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Old 14-03-2014, 09:23   #46
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Re: Sooo Ready to get Back in the Water...

Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyMdRSailor View Post
It was a little hard to picture at first... But I think you're on to the proper install with the thickened epoxy... Shouldn't be any problem to shape perfectly .... Certainly far less time than the removal !!! (and less swearing)



+1.... You need to "intentionally" focus the heat gun a bit longer than a torch when considering collateral damage!


I dunno, it probably needed all that 5200 with that much slop. I bet the screws only grab an 1/8" of meat and some grab nothing. Seen this many times before. I cut for a porthole with a template and router, but as far as I can tell most factories use a drunk man with a dull Sawzall!
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Old 14-03-2014, 16:04   #47
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Re: Sooo Ready to get Back in the Water...

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Originally Posted by SaltyMonkey View Post
YOU added the wind vane OUT of the water?
I thought the monkey was smokin' bananas and posted in the wrong thread... Until I realized indeed the vane went on in the first page! SM... I'm Siujin has this thing marked, remarked, and triple remarked for mounting position...?

Quote:
Originally Posted by minaret View Post
I dunno, it probably needed all that 5200 with that much slop. I bet the screws only grab an 1/8" of meat and some grab nothing. Seen this many times before. I cut for a porthole with a template and router, but as far as I can tell most factories use a drunk man with a dull Sawzall!
No kidding huh??? How many have you pulled out with at least 2 screws being held in place by the "edge" of the glass instead of through it!
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Old 14-03-2014, 16:34   #48
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Re: Sooo Ready to get Back in the Water...

Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyMdRSailor View Post
I thought the monkey was smokin' bananas and posted in the wrong thread... Until I realized indeed the vane went on in the first page! SM... I'm Siujin has this thing marked, remarked, and triple remarked for mounting position...?



No kidding huh??? How many have you pulled out with at least 2 screws being held in place by the "edge" of the glass instead of through it!

80-90%.
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Old 14-03-2014, 17:07   #49
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Re: Sooo Ready to get Back in the Water...

Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyMdRSailor View Post
I thought the monkey was smokin' bananas and posted in the wrong thread... Until I realized indeed the vane went on in the first page! SM... I'm Siujin has this thing marked, remarked, and triple remarked for mounting position...?
Yup if he marked and measured in the water first, sure. But e might have issues if e winged it. SaltyMonkey is careful
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Old 15-03-2014, 05:19   #50
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Re: Sooo Ready to get Back in the Water...

Quote:
Originally Posted by minaret View Post
80-90%.
Jeez... worse than I imagined.... Should I fall out of favor in employment, I shall apply for "Drunk Sawzall Guy" openings....

Quote:
Originally Posted by SaltyMonkey View Post
Yup if he marked and measured in the water first, sure. But e might have issues if e winged it. SaltyMonkey is careful
SM looks very careful with studious spectacles.... No extra hull ventilation for you!
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Old 23-03-2014, 03:30   #51
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Re: Sooo Ready to get Back in the Water...

Quote:
Originally Posted by minaret View Post
I dunno, it probably needed all that 5200 with that much slop. I bet the screws only grab an 1/8" of meat and some grab nothing. Seen this many times before. I cut for a porthole with a template and router, but as far as I can tell most factories use a drunk man with a dull Sawzall!
I'm actually installing larger port lights than what I had (5"x20" vs. 5"x18") but their construction is a bit different and so there is slightly more room top and bottom in the new ones.

I will say that the openings do look cut by a drunk man with a sawzall...different radii corners, wavy lines, but the old ports were fit pretty well in there.

I have 7 of the 9 out. I found the most effective procedure was the multitool from the outside, a couple of picks digging in around the corner, and then using braces and clamps set up inside and a heat gun to lever them out. Pressure and heat worked pretty quickly, once I decided that sacrificing the Formica was actually going to be faster and less work than trying to preserve it. The Formica was only spottily adhered to the cabin wall so a simple 1/4" of contact with the 5200, with a tensile strength of 700 PSI, was enough to crack it.

