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Old 19-11-2015, 18:53   #16
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Re: Source for cabin sole

I have been thinking of this same topic, as I was looking at two older boats that could use some new sole or covering.

I also saw a boat that had carpet covering the sole. While I don't like the idea of carpet because I like the look of wood and have seen wood soles on most boats.

But, seeing the carpet (wall to wall, so to speak) on some of the boats I saw did not look bad. I also imagine it would feel good under foot and in a smaller boat in cold water and during cold days or for a liveaboard it might be nice.

Any opinions on that?
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Old 19-11-2015, 19:57   #17
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Re: Source for cabin sole

There is usually a supply of teak and holly ply at Strata Forest Products in Santa Anna. But I have also ordered from the Bay area and the east coast. Shipping is not bad.
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Old 19-11-2015, 20:46   #18
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Re: Source for cabin sole

Quote:
Originally Posted by flysci View Post
I want to replace my cabin sole, which was made of teak n holly veneered marine plywood. It has rotted after a bad leak flooded them.

My problem is I can't seem to find a source of the 4x8 sheets here in California, and shipping charges are really expensive. All the results in my google search were on the east coast.

Does anyone know of a place where I can buy this material out here?
https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q...plywood+marine

This was my Google search. Looks like a lot of options.
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Old 19-11-2015, 20:47   #19
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Re: Source for cabin sole

flysci, Have you ever considered something like this? I've seen it at Strictly Sail and thought if I ever had to do the sole it might be a option.

http://www.lonsealspecialty.com/show_collection/MARINE
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Old 19-11-2015, 20:56   #20
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Re: Source for cabin sole

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steady Hand View Post
I have been thinking of this same topic, as I was looking at two older boats that could use some new sole or covering.

I also saw a boat that had carpet covering the sole. While I don't like the idea of carpet because I like the look of wood and have seen wood soles on most boats.

But, seeing the carpet (wall to wall, so to speak) on some of the boats I saw did not look bad. I also imagine it would feel good under foot and in a smaller boat in cold water and during cold days or for a liveaboard it might be nice.

Any opinions on that?
I put carpet temporarily in my boat to protect what's left of the teak and holly while doing a refit. Found that if the carpet got wet it stayed wet and held the moisture under the carpet against the wood, which made the wood very unhappy. With a glass floor maybe or with carpets that you remove regularly or maybe there's some kind of marine carpet that dries better or keeps the moisture off the wood. Otherwise, I think it would be a problem unless you always kept it dry. Dry on a boat????
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Old 19-11-2015, 21:19   #21
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Re: Source for cabin sole

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I put carpet temporarily in my boat to protect what's left of the teak and holly while doing a refit. Found that if the carpet got wet it stayed wet and held the moisture under the carpet against the wood, which made the wood very unhappy. With a glass floor maybe or with carpets that you remove regularly or maybe there's some kind of marine carpet that dries better or keeps the moisture off the wood. Otherwise, I think it would be a problem unless you always kept it dry. Dry on a boat????
Good points. I thought something similar, and would like to avoid mildew growth in my future boat, and I have seen mildew grow under wet carpets.

While I generally like the look of Teak & holly flooring, I am also open to considering alternatives too.
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Old 19-11-2015, 21:52   #22
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Re: Source for cabin sole

We've used Frost Hardwood (San Diego) and Edensaw Lumber (Port Townsend), and ordered some woods including BS1088 marine ply from Jackel Enterprises (central CA just south of Santa Cruz) and we also got some other woods from them. Their contact info is here on our site. I don't know if they have the teak and holly ply but we found them the best deal on Alaskan Yellow Cedar and BS1088 marine plywood. We made our own sole of 9mm BS1088 ply with 3/8" teak on top (to match existing teak sole). If you're replacing everything, you have the flexibility to do something entirely different, lighter in color, whatever.
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Old 20-11-2015, 06:31   #23
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Re: Source for cabin sole

Quote:
Originally Posted by skipmac View Post
I am a bit surprised that you have not found teak and holly ply anywhere on the west coast. Bet something pops up eventually.

I'm looking at the same job myself in the future and am kind of intrigued with the suggestion to use plain veneer plywood and glue strips of holly (or other suitable light colored wood) on top. The white strips would stand proud of the plywood but that might be a good thing. Might add a little more traction to the cabin sole.
skipmac,
What I mean, is that you take the sheet of say, Teak, plywood, & machine slots into it running fore & aft. Into which you then insert thin pieces of another type of wood. You can choose to have them stand proud or not.
I suppose that glueing thin veneers of a light colored wood on top of the plywood is an option. It's just that such isn't what I meant in my initial post on the subject.
And, yeah, the purpose of having raise strips of Holly is For traction, in addition to it looking pretty.

