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Old 24-10-2013, 07:01   #31
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Re: Rudder nightmare at sea

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Originally Posted by jkangas View Post
Ok, I'm back. Bluewaters, e-mail Al @ bobwalker10@aol.com. He is expecting to hear from you and is ready to help.
Thanks so much for your help. Have just been visited by Customs. They were just checking if all ok. They told us that the authorities were told by the fishermen that we had refused assistance from the authorities. We suspected that we weren't rescued by the authorities because the fishermen were just looking to make some money out of us and that proves to be true. We would never refuse assistance!

Oh well, some people will kick you when you're down. Costing us to pay the fishermen 5000.00 Euros and they are holding us to ransom here at the moment. Basically frog-marched us to their car and drove us to a cash machine yesterday. They will back again today to do the same and will be doing that for the next 4 days because we are limited to 1000.00 Euros withdrawal per day.

Life sucks sometimes but fortunately there are genuinely good people like yourself (as well as others here on this forum) that are willing to provide all sorts of assistance where they can. I will send an email to Al, thank you.
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Old 24-10-2013, 07:03   #32
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Re: Rudder nightmare at sea

Hey Bluewaters,

I heard about your problem through friends here in Grenada.

Le Marin has a Sunsail (TUI) charter base and they, of course, run a stack of Beneteau 50's.
Their base manager may be able to give you some good ideas over the phone of the best yard etc and some good contacts.

(596) 596 749817


I have found Sunsail/Mooring/TUI very helpful in the past with info.

Good luck!


Mark
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Old 24-10-2013, 07:09   #33
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Re: Rudder nightmare at sea

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Originally Posted by MarkJ View Post
Hey Bluewaters,

I heard about your problem through friends here in Grenada.

Le Marin has a Sunsail (TUI) charter base and they, of course, run a stack of Beneteau 50's.
Their base manager may be able to give you some good ideas over the phone of the best yard etc and some good contacts.

(596) 596 749817


I have found Sunsail/Mooring/TUI very helpful in the past with info.

Good luck!


Mark
heck Mark, thanks so much for that. We need all the help we can get. I will call them right away and keep you posted. In the meantime we are held here until we pay the 5000.00 Euros to the fishermen. We have arranged for when we are ready, to be towed to Le Marin. I will definitely phone Sunsail, thanks.
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Old 24-10-2013, 07:13   #34
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Re: Rudder nightmare at sea

Thanks for all the responses folks. I will digest them all and follow up with what I can. In the meantime I attached the GoPro to a pole and albeit not a great video, here is the underside of the boat. I will try and take a better video for posting. I must stress that the rudder had been worked on before this happened after it clipped a rock. No other damage though. I am wondering whether there wasn't a hairline fracture that they didn't pick up and over the last two months it progressively deteriorated to a point it just snapped off.
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Old 24-10-2013, 07:13   #35
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I would suggest the rudder stock must have had previous damage or a manufacturing defect , which is unlikely

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Old 24-10-2013, 07:16   #36
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Originally Posted by Bluewaters2812 View Post

Thanks so much for your help. Have just been visited by Customs. They were just checking if all ok. They told us that the authorities were told by the fishermen that we had refused assistance from the authorities. We suspected that we weren't rescued by the authorities because the fishermen were just looking to make some money out of us and that proves to be true. We would never refuse assistance!

Oh well, some people will kick you when you're down. Costing us to pay the fishermen 5000.00 Euros and they are holding us to ransom here at the moment. Basically frog-marched us to their car and drove us to a cash machine yesterday. They will back again today to do the same and will be doing that for the next 4 days because we are limited to 1000.00 Euros withdrawal per day.

Life sucks sometimes but fortunately there are genuinely good people like yourself (as well as others here on this forum) that are willing to provide all sorts of assistance where they can. I will send an email to Al, thank you.
Damn that sucks! We ended up paying a $3400.00 tow bill when we lost ours. If you have Foss build it you might request the alloy that atol mentioned. See what Al says...and sorry for the metallurgical thread jack. Always interesting things to learn on here. And good luck! If there's anything to do to help stateside let me know.
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Old 24-10-2013, 07:16   #37
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Re: Rudder nightmare at sea

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Originally Posted by jkangas View Post
So you're saying the shaft may be bent by water force alone. Man I hope you're wrong. We sailed through some pretty wild **** when we brought the boat from Grand Cay to Charleston. Guess time will tell. Thanks for giving me something new to worry about :-).
sorry about that!

i once was working as a stevedore on a ship that came into durban harbour after a bad storm,missing its 350 ton spare propellor on the aft deck.....funny thing was when it got washed overboard it hadn't even touched the aft railings!
never underestimate the power of water! it is like concrete if you hit it fast enough!
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Old 24-10-2013, 07:22   #38
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Re: Rudder nightmare at sea