I built some forms from luan strips with cellophane tape, clamped them inside and out, and am filling and leveling with epoxy when the temps here permit. Then it's cutout time for the wider edges and the drain scallops.
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Old 23-03-2014, 07:25   #52
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Re: Sooo Ready to get Back in the Water...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Suijin View Post
I'm actually installing larger port lights than what I had (5"x20" vs. 5"x18") but their construction is a bit different and so there is slightly more room top and bottom in the new ones.

I will say that the openings do look cut by a drunk man with a sawzall...different radii corners, wavy lines, but the old ports were fit pretty well in there.

I have 7 of the 9 out. I found the most effective procedure was the multitool from the outside, a couple of picks digging in around the corner, and then using braces and clamps set up inside and a heat gun to lever them out. Pressure and heat worked pretty quickly, once I decided that sacrificing the Formica was actually going to be faster and less work than trying to preserve it. The Formica was only spottily adhered to the cabin wall so a simple 1/4" of contact with the 5200, with a tensile strength of 700 PSI, was enough to crack it.

I built some forms from luan strips with cellophane tape, clamped them inside and out, and am filling and leveling with epoxy when the temps here permit. Then it's cutout time for the wider edges and the drain scallops.
Suijin,

As they say in the South here.... "looks like you gotter goin' yer way now"

Lots of work, and definitely harder than it should have been... But you're going to be one happy camper with the outcome of the new fixtures !
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Old 23-03-2014, 07:49   #53
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Re: Sooo Ready to get Back in the Water...

Look at what we found last weekend at WOLF's marine in Benton Harbor. Too cheap for words. (overstock, liquidation etc)

Home Page site shows a tiny part of the inventory - contact them.

Photos form last weekend. I think the oval SS port was about 35 bucks.

other stuff is screens, tinted & clear replacement plastic. gas struts.
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Old 23-03-2014, 09:00   #54
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Re: Sooo Ready to get Back in the Water...

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Originally Posted by Nicholson58 View Post
Look at what we found last weekend at WOLF's marine in Benton Harbor. Too cheap for words. (overstock, liquidation etc)

Home Page site shows a tiny part of the inventory - contact them.

Photos form last weekend. I think the oval SS port was about 35 bucks.

other stuff is screens, tinted & clear replacement plastic. gas struts.
You should be ashamed at yourself for posting this... $35 indeed ... I hope if you bought 10 that the quality control was done with a Chinese tape measure....

Your only saving grace was sharing the link....

(nice job Nicholson!)(wowsa good deal !)
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Old 23-03-2014, 15:01   #55
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Re: Sooo Ready to get Back in the Water...

Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyMdRSailor View Post
You should be ashamed at yourself for posting this... $35 indeed ... I hope if you bought 10 that the quality control was done with a Chinese tape measure....

Your only saving grace was sharing the link....

(nice job Nicholson!)(wowsa good deal !)
Thanks.

If you know what you are looking for, accurate shopping list it could be well worth the drive. new & used Scuba equip too. I found dented cans of Epifanne for 1/2 price. Big piles of sail hardware. Electronics, plumbing, galley equip. Groco through-hull valves for 30 bucks. 5/8 double braid for 1.53 - full spool. Hand-sized galvanized shackles for 5 bucks. Everyone in the area knows this place - annual pilgrimage at 'spring thaw' for an additional 10%.
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Old 24-03-2014, 09:03   #56
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Re: Sooo Ready to get Back in the Water...

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Originally Posted by Nicholson58 View Post
Thanks.

If you know what you are looking for, accurate shopping list it could be well worth the drive. new & used Scuba equip too. I found dented cans of Epifanne for 1/2 price. Big piles of sail hardware. Electronics, plumbing, galley equip. Groco through-hull valves for 30 bucks. 5/8 double braid for 1.53 - full spool. Hand-sized galvanized shackles for 5 bucks. Everyone in the area knows this place - annual pilgrimage at 'spring thaw' for an additional 10%.
The place sounds like Shangri-La...

We have Minney's in So Cal... But I'm not in town often enough for my "fix"... Thanks for a great resource!
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Old 30-03-2014, 21:49   #57
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Re: Sooo Ready to get Back in the Water...

OK I have a question for you folks, and particularly for Minaret if he's encountered this before.