If the idea's of interest to you, & or possibly a lot cheaper than buying teak & holly, pre-made. It'd be worth talking to a few wood working/cabinet making type shops, to inquire about the cost of having the inletting done by them. Or perhaps even the whole job, if you can find someplace with reasonable shop rates.

Also, guys, another option is this:
Lay down a couple of layers of knitted fabric (biaxial, triaxial, or quadraxial) on a mold table, & wet it out. Then put your strips of relatively thing (10mm or less) Teak & Holly on top of it. And use a light vacuum pressure to lock everything together while the resin cures.
Plus, if you wanted to, & or needed stiffer floorboards than this alone would produce. Then put a layer of core, & another layer of glass or two underneath of the Teak (& Holly).

So your laminate would be:
- Glass
- Core
- Glass
- Teak & Holly (or similar)

And if you choose the right woods, you'd never really have to worry about rot, or water ingress again. That, & if you use thin layers of wood (1/4" or so), your floorboards will be pretty light to boot.

On the carpet question, yep, it's VERY nice under foot when the temp drops at all. And unless you're doing a lot of dragging of (wet) sails in & out, it's not tough to keep it dry. Assuming that you have a real bilge, & pump for same.
I had carpeting in my 1st boat for the whole time I owned & lived aboard her (4+ years), & never had any trouble. Plus it was a lot nicer under foot than bare fiberglass.

PS: There are a decent number of white(ish) woods which are nigh on rot proof, which could be used in place of Holly. Some of which even thrive on regular scrubbings with salt water.
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Old 20-11-2015, 07:00   #24
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Re: Source for cabin sole

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steady Hand View Post
Good points. I thought something similar, and would like to avoid mildew growth in my future boat, and I have seen mildew grow under wet carpets.

While I generally like the look of Teak & holly flooring, I am also open to considering alternatives too.
A couple of other flooring options are:
- Plywood, painted white (or other) with non-skid added to, or on top of the paint. Ditto on composite floorboards.
- Strips of Kauri (or other, some type of Cedar for example - White, Red, etc.) about 1 1/2" wide, used to make slatted floors, which look akin to hull "ceilings".
Such is what we had on a custom 50' racer, built in New Zealand. Finished with a satin coating (varnish I think). And they were nice with or without shoes.

Plus, even when hauling a lot of wet gear in & out of the boat, they stayed a lot drier than solid flooring would have. And thus were a lot less slippery. Especially with their satin finish.
Also, their light color was a nice change from the uber dark, traditional teak. Something which IMO is overdone in too many boats.
And with the thin spaces between slats, they were almost immune to trapping sand or dirt under foot. Something which is the primary killer of finishes on standard floorboards.
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Old 20-11-2015, 07:00   #25
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Re: Source for cabin sole

Quote:
Originally Posted by UNCIVILIZED View Post
skipmac,
What I mean, is that you take the sheet of say, Teak, plywood, & machine slots into it running fore & aft. Into which you then insert thin pieces of another type of wood. You can choose to have them stand proud or not.
I suppose that glueing thin veneers of a light colored wood on top of the plywood is an option. It's just that such isn't what I meant in my initial post on the subject.
And, yeah, the purpose of having raise strips of Holly is For traction, in addition to it looking pretty.
I did see your suggestions for the routed option but I think someone else mentioned just gluing strips on top. Since Flysci mentioned she doesn't have the tools or expertise for the routing option I brought that one up. Long term I'm thinking surface glued strips will start pealing away and the inset option a better plan.

Quote:
Originally Posted by UNCIVILIZED View Post
If the idea's of interest to you, & or possibly a lot cheaper than buying teak & holly, pre-made. It'd be worth talking to a few wood working/cabinet making type shops, to inquire about the cost of having the inletting done by them. Or perhaps even the whole job, if you can find someplace with reasonable shop rates.
Plan to check this out and compare the cost of DIY vs just buying the ready made teak and holly ply.


Quote:
Originally Posted by UNCIVILIZED View Post
On the carpet question, yep, it's VERY nice under foot when the temp drops at all. And unless you're doing a lot of dragging of (wet) sails in & out, it's not tough to keep it dry. Assuming that you have a real bilge, & pump for same.
I had carpeting in my 1st boat for the whole time I owned & lived aboard her (4+ years), & never had any trouble. Plus it was a lot nicer under foot.
Carpet on glass I would do. Carpet on wood I think would be a problem. Even if you keep it relatively dry I think it would still hold dampness against the wood and lead to rot or delamination over time.
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Old 20-11-2015, 08:38   #26
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Re: Source for cabin sole

What do you guys think of maybe putting in Bamboo tiles with epoxy over marine ply or old worn down teak? It's eco sensitive, long wearing and can be had light or dark. The only downside I can see is you may have to put some nonskid material with the final coat...Or you can ridge it with another hardwood...
Home Decorators Collection Vertical Toast 5/8 in. Thick x 5 in. Wide x 38-5/8 in. Length Solid Bamboo Flooring (24.12 sq. ft. / case)-HL619VS - The Home Depot
Here's just an example...
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Old 20-11-2015, 09:00   #27
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Re: Source for cabin sole

