Saving My Toerail- Advice?

[Cheechako]

If you are clearcoating again over the toerail, you will never likely see an epoxy fill. (no sawdust!) I did this on a vintage guitar that had been caved in last year. Pushed the caved in part back into place. Used ISO glue to make it stay there as best as possible. Filled the whole area with epoxy, thickest part probably 1/8" thick, sanded flush, then nitrocelluose lacquer over the whole area. It was this or replace the whole side on a 1937 guitar. You cant even see it now.

[four winds]

keepondancin, thanks for your time and help. I agree about the "splotch" comment.

Reading about Titebond (lol, auto correct changes that to titbond, wierd) looks like it is a good choice. Probably better than my Elmers.

Trying to use materials onboard. Maybe the mineral spirits I have will sub for acetone. Not a strong a solvent, I know. In fact it won't clean up a brush with Latonkinwois varnish residue. But I gots the low budget blues.

BTW, I don't think the scarf had any sealer originally because it fit tightly. Posted above how I think it got to where it is now.

Looks like the rail was originally installed over some type of rubber tape strips. Maybe butyl if it exists in a form that would survive all these years and remain intact, not degraded, and still pliable. It's visible in another area on the boat, and curious about it.

[Cheechako]

Originally Posted by four winds

keepondancin, thanks for your time and help. I agree about the "splotch" comment.

Reading about Titebond (lol, auto correct changes that to titbond, wierd) looks like it is a good choice. Probably better than my Elmers.

Trying to use materials onboard. Maybe the mineral spirits I have will sub for acetone. Not a strong a solvent, I know. In fact it won't clean up a brush with Latonkinwois varnish residue. But I gots the low budget blues.

BTW, I don't think the scarf had any sealer originally because it fit tightly. Posted above how I think it got to where it is now.

Looks like the rail was originally installed over some type of rubber tape strips. Maybe butyl if it exists in a form that would survive all these years and remain intact, not degraded, and still pliable. It's visible in another area on the boat, and curious about it.

NO... mineral spirits will not be good, It's like light oil. Worse than nothing.

[four winds]

Cheech, on the stern I have five inch wide teak cap, also oversanded to the screw heads. It has bold grain patterns and figuring which promoted decay. It was split in several long splinters (but not detached) and at risk to abandon ship.

I epoxied the pieces back together. Rebunged the holes, both original and all the holes where old loran and GPS antennas were. Then sanded and varnished that section. It's now solid and looks good enough. But the epoxy shows as thin dark stripes with a few small larger spots where wood was missing. It follows the grain mostly so not that bad.

But this new repair would be just a random dark spot I feel. Would be more than an eighth thick certainly as well.

Maybe not if the teak color showed through the clear epoxy, like the wood on you guitar repair. But I'm not sure it would.

[four winds]

Thanks, mineral spirits verboten, copy that.

[Cheechako]

Originally Posted by four winds

Cheech, on the stern I have five inch wide teak cap, also oversanded to the screw heads. It has bold grain patterns and figuring which promoted decay. It was split in several long splinters (but not detached) and at risk to abandon ship.

I epoxied the pieces back together. Rebunged the holes, both original and all the holes where old loran and GPS antennas were. Then sanded and varnished that section. It's now solid and looks good enough. But the epoxy shows as thin dark stripes with a few small larger spots where wood was missing. It follows the grain mostly so not that bad.

But this new repair would be just a random dark spot I feel. Would be more than an eighth thick certainly as well.

Maybe not if the teak color showed through the clear epoxy, like the wood on you guitar repair. But I'm not sure it would.

Yes, no doubt it might not match. A lot going on. Looking at that toerail I figured some mismatch would be not a problem. Then again, Teak can have some dark streaks and blotches or can be very uniform.... Personally I'm not very fond of epoxy, especially out in the sun. I've seen some toerails virtually destroyed by people trying to use epoxy like varnish then varnishing over but not maintaining the varnish. What a mess! This boat would be a nice candidate for fill and paint the toerail creamy white or grey! Paint far outlasts varnish too.

[four winds]

Ouch! That stung a little, lol.

It's not that far gone I hope. It's all I got.

Screen capture from a local news video about the anchorage here.