Pulling out the port lights I had to sacrifice the formica lining the interior cabin sides. All it took was 1/4" of 5200 gripping it under the lip and it would crack all the way to the edge. Decided it would be faster/easier/better to just get them out and replace the formica.

It occurred to me that I could just lay the new formica over the old if I scored it well enough and used scrap to level up the spots where the old formica came off entirely. This would require trimming quite a bit of the trim teak by the thickness of the new formica, which is not a huge deal, and pretty straightforward.

This past weekend I read an article by Don Casey on precisely this topic, and he stressed rather emphatically that all the old formica should be removed, the surface smoothed, and the new formica installed. Installing over old he says will lead to waviness and printing through. I find that hard to believe given how stiff formica is, but I've never done this before.

Ripping out all the old formica might not be too bad, as much of it was not well adhered, based on experience while pulling the ports. If it will lead to a better result I will do it. However, if simply laying the new on top of the old will not lead to any issues with respect to smoothness, it will be less work.

Anyone have any experience with laying new formica over old (busted but leveled up) formica?

Thanks.
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Old 31-03-2014, 00:05   #58
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Re: Sooo Ready to get Back in the Water...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Suijin View Post
OK I have a question for you folks, and particularly for Minaret if he's encountered this before.

Pulling out the port lights I had to sacrifice the formica lining the interior cabin sides. All it took was 1/4" of 5200 gripping it under the lip and it would crack all the way to the edge. Decided it would be faster/easier/better to just get them out and replace the formica.

It occurred to me that I could just lay the new formica over the old if I scored it well enough and used scrap to level up the spots where the old formica came off entirely. This would require trimming quite a bit of the trim teak by the thickness of the new formica, which is not a huge deal, and pretty straightforward.

This past weekend I read an article by Don Casey on precisely this topic, and he stressed rather emphatically that all the old formica should be removed, the surface smoothed, and the new formica installed. Installing over old he says will lead to waviness and printing through. I find that hard to believe given how stiff formica is, but I've never done this before.

Ripping out all the old formica might not be too bad, as much of it was not well adhered, based on experience while pulling the ports. If it will lead to a better result I will do it. However, if simply laying the new on top of the old will not lead to any issues with respect to smoothness, it will be less work.

Anyone have any experience with laying new formica over old (busted but leveled up) formica?

Thanks.


Yeah, seen it done with no apparent adverse effects many times. Sand your p-lam with 180 for tooth, fill the busted up spots and fair them with something cheap, and laminate away. Just use a good J roller and good technique and there will be no waviness or other problems.


Formica Installed Over Formica Countertops or Cabinets


Formica Over Formica - Kitchens & Baths - Contractor Talk
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Old 31-03-2014, 06:00   #59
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Re: Sooo Ready to get Back in the Water...

Suijin,

I've definitely seen the print thru thing and it looks awful as hell... Formica IMO has gotten quite a bit stiffer, thicker, and less translucent than early stuff... I'm not an expert, but have done a few failure analysis cases of laminate failure... It's always the glue or the prep... too much, too little, skinned before contact, dirty surfaces, not enough pressure... Simple stuff...

Min's got it going on, and I bet you absolutely have no problem...

If it looks like crap, I'll help you flame his butt for giving bad advice...
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Old 31-03-2014, 08:08   #60
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Re: Sooo Ready to get Back in the Water...

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Originally Posted by HappyMdRSailor View Post
Suijin,

I've definitely seen the print thru thing and it looks awful as hell... Formica IMO has gotten quite a bit stiffer, thicker, and less translucent than early stuff... I'm not an expert, but have done a few failure analysis cases of laminate failure... It's always the glue or the prep... too much, too little, skinned before contact, dirty surfaces, not enough pressure... Simple stuff...

Min's got it going on, and I bet you absolutely have no problem...

If it looks like crap, I'll help you flame his butt for giving bad advice...



Only seen print through when someone tried to laminate over p-lam that wasn't flat, ie fake tiles with a seam indent or some other pattern embossed in the laminate. Flame away if it goes south, but you should also go on the other forums I linked to and flame them as well!


Dude, you get up even earlier than me! 5 AM CF advice? I love it...
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