Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 09-07-2012, 08:23   #1
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Newport News VA
Boat: Egg Harbor sedan cruiser 1970
Posts: 829
Steam powered boat why not do it again?

Author here says 120 pounds of gasoline costs the same as 1000 pounds of coal.

Quote:
For example, 120 pounds of gasoline (20 gallons) will cost you slightly over $20.00. 1,000 pounds of coal will cost about the same
Likely that coal will take the boat much farther than the gas or diesel.

He also makes the claim that even though a steam engine is less efficient when you factor in cheaper fuel to run on steam, it makes lots more sense.

Plus more reliability.
The Most Suppressed Invention

I like how he said there is a steam vacuum sucking the knowledge out of the books.

The motive power industries vested interests are in play to keep us using their expensive oils. Steam power heating water with cheaper fuels will certainly get them upset.

Coal is being surpressed also by government regulations, so the trains certainly wont go back to it.
__________________

__________________
sdowney717 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2012, 08:33   #2
Senior Cruiser
 
Vasco's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Toronto
Boat: CS36Merlin, "La Belle Aurore" Ben393 "Breathless"
Posts: 7,140
Re: Steam powered boat why not do it again?

Where can I get gas for a buck a gallon?
__________________

__________________
Rick I
Toronto in summer, Bahamas in winter.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/beneteau393/
Vasco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2012, 08:44   #3
cat herder, extreme blacksheep
 
zeehag's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: furycame alley , tropics, mexico for now
Boat: 1976 FORMOSA yankee clipper 41
Posts: 17,777
Images: 56
Send a message via Yahoo to zeehag Send a message via Skype™ to zeehag
Re: Steam powered boat why not do it again?

this was already tried a while back--- system turned out to be too large, too inefficient, too dirty and too much a pita so it was converted into diesel and gasoline.
zeehag is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2012, 08:53   #4
Resin Head
 
minaret's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Seattle WA
Boat: Nauticat
Posts: 7,201
Images: 52
Re: Steam powered boat why not do it again?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sdowney717 View Post
Author here says 120 pounds of gasoline costs the same as 1000 pounds of coal.



Likely that coal will take the boat much farther than the gas or diesel.

He also makes the claim that even though a steam engine is less efficient when you factor in cheaper fuel to run on steam, it makes lots more sense.

Plus more reliability.
The Most Suppressed Invention

I like how he said there is a steam vacuum sucking the knowledge out of the books.

The motive power industries vested interests are in play to keep us using their expensive oils. Steam power heating water with cheaper fuels will certainly get them upset.

Coal is being surpressed also by government regulations, so the trains certainly wont go back to it.

Have been involved in a steam engined boat build I can tell you they are crazy dangerous even using modern materials. The guy we built for was a Boeing engineer and he designed the steam engine himself. Steam burns hurt!
__________________
minaret is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2012, 08:54   #5
Registered User

Join Date: Oct 2011
Boat: WTB Lagoon or Leopard 38'-40'
Posts: 1,273
Re: Steam powered boat why not do it again?

Refined fuels are superior fuels because they are "refined". They are distilled for compactness, standardized, modified with additives, and made as clean to burn as technology will allow.

Oil or coal is a natural product. They are dug out of the ground. They are heavy, dirty, difficult to transport, and very bulky to store.

Coal can be converted into a variety of liquid and gaseous fuels. It can also be converted to electricity, which is where the vast majority of all coal goes today.

You fill up your gas tank by opening a small hatch, inserting a nozzle, and opening a valve. Clean, compact fuel with incredibly high energy density is pumped into your boat or car. How will you fill up your tank with ground corncobs? Or sawdust? What is the energy density? You'll have to tow a barge behind your boat to carry your fuel supply, as the old steam engines towed large bins of coal behind them in their days.
__________________
ArtM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2012, 09:02   #6
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Montegut LA.
Boat: Now we need to get her to Louisiana !! she's ours
Posts: 3,421
Re: Steam powered boat why not do it again?

Ck the BTUs contained in the two fuels mentioned, theres sorta a mistake somewhere?? maybe my Old books are wrong, and btu's have changed over the years ?? steam is fun to play with but as far as fuel to fire the boiler, diesel or bunker oil has been used for years as the room for coal storage is a major factor, the amount of room need for coal, reduces the room for freight!! So therefor steam even with turbines must be run by oil or its just not gonna work !! penny wise and dollar foolish !! Just sayin I don't wanna shovel coal to get home !! LOL
__________________
Bob and Connie
bobconnie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2012, 09:08   #7
Registered User

Join Date: Oct 2011
Boat: WTB Lagoon or Leopard 38'-40'
Posts: 1,273
Re: Steam powered boat why not do it again?

The Mike Brown article is extremely flawed. It compares energy sources (diesel, gasoline, coal) to steam, which is not an energy source.

It also seems to ignore the polluting effects of burning natural products such as wood and corncobs, as well as the effort required to collect, transport, store, and utilize them. He carries on about the efficiency of a steam piston, but no mention of the inefficiencies of operating a steam boiler.

"The irony is that free energy has been ours for the taking for over a hundred years from a device that was invented over 200 years ago: the simple steam engine.

First, you will find that over 90% of the power (primarily for electricity) in the United States is produced by steam, primarily from steam turbines."

