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Old 14-04-2013, 10:53   #31
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Re: So it begins

CaptainDana - the West advisor on head systems is excellent. However, I think it's important to note two simple modifications, if possible, that will improve the design. We used this exact design on two of our boats. But I found a few problems with the design and was able to make some changes.

1. The vent size and location is always an issue. I'd go to a slightly larger sized vent (IF POSSIBLE) and have it ported from the top of port and move steadily upward. I've had our side ported tank clog because the waste is capable of getting into the line and clogging it.

2. Again whenever possible (overhead space availability) have the input/output tank fittings top mounted. Not only does it eliminate the gravity factor of the output line waste, but it eliminates most any chance of liming. Liming was a major reason for our change in porting. Our first boat, a Shannon 28, simply didn't have the overhead capacity to do that.

3. If I had the option I'd use a two valve system instead of a y-valve. And all valves would be located above the tank.

Again, these are only valid options if the space is available.
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Old 14-04-2013, 15:25   #32
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I agree that a top output has many advantages. The OP is making his own tank. So, he needs to know that if he builds it to have a top output, it needs to have an internal pickup tube that goes to the bottom of the tank. Also agree strongly that bigger vents are better. One locking diverter works for me and keeps the Coast Guard happy.

IMHO the most important thing about head installation is to have everything (except the tank dump thru-hull) running downhill to the tank.
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Old 14-04-2013, 15:32   #33
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Re: So it begins

Why doesnt West show a system without the Y valve?
Best simplest set up is to always pump to the tank. discharge is at the hull fitting or deck fitting. No Y valve. Intake and vent on the top of tank discharge from the bottom.
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Old 14-04-2013, 17:16   #34
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I think you need the Y valve so you can lock the overboard discharge out. Without it you could pump overboard anytime. I suggest asking the CG and checking the Canadian rules..
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Old 14-04-2013, 20:19   #35
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Re: So it begins

I think all you need is a seal at the discharge. requiring a y valve would be like asking me to use manilla rope.
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Old 14-04-2013, 21:01   #36
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Re: So it begins

Captian Dana - agree with you completely, or downhill all the way. That doesn't sound right but I'm sure you know what I mean. The reason I like the 2 valve concept is that if the y-valve fails you could be left with no options. Is that overkill, I don't know. It definitely isn't a critical issue. If someone handed me a y-valve I'd use it.

I remember seeing a 2002 or so Catalina 36. Talk about a disaster of a head system, and this was all company installed. The head was just aft of center on the port side. The hose went from the joker valve down about 18" then diagonally aft to the stern on the starboard side, under the aft "cabin" bed. Then up about 3 to 4 feet to a side input port on the holding tank.

You effectively always had a full line of waste under your bed. And what was worst when the boat was heeled you had the equivalent of about 5 feet plus of standing waste going downhill to the head. The only thing keeping the waste from flowing out into the sole was, you guessed it, the weakest point on the system, the joker valve.
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Old 16-04-2013, 05:51   #37
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Re: So it begins

Thanks all for the input. Top mounted it will be.
Watercolor, You mentioned having some plumbing parts. Do you have a clean out port? I am having trouble finding one off the shelf, and there are no marine stores near by. The tank is basically polyester glass and mat over wood followed up with a couple of coats of potable water proof paint that I have left over from the water tank">fresh water tank. I have not fitted the top yet.
I still don't understand from the diagram how it is possible to pump overboard without just filling up the holding tank with seawater. Would anyone like a go at explaining this one?





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I'm a real advocate for top mounted input/output ports and vents as long as you have the overhead space. A top mounted vent is probably more important than the top mounted input/output port. Will you have a clean-out port? I think that they're a good idea, if possible. Also, how will you be connecting the ports and fittings?

What material are you using for the tank?

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Old 16-04-2013, 18:28   #38
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The outlet port must be the top of a pickup tube that goes down into the tank to a point very near the bottom. Look at http://sankaty.homestead.com/holding_details.html. Also, to dump overboard, you will need a pump (diaphragm or macerator).
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Old 16-04-2013, 20:21   #39
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Re: So it begins

Dana,
Got it. I was aware of the pick up tube. What I was having a brain fart (if I may) with was the macerator pump. When looking at the diagram I posted since it did not show another pump other than the manual one on the head. I was presuming there was some way to gravity drain or use the head pump to pump out the tank.
My house building skills do not always translate well to boat work.
You know the old saying that all you need to know to be a plumber is: The hot is on the left, the cold on the right, and sh!t doesn't go uphill.
Well I guess it does on a boat!

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The outlet port must be the top of a pickup tube that goes down into the tank to a point very near the bottom. Look at Holding tanks. Also, to dump overboard, you will need a pump (diaphragm or macerator).
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Old 18-06-2013, 08:29   #40
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Re: So it Begins

Finally some VISUAL progress. The systems of course take the most time, but I am happy to have some visual gratification.
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Old 18-06-2013, 10:25   #41
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Re: So it Begins

Jeanathon - She looks really nice. The Hinterholen's were/are a beautifully made Canadian boat.

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Old 18-06-2013, 19:56   #42
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Good work! Better and better.
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Old 18-06-2013, 20:00   #43
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Good work! Better and better.
+A1...
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Old 18-06-2013, 20:15   #44
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Re: So it Begins

Nice! Just perused this thread, and I really like the trailer setup! Is that a 24' trailer? With a 78 Ford pulling it????

Nice rig. And the boat is cool too, of course. I looked at a Niagara 35. Nice boats.

What does that boat weigh? Very curious, the wheel coming off! Was there a bearing issue or something?

fellow WNC sailor-
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Old 19-06-2013, 06:31   #45
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Re: So it Begins

Cheoah,
Close. 25' with the last 3' angled and a 77' Ford F-250.
The boat weighs in at 7500#. Not sure about the cause of the wheel coming off. It wasn't a bearing. All 8 lugs were sheared off even with the hub. The lug nuts might have loosened up combined with a rough road or the hub being stamped "made in China" could be a clue. I was worried about my truck making it not a relatively new trailer. Both made it though, and the stress of worrying the whole way only caused me to lose a few more hairs.
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