[JPA Cate]

Hi, Four Winds,

Don't let it sting too badly. A number of people used to, before setting off on a circumnavigation, or to the tropics, first, get a good layer of varnish on the wood, then paint it. Some used a golden teak or other wood color; others, dove grey, which from a distance looks like teak gone silver; and others, painted it a color, sometimes to match their sail covers; others, just a color they liked. The paint is more durable in the tropics than the varnish, and it all comes off relatively easily with a heat gun and a scraper. Saves many hours of work.

But first you want to make the rail smooth, and that means a plug. Maybe one of your friends will let you use some of their acetone, it doesn't take much, but it seems to be critical for any glue to adhere to teak. It is true unprotected epoxy breaks down from the UV., so you'll want to keep at least varnish on your toe rail.

However, in terms of preserving the timber intact, it wouldn't hurt to think about the benefits of painting it.

Ann

[four winds]

Thanks for your input Ann. It only stung for a minute. It is what it is, as they say.

Actually, I have been considering painting the rail for a couple of years now. Though had not known that painting over varnish was an option. So I can continue this path and think about it.

Last year I varnished the other exterior teak and left the rail grey. The rest is in good shape, looks fine, and thought I was good to go. But then that stern cap rail began to disassemble itself and I knew something must be done. The grey rail was deteriorating at an astonishing rate. In Florida sun and summer showers. In brackish water so not really salt water washdown.

Soon it will be patched up and varnished. And go from there.

What type of paint for this idea?

[Scout 30]

Originally Posted by jeepbluetj

Carpenters would call the solution a 'dutchman'.

Basically cut a piece of the same wood to be a patch, cut out the wood in the toerail to fit the patch into. Glue away. Generally the patch is kind of hourglass shaped so that it becomes somewhat structural/visually interesting.

[SSgtPitt]

Dutchman, Dutchman, Dutchman.
Titebond is good, but that Gorilla glue bond is crazy strong once it stops foaming and hardens. And it looks good with varnish over it.
Beautiful boats should stay that way. No one ever comes aboard and Oohs and Aahs about painted wood. Beautifully maintained wood on the other hand, it is something to be proud of and is an indicator of the pride of ownership and maintenance of the boat when it moves to the next owner.

[PuttingDoctor]

Four Winds, I too have issues with my toerail. My luck is that the damage is limited. I have converted much of the brightwork to painted finish for maintenance in the tropics. Teak left to gray has open grain and a sealer is in order to limit how much paint or varnish will be drawn into the open grain. See below a photo of my rubrail and eyebrow now painted.

[Cheechako]

Originally Posted by four winds

Ouch! That stung a little, lol.

It's not that far gone I hope. It's all I got.

Screen capture from a local news video about the anchorage here.

If the "sting" was my comment I apologize, it wasn't meant that way! There's yacht club toerails varnished with a dozen coats yearly on boats seldom used, then there are the rest of us. As described, your toerail may never be as new again but can look fine. I've admired a few painted ones too.... not just some paint slopped on, but as Ann mentioned, nicely done they can look top notch.

[JPA Cate]

As to paint, you do not want LPU, you need a paint that is happy with timber's expansions and contractions. I, personally, would start asking around paint manufacturers for what would last longest in that toe rail application, you want something that will stand up to stepping on it.

As to prep, you'll want to acetone wash all the teak before you varnish it, too, for best adhesion. Its natural oils will otherwise prevent it.

Good luck with it. And, Putting Doctor's rub rail looks fine, does't it?

Ann

[four winds]

Thanks again Ann, yes that rubrail does look good. Both the painting and the robust design.

My rubrail is the outer piece at the towrail. It's got a couple of spots that need a Dutchman as well.


I should post a high res pic of the boat, and come clean so to speak on my boat. Need to transfer one from my laptop.

It's not that bad. In another life I restored and built cars and bikes. Enjoy that process. Mostly metal of course.

The title "saving my towrail"......... from this thread I realize the dual interests of this title. Torn between saving (as best possible) a proper or Bristol state, and saving the wood itself.

I get to do some wood work, not metal, and I'll varnish. Then go on to the next cosmetic need while considering a painted towrail.

I occurs to me that if painted, the same flag blue of the hull might be considered. Thought I might post a good picture before mentioning that but oh well.