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Old 02-07-2016, 10:34   #1
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teak deck removal + glassing over epoxy filled holes

I am currently removing the teak deck, or more correctly having it removed and not sure if the deck needs glassed over in its entirety.

The plan is to fill the old screw holes with epoxy resin both to fill the holes and permeate the plywood core in the event that there is some degradation. If there are instances of rot then it needs to come out, but I am hoping that epoxy infection will suffice for the majority of the deck

Some bolt holes will be epoxy filled as well as the screw holes, and a few non-used fittings filled with glass

The question is if the entire deck area needs glassed over, or can I just paint antiskid over the epoxy filled holes. I have been told by the PO that simply painting over the exoxy will not do as the screw holes will show even through the antiskid. I am a bit skeptical but would appreciate any experienced input

The other question is if I should be compensating for the strength of the removed teak with a fiberglass overlay
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Old 02-07-2016, 10:41   #2
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Re: teak deck removal + glassing over epoxy filled holes

It would help to know the boat. How robustly built? IME, most of the heavy cruiser types are plenty thick/strong without the teak.
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Old 02-07-2016, 10:59   #3
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Re: teak deck removal + glassing over epoxy filled holes

Flying Dutchman FD-12 (50' cruiser) built by Tayana in 1977.
Pretty heavily built
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Old 02-07-2016, 11:09   #4
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Re: teak deck removal + glassing over epoxy filled holes

Ah yes! I coveted having an FD12 back in the day! My guess is you are good to go with strength, but hard to really say. When the teak is off, walk around and see if there is any flexing. I'd be surprised your core isn't soaking wet though. :>(
I ripped the teak off my Hans Christian 38 and had the holes filled, deck repainted, etc. It was plenty strong. I put treadmaster on for non skid.
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Old 02-07-2016, 11:24   #5
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Re: teak deck removal + glassing over epoxy filled holes

This could go either way, depending on the boat. A friend just had his Grand Banks 42 done and they put a layer of cloth down. However, a lot of boats were designed with teak decks as an option and structurally don't need the extra glass. I personally wouldn't worry about the filled screw holes showing through the paint, but I'll defer to the experts.
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Old 03-07-2016, 10:00   #6
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Re: teak deck removal + glassing over epoxy filled holes

If the filled screw holes were to separate from adjacent structure then water ingress could be possible. One layer of glass would reduce this possibility greatly
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Old 03-07-2016, 11:35   #7
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Re: teak deck removal + glassing over epoxy filled holes

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Originally Posted by Cheechako View Post
Ah yes! I coveted having an FD12 back in the day! My guess is you are good to go with strength, but hard to really say. When the teak is off, walk around and see if there is any flexing. I'd be surprised your core isn't soaking wet though. :>(
I ripped the teak off my Hans Christian 38 and had the holes filled, deck repainted, etc. It was plenty strong. I put treadmaster on for non skid.
This issue has interested me for a while, as many of the boats I like came with teak decks over fiberglass. So, how the deck should be finished if the Teak should be removed is a study topic.

Since I also like Treadmaster for nonslip surfaces, it would cover the possibly visible epoxy filled holes, and add a very good non slip surface too. Treadmaster is known to last for decades.

Unsightly deck filled holes shown as dimples?
Since Treadmaster (a form of "rubber+cork" appliqué material made by Tiflex) is using an epoxy adhesive to fix it to the deck, it should also keep the water out of those same epoxy filled holes if the plugs work, if that is a concern.

I think a bigger concern is the possibly wet deck core.

I would get an estimate of the cost of doing another layer of glass plus non skid paint (total cost), versus deck paint with Treadmaster overlay (total cost).

One more tip I picked up in my research: I would only choose a light colored Treadmaster color, as the dark colors (gray) are said to get hot in the tropical sun and cause the boat interior to be hotter too.

Disclaimer: I don't own a boat with Treadmaster yet, so take my comments above with a splash of saltwater.
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Old 03-07-2016, 11:53   #8
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Re: teak deck removal + glassing over epoxy filled holes

Treadmaster is great stuff, albeit expensive. It's also more work than one might think. A key question is "how to hold it down" while whatever glue you use cures? The decks are not often flat. I used many weighted items and had to do one piece of treadmaster per day. kind of a PITA. In retrospect, I might use it again in cooler climes, but I found it a bit hard on the feet when barefoot in the tropics! Although I guess no worse than hot teak... but a different discomfort.
Frankly I wouldnt worry about filled holes showing or coming loose on a painted deck. Your non skid is going to cover up those filled spots and be textured. Some of the roll-on non skids now days are easily owner done and kind of rubbery too, like Kiwi Grip. I think for most boats glassing over is overkill big time.
I ran into a guy with a steel boat that had treadmaster. Surprisingly he had put it down with Contact Cement and it looked great after a couple of years. Quicker to do that way too.
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Old 03-07-2016, 12:00   #9
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Re: teak deck removal + glassing over epoxy filled holes