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Originally Posted by s/v Beth View Post
What do you guys think of maybe putting in Bamboo tiles with epoxy over marine ply or old worn down teak? It's eco sensitive, long wearing and can be had light or dark. The only downside I can see is you may have to put some nonskid material with the final coat...Or you can ridge it with another hardwood...
Home Decorators Collection Vertical Toast 5/8 in. Thick x 5 in. Wide x 38-5/8 in. Length Solid Bamboo Flooring (24.12 sq. ft. / case)-HL619VS - The Home Depot
Here's just an example...
I've actually considered something like this myself. Only, finding/using the Bamboo as the flooring itself, sans Teak sub-strata.
I think that the only catch is, finding flooring (especially Bamboo) which wont absorb water. As I think that most Bamboo Flooring is made of glued together pieces. Though I'd love it if I'm wrong.
Anyone?

For nonskid, there are clear, polymer beads which you can use. Either mixed in with the epoxy, or tape off lines on your flooring, paint on some epoxy, add the beads, & pull the tape when cured. Then adding a couple of coats on top of them.
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Old 20-11-2015, 09:43   #28
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Re: Source for cabin sole

To everyone, I am enjoying this thread.

To UNCIVILIZED and SKIPMAC, thanks for your replies to my question. Once again I think we think alike, but I really appreciate your experience and views.

I have done some cursory looking at bamboo. I like the look of it. For a "boat project" that requires new flooring, I would consider trying it after some limited trials (a section by the foot of the companionway ladder would be a good trial as it gets the most wear and water).

I like the lighter colors too.

Here are a few photos from the link provided above (source was Home Depot) and the cost is only $2.19 a square foot or $52 for 24 square feet. Note, this is sold in planks that are 5" wide and 38" long and joined by hand to fit the space.

I will post a few photos to illustrate.
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The other kind of floor covering I am interested in (in case the boat has bare plywood sole such as when carpet has been taken up or needs to be replaced or if there is bare fiberglass) is the synthetic "teak and holly" looking flooring (one brand is PlasTeak) which is bonded (you use glue) to the substrate. There is a video on Youtube that shows how this is done by a cruiser, using simple tools and it shows step by step the process. It looked much nicer after the refit. It also comes in a range of colors.

Teak Boat Flooring, Holly Boat Flooring, Maple Boat Flooring | PlasTEAK Inc.

http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...reply&t=156259

Teak & Holly is 1/8″ (80 mil./2mm) thick. The roll is 6 foot (1.8m) wide and is cut to even foot lengths. Each lineal foot is $50.00. Holly lines run the length of cut material. ($8.33/square foot)
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However, I would prefer Bamboo (over synthetic) if it will last in the wet marine environment.

I do seem to recall reading some member of CF had installed Bamboo in the past year or two, perhaps they will see this and give us some impressions after their use of it.

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A quick look for teak and holly marine flooring found
http://www.jamestowndistributors.com...+Holly+Plywood

where the cost is $312 for a 4x8 sheet of the plywood.
The Maritime Wood Products Teak and Holly plywood features a traditional cabin sole pattern with alternating strips of teak (2-3/8" wide) and contrasting light wood (1/4" wide).

The panels measure 4 ft x 8 ft with the veneer pattern running in the 8 ft direction. A 1.0 mm-thick "teak & holly" veneer face is laminated to a tropical plywood core and is constructed with waterproof glues. Maritime marine grade plywood is sold in panel thicknesses of 1/4", 1/2" and 3/4".
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Old 20-11-2015, 09:54   #29
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Re: Source for cabin sole

We did one of those click-together bamboo floors in our house. It was high quality but still did not last. The folks who purchased the house replaced the flooring about 3 years after we sold. We'd installed it right before selling. They had problems with the water being tracked in from the doorway and their dog's toenails both damaging it. So--no big dogs and no water tracking. LOL.

The click-together multi-ply flooring is heavy in general.

Other thoughts--many different hardwoods are suitable for easy cut and install (glue down) atop marine plywood for a nice custom floor. Some woods are very light in color--for example white oak, white pine, maple. All are light in color when finished.
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Old 20-11-2015, 10:19   #30
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Re: Source for cabin sole

I did use Teak Parquet squares on a boat I built back when that stuff was plentiful.


Personally I would avoid Bamboo. I have friends who did their luxury house in it for parts. It is soft and dents easily for one thing. I've tried bamboo for a couple of things. One was a cutting board, the glue does not seem to be that good.. and the strips started to get gaps between them.

While expensive, Teak and Holly Plywood is worth it. Milling to put strips of holly in... really? that would be a PITA and the teak ply expensive anyway. There are plenty of boats that just use plain teak ply.. that's another option.
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