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Originally Posted by Bluewaters2812 View Post
Thanks for all the responses folks. I will digest them all and follow up with what I can. In the meantime I attached the GoPro to a pole and albeit not a great video, here is the underside of the boat. I will try and take a better video for posting. I must stress that the rudder had been worked on before this happened after it clipped a rock. No other damage though. I am wondering whether there wasn't a hairline fracture that they didn't pick up and over the last two months it progressively deteriorated to a point it just snapped off.
if it had been welded when being repaired this would have destroyed it's hardend properties,and corrosion resistance.

though i have seen stocks eaten through by electrolysis from stray currents where they exit the hull
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Old 24-10-2013, 07:26   #39
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Re: Rudder nightmare at sea

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Originally Posted by Bluewaters2812 View Post
held here until we pay the 5000.00 Euros to the fishermen. We have arranged for when we are ready, to be towed to Le Marin.
I hate to say that 5,000 euro sounds reasonable. You could ask the chandlry at Fort de France (on the road in front of you, to the left on the bay side of the road up about 50 meters past where the shops start at the end of the bus area) if they know a lawyer to help you.

29 hour tow; took them off their fishing grounds so your paying for that loss of fishing; time in port; time to return to their fishing ground and loss of fishing time.

72 nms x 3 plus stuff around time can't be less than 3 days and the day tow = 4 days at 1,000 euro per day and 1,000 euro for you being a forigner (or the broken tow ropes) = 5,000. = USD$7,000
Maybe someone in the towing profession can comment?

Maybe just have to 'cop it sweet' as we say... not easy, but better than still being out there or loosing the boat which may have happened if the EPIRB was responded to.




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Old 24-10-2013, 07:30   #40
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Re: Rudder nightmare at sea

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Originally Posted by MarkJ View Post
I hate to say that 5,000 euro sounds reasonable. You could ask the chandlry at Fort de France (on the road in front of you, to the left on the bay side of the road up about 50 meters past where the shops start at the end of the bus area) if they know a lawyer to help you.

29 hour tow; took them off their fishing grounds so your paying for that loss of fishing; time in port; time to return to their fishing ground and loss of fishing time.

72 nms x 3 plus stuff around time can't be less than 3 days and the day tow = 4 days at 1,000 euro per day and 1,000 euro for you being a forigner (or the broken tow ropes) = 5,000. = USD$7,000
Maybe someone in the towing profession can comment?

Maybe just have to 'cop it sweet' as we say... not easy, but better than still being out there or loosing the boat which may have happened if the EPIRB was responded to.




Mark
Yes, we are accepting the 5000.00.Have no choice. Just the manner in which we are being treated and the fact that they said we refused assistance from the authorities to tow us. I had a personal discussion with them and agreed a price of 250.00 Euros per hour. They would have towed us faster and more professionally too. They said they would do 5knots under tow. We were doing about 2.5-3 knots and porpoising wildly. Had the rope snap 5 times too, each time taking up at least another hour to get going again.
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Old 24-10-2013, 07:32   #41
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Re: Rudder nightmare at sea

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Originally Posted by atoll View Post
if it had been welded when being repaired this would have destroyed it's hardend properties,and corrosion resistance.

though i have seen stocks eaten through by electrolysis from stray currents where they exit the hull
I think the entire post.shaft is made of fibreglass. Not an expert though so not sure.
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Old 24-10-2013, 07:45   #42
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Re: Rudder nightmare at sea

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Originally Posted by Bluewaters2812 View Post
I think the entire post.shaft is made of fibreglass. Not an expert though so not sure.
best get on to beneteau via the guys at le marin,probably carbon fibre if it is composite,and will need to be molded and autoclaved in an oven,using the correct technics and mold
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Old 24-10-2013, 07:52   #43
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Re: Rudder nightmare at sea

My new boat has a fiberglass / carbon fiber shaft, but the one that broke looked like this after I dropped the remaining stock:


(I didn't get hauled until 3 weeks after the incident and was in Spanish Town, BVI in the marina, so the coppery-look is most likely electroloysis after the fact.
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Old 24-10-2013, 08:07   #44
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Re: Rudder nightmare at sea

BW, good luck in getting it sorted....

I've got to ask... Is this something common nowadays? The posts make it seems like this isn't a big deal. I don't recall hearing about this on other older boats. It might just be because I wasn't reading forums. Are newer boats cutting corners. I'll happily take the discussion to another thread, if needed.
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Old 24-10-2013, 08:13   #45
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Re: Rudder nightmare at sea

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Originally Posted by jkangas View Post
Ok just talked to Al. He just did an Oceanis rudder. Is your post still intact? He said the beneteau usually lose the rudder blade off the post and they can be rebuilt which will save you a fair amount of money. Tropical shipping can probably get the post to them. Got to get to work. We can continue this conversation in about 1/2 hour.
Jesus, what kind of boat "usually loses the rudder" ?
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