Lots of good advice already, and you definitely don't need to worry about adding structure to replace the teak - it was always decorative. With all those screw holes from the teak, the deck core probably is wet and in places delaminated, especially if the boat's been anywhere with a cold winter and the resulting freeze/thaw cycle. I don't think that just pouring in epoxy does much good, and its incredibly fluid, so you've got to be careful that it isn't pouring out and into the boat a few hours later (Yes - into the engine room bilge). Tapping some blow-off breathers (1/2" copper plumbing fittings) into the deck to provide an exit path for water evaporated in the summer heat, is something I'm going to try this year, before pouring some filled epoxy, and I'll post the results here.

Treadmaster or another non-slip deck covering (at least one other company makes an excellent product) is definitely the best way to go - it provide great footing, good looks and avoids the task of trying to bring that deck back to good looks in just fiberglass and gelcoat, which will verges on impossible as a DIY project.

Good luck
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Old 03-07-2016, 12:01   #10
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Re: teak deck removal + glassing over epoxy filled holes

I am in the Philippines so Treadmaster is out due to availability. As much as I would like SoftSand or Awlgrip, the only thing I can obtain is silica sand
I can however buy LP paint locally

My concern is that any flexing in the deck will cause the epoxy filled holes to work loose and show through the non-skid paint, or worse yet the decorative glossy areas in between the non-skid areas
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Old 03-07-2016, 12:01   #11
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Re: teak deck removal + glassing over epoxy filled holes

CHEECHAKO, good points. I am glad you are sharing your real experience here. Thanks!
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Old 03-07-2016, 12:06   #12
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Re: teak deck removal + glassing over epoxy filled holes

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Originally Posted by JOHNMARDALL View Post
Lots of good advice already, and you definitely don't need to worry about adding structure to replace the teak - it was always decorative. With all those screw holes from the teak, the deck core probably is wet and in places delaminated, especially if the boat's been anywhere with a cold winter and the resulting freeze/thaw cycle. I don't think that just pouring in epoxy does much good, and its incredibly fluid, so you've got to be careful that it isn't pouring out and into the boat a few hours later (Yes - into the engine room bilge). Tapping some blow-off breathers (1/2" copper plumbing fittings) into the deck to provide an exit path for water evaporated in the summer heat, is something I'm going to try this year, before pouring some filled epoxy, and I'll post the results here.

Treadmaster or another non-slip deck covering (at least one other company makes an excellent product) is definitely the best way to go - it provide great footing, good looks and avoids the task of trying to bring that deck back to good looks in just fiberglass and gelcoat, which will verges on impossible as a DIY project.

Good luck
John Mardall
Vetus Group.
PS Don't forget that even with just epoxy plugs in screw holes, you must wash off the amine blush before attempting to stick or paint anything onto the cured epoxy - without washing off the blush, sooner or later the bond will let go, and even with a sheet non-slip deck covering, the releases may show up a dimples in the non-slip. (Yes- acoustical panels fell off)
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Old 03-07-2016, 12:06   #13
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Re: teak deck removal + glassing over epoxy filled holes

I've done many decks. If the core is solid and doesn't compress the screw holes won't show. I would use West System's 404 high density filler with the epoxy. It makes a stronger bond.
Screw holes usually show in wood decks as dimples where the wood has absorbed water except where compressed by the screw.
If the core is wet you need to dry it. Otherwise you may have mold showing up where the moisture tries to get out.
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Old 03-07-2016, 13:48   #14
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Re: teak deck removal + glassing over epoxy filled holes

I did the same job 7years ago on my westsail. I used epoxy, then a thickened epoxy, and then non-skid.

Not a single problem so far (and I have been watching very closely.
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Old 03-07-2016, 14:03   #15
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Re: teak deck removal + glassing over epoxy filled holes

My boat is a pretty stout cruiser, however, when we went to remove the teak decks and paint, our contractor quoted putting down three layers of glass, which we accepted. The result was beyond my expectations and after tens of thousands of miles, it still looks pretty good and we have no leaks.

Fair winds and calm seas.
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