These are absurd statements, since steam is not a power source.

Note that similar statements used be made about "hydrogen power", but we do not hear about it any more. Again, this is because hydrogen is a power media (like steam), not a power source. Unlike steam, however, hydrogen can be stored and transported.
__________________
ArtM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2012, 09:29   #8
Registered User
 
SailingwithSoul's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: New York
Boat: In between boats
Posts: 215
Images: 2
Re: Steam powered boat why not do it again?

Personally, I would love to rig some type of hand pedal gearing system and forego my engine altogether. As it stands, I only use my engine to leave and arrive at my dock (Med Style). Muscle power is cleaner, safer, and cheaper than all other alternatives
__________________
SailingwithSoul is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2012, 09:29   #9
Registered User
 
Astrid's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Northern British Columbia, part of the time in Prince Rupert and part of the time on Moresby Island.
Boat: 50-ft steel Ketch
Posts: 1,885
Send a message via MSN to Astrid Send a message via Yahoo to Astrid
Re: Steam powered boat why not do it again?

Personally, I have always loved steam engines, but let's face it, they can be a pain in the rear. As pointed out, steam itself is not the energy source--that comes from the wood, coal, or petroleum fuels you use to convert water to steam. And the water you use can't be just any water--preferably it is distilled water that has all traces of minerals and salts eliminated. Minerals cause scaling in the boiler tubes which reduces the thermal efficiency of the boil, while salt causes corrosion which will eventually lead to failure in the boiler itself or steam lines.

Another detail often overlooked is it is necessary to closely monitor pressure and water level in the boiler. Too little water will cause a catastrophic failure of the boiler. That said, they can also be tremendously fun to be around and operate, but you have to be a fairly good mechanic and love tinkering with things. There are a number of steam launches still operating in the US, Europe, and England. It might be a good idea to talk with some of the members of the different steam engine associations and clubs.

This might be a useful link to one such:

Steam Boat Association of Great Britain - Home
__________________
'Tis evening on the moorland free,The starlit wave is still: Home is the sailor from the sea, The hunter from the hill.
Astrid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2012, 09:34   #10
Registered User
 
SailingwithSoul's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: New York
Boat: In between boats
Posts: 215
Images: 2
Re: Steam powered boat why not do it again?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Astrid View Post
Personally,
Quote:
Originally Posted by SailingwithSoul View Post
Personally,

There's nothing like taking someone else's thread and making it your own


Cheers OP
__________________
SailingwithSoul is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2012, 10:00   #11
Registered User
 
Nemo55's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Punta Banda, Ensenada. and Canada
Boat: 28Ft Piver Encore, Tri-Maran, Anchored in San Diego.
Posts: 728
Send a message via Skype™ to Nemo55
Re: Steam powered boat why not do it again?

Steam kettles as they where called, used to be the way all powered vessels moved.
I would jump at the chance of having a little steam pot running of Peat or twigs,,,with the new Gasifier burners which also create electricity by way of Thermal conversion(no moving parts)would do nicely.
Even if one had to mother the system to prevent catastrophe it wouldnt be so bad. Remember The "African queen" p.s. have a look at a device called a "Biolite stove" for inspiration.
__________________
"The Truth Shall set you Free....But First it will Piss You Off"

http://nemo1955.blogspot.ca/
Nemo55 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2012, 10:04   #12
Registered User

Join Date: Oct 2011
Boat: WTB Lagoon or Leopard 38'-40'
Posts: 1,273
Re: Steam powered boat why not do it again?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nemo55 View Post
Remember The "African queen" p.s. have a look at a device called a "Biolite stove" for inspiration.
You don't have to remember the African Queen, you can charter a ride on it.

It is in a Marina in Key Largo. It has been restored and is available for charter. I don't recall the name of the Marina, but it is a large one with a large Courtyard (I think) on one corner. It might be called Key Largo marina.

For a small donation (they take donations) I'm sure the skipper will be happy to discuss the whole system with you.
__________________
ArtM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2012, 10:17   #13
Don't ask if you can't handle it
 
sailorboy1's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: On the boat somewhere
Boat: Hunter 410
Posts: 12,320
Re: Steam powered boat why not do it again?

Coal powered boats, how 50+ years ago! Even the US Navy has stopped having Boiler Techs.
__________________
jobless, houseless, clueless, living on a boat and cruising around somewhere
sailorboy1 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2012, 10:22   #14
Senior Cruiser
 
Cheechako's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Skagit City, WA
Posts: 19,369
Re: Steam powered boat why not do it again?

that's gonna be a warm boat in tropics after a run....
__________________
"I spent most of my money on Booze, Broads and Boats. The rest I wasted" - Elmore Leonard











Cheechako is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2012, 10:26   #15
Registered User
 
Target9000's Avatar

Join Date: May 2009
Location: New Orleans LA
Boat: 74 Westsail 32
Posts: 1,379
Re: Steam powered boat why not do it again?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Lucas View Post
Coal powered boats, how 50+ years ago! Even the US Navy has stopped having Boiler Techs.
That's not entirely true. Boiler tech was merged with machinist's mate. They are still responsible for the steam systems that power many nuclear vessels.
__________________

__________________
Let your heart tell you where to go, but let your brain tell you how to get there.

Sundowner Sails Again
Target9000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off




Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:43.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.