The main problem with a high gloss "barrier" style finish is that you're going to have the water intrusion and coating lifting in hardware and deck interface as Jim states... It looks SPECTACULAR for a couple months... But what a maintenance nightmare...

You've got plenty of wood to work with... Don't be afraid to get aggressive with the sander... Take a peak at what Starbright looks like here on my 33 OI...

[HappyMdRSailor]

Originally Posted by Wind Souls

After years of using different suppliers of teak finishes, I have concluded with a product called, "Honey Teak". This acrylic clear or stain type of finish outlasts another products I have ever used. The application labor involved is considerably less and the finish can be reapplied in areas that become damaged or scuffed by just cleaning, lightly sanding and applying. Check it out and you won't be disappointed.
PS: Oh yes, it is not petroleum based, so spilled oil or gasoline will not remove the finish. In addition, it can stand up to 2000 degree temps; no cigarette burns here.
Fair Sailing,
Richard

Welcome to CF Richard!!!
(good stuff)

[malbert73]

Originally Posted by MarkSF

The only satisfactory way to proceed is 10 coats of quality spar varnish, sanding between coats.

The suggestion of having to choose between sailing and varnishing is fallacious. Usually brought up by people with neglected brightwork.

Cool. You want to do mine? What you describe is a good 4-5 days of labor spread out over 10 days if you have perfect weather. Add in a job, regular boat maintenance, and many folks won't do that at cost of sailing time and time for maintaining more essential systems. Would you rather sail on well maintained boat with cetol or Semco finish, or poorly maintained boat with sparkling bright work?
That said, I have nice bright work on my boat with sunbrella covers for everything so could possibly do that. Just debating endless cycle of bright work as "the only right way" when everyone knows boats are endless cycle of work.


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[MarkSF]

Yes that's true, 2 coats a day equals 5 days. But once done, it's a couple of days a year to do a maintenance coat on my boat. Light sand, mask, 2 coats, one in the morning, one in the afternoon. I usually do the prep in the afternoon, and the two coats the next day. So that's a day and a half. Easily done in a weekend with plenty of time for tea and reading.

[darylat8750]

Originally Posted by MarkSF

The only satisfactory way to proceed is 10 coats of quality spar varnish, sanding between coats.

The suggestion of having to choose between sailing and varnishing is fallacious. Usually brought up by people with neglected brightwork.

Yes! It's neglected on my boat because it's too much bloody work.

I'm to the point where I'm happiest with just a little bright trim that I can rub down with a fine Scotchbright pad and top coat the varnish in an hour or so. In a perfect world it would be easier to mask off than my hand rails but that is the hand I've been dealt.

[Roy M]

I am currently overhauling my exterior, and the teak is part of that process. The hatch coamings, handrails and companionway entry webs are all getting a makeover after 35+ years. The coamings are nearly complete. First I sanded them down to bare, clear wood grain (see picture), then chemically bleached with a 1-2 punch of sodium hydroxide solution followed by oxalic acid solution. Then I sanded to 220 grit, then sealed the wood with West System 105 resin and 207 Special Hardener. This was followed up by a couple layers more of epoxy to achieve a super smooth finish. After I complete my nonskid painting of the decks, I will cover the epoxy with 2-3 coats of Sterling Clear LPU to make it look unbearably beautiful. Then, because I hope to go to tropical climes soon, I intend to cover the sanded clear coat with one or two layers of Cloud White LPU to protect the clear finish from UV degradation. The 207 hardener has UV protection, as does the clear LPU, but no one has developed a clear coating that is as durable as an opaque, light reflecting sacrificial cover of LPU. So, should I ever wish to restore the glorious teak trim appearance, I will only need to sand off the topcoat and reseal with a coat or two of clear LPU.

By the way, I have used this combination (without the opaque top coat, of course) on another, non marine (though it was designed by Olin Stephens, standing beside the trunk) project I was involved with.

[sailcrazy]

We have a Taswell 43, with teak caprail and deck. We've had some black areas on our caprail that first appreared shortly after we had the caprail replaced in Phuket, Thailand. I finally scraped the varnish off, hoping the open air would allow the moisture/mold/?? to disipate and go away....while it looked better for a few weeks, the black always came back and actually seemed to be getting larger. I finally made some assorted teak bungs-from 1/2" to 11/2" diam, filed down the OD of some hole saws so they were just slightly smaller (OD) than the respective bungs, and went after the black. Turns out each black area was trapped moisture under the varnish, and had turned to rotten, or at least soft and discolored, wood!!! As several of the bad areas were previous bungs over the caprail bolts-that were set to close to the surface, I ended up cutting/grinding off the tapered heads of those bolts, digging down approx. 1/2" below the cut-off head, filling the cavity with West system epoxy, slightly hollowing out the bottom of the replacement bung, and then epoxying in a new bung over top of the bolt stub. When all the black wood was replaced and the bungs sanded down flush, I resanded the entire caprail (#80, #100, #120) and put on 2 coats of Semco Teak Sealer. It's been about 6 weeks since I completed the work, and the caprail still looks good!
If you have black wood--suspect rotten wood or mold, and replace it! Covering it with a finish that traps the moisture and prevents the wood from breathing will just make it worse--I've seen that process in action!
PS-I made a "template" board with a hole for each size bung/hole saw I made. Then I removed the center drill from each hole saw. When you're working on the cap rail, just lay the "template" over the area and hold it in place with your foot or other hand. Put the hole saw into the template hole and drill your new bung hole. That way the drill cuts only where you want it to, and does not skip all across the caprail.....ask me how I know!!!