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Old 31-10-2013, 05:26   #301
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Re: Rudder nightmare at sea

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Originally Posted by Zanshin View Post
I'm glad that things are progressing for you. I think that my new rudder cost a bit less, but the shipping (via air and tropical-shipping) was about the same price.

Don't forget to factor in some extra cleaning supplies and labor for degreasing/cleaning the new rudder, then priming it and then putting on a couple of layers of new antifouling - I had forgotten about that when my rudder arrived and was hard-pressed to get everything finished in time for the boat to get splashed (I had my boat hauled out in order to complete the job, I'm not sure if I could have done it in the water as you are doing).
Thanks, yes we do need to make provision for that, thanks.
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Old 31-10-2013, 07:32   #302
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Re: Rudder nightmare at sea

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What a disaster it would have been had this happened halfway across the Atlantic! Houdini done it again.
Why not discuss having a backup plan in case of rudder failure and what that plan might be? Kind of a lessons learned analysis applied to your next trip offshore. Look at the failure halfway across the Atlantic scenario.
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Old 31-10-2013, 07:56   #303
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Re: Rudder nightmare at sea

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when we replaced our primary anchor, which was stolen 2 months ago in Martinique whilst we were at anchor at a remote anchorage.
How did someone steal your anchor while you were anchored? Did they set your boat loose?

Mark
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Old 31-10-2013, 08:17   #304
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Re: Rudder nightmare at sea

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How did someone steal your anchor while you were anchored? Did they set your boat loose?

Mark
Yes they did Mark. We went down for supper and heard the motorboat at our anchor position. Thought it might be local fishermen. Went up after supper and checked, only to find an anchor chain and the anchor missing. Pulled the chain up, motored out to sea and attached the second anchor and moved on to the next anchorage.

Our cruising kitty has been absolutely hammered.Hope we have a turnaround of luck from now on but it just seems to continue for us.
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Old 31-10-2013, 08:19   #305
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Re: Rudder nightmare at sea

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Originally Posted by LakeSuperior View Post
Why not discuss having a backup plan in case of rudder failure and what that plan might be? Kind of a lessons learned analysis applied to your next trip offshore. Look at the failure halfway across the Atlantic scenario.
Perhaps you can open a new thread and provide your solutions. I have enough on my plate here at the moment and this thread is not the place to do what you are suggesting.
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Old 31-10-2013, 08:46   #306
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Re: Rudder nightmare at sea

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Perhaps you can open a new thread and provide your solutions. I have enough on my plate here at the moment and this thread is not the place to do what you are suggesting.
While you are waiting for your new rudder you could be putting the backup together.

I think it goes hand in hand with this thread. I am going to be a little blunt but you are a guy that heads offshore unprepared, no backup for a rudder/steering gear failure, gets into trouble, immediately activates your EPIRB, and then bitches and whines about the expertise and expense of the rescue. Then on top of it all you are blaming the previous owners, the surveyor, and the manufacturer for your troubles. I guess I went to a different school.

And, OBTW anyone pointing out these facts is a SOB.
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Old 31-10-2013, 09:43   #307
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Re: Rudder nightmare at sea

According to Sail Magazine rudder failures happen to 1% of sailboats, not a very insignificant number for those naysayers on this board,

Know Your Rudder | Sail Magazine
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Old 31-10-2013, 09:51   #308
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According to Sail Magazine rudder failures happen to 1% of sailboats, not a very insignificant number for those naysayers on this board,

Know Your Rudder | Sail Magazine
That article doesn't say 1%. I mean its not credible to suggest 1in 100 are failing. Furthermore the article address all sorts of rudder issues across all rudder types

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Old 31-10-2013, 09:52   #309
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Re: Rudder nightmare at sea

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Originally Posted by LakeSuperior View Post
While you are waiting for your new rudder you could be putting the backup together.

I think it goes hand in hand with this thread. I am going to be a little blunt but you are a guy that heads offshore unprepared, no backup for a rudder/steering gear failure, gets into trouble, immediately activates your EPIRB, and then bitches and whines about the expertise and expense of the rescue. Then on top of it all you are blaming the previous owners, the surveyor, and the manufacturer for your troubles. I guess I went to a different school.

And, OBTW anyone pointing out these facts is a SOB.
''no backup for a rudder/steering gear failure''

100 per cent boats we met in the Caribbean did not have this kind of back-up. Including me.

We're talking Caribbean sea here, not Cape Horn...
I don't understand how Lake Superior can make this kind of comments...
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Old 31-10-2013, 09:58   #310
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Re: Rudder nightmare at sea

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Originally Posted by MARC D View Post
''no backup for a rudder/steering gear failure''

100 per cent boats we met in the Caribbean did not have this kind of back-up. Including me.

We're talking Caribbean sea here, not Cape Horn...
I don't understand how Lake Superior can make this kind of comments...
Thanks Marc, appreciate this input. Same experience I have had.
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Old 31-10-2013, 10:02   #311
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Re: Rudder nightmare at sea

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Originally Posted by MARC D View Post
''no backup for a rudder/steering gear failure''

100 per cent boats we met in the Caribbean did not have this kind of back-up. Including me.

We're talking Caribbean sea here, not Cape Horn...
I don't understand how Lake Superior can make this kind of comments...
I believe that not having a strategy or plan for making way after loss of the rudder is irresponsible and poor seamanship. The above referenced article from Sail talks about 1 out of every 100 boats having a rudder failure. Just about every book written on preparing for offshore sailing talks about rudder/steering gear backup. I speculate you are incorrect about the number of folks not having a backup in the Caribbean.

In many respects sailing in the Caribbean is more challenging and dangerous than the open ocean in part due the fact that respect is not given, i.e. your post.
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Old 31-10-2013, 10:06   #312
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Re: Rudder nightmare at sea

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Originally Posted by robert sailor View Post
According to Sail Magazine rudder failures happen to 1% of sailboats, not a very insignificant number for those naysayers on this board,

Know Your Rudder | Sail Magazine
The problem with that article is that it provides no reference for that 1% number. That is irresponsible because that number is very large and requires some type of reference if it is to be repeated. Also, the article counts bearing problems, seal problems and rudder stop problems among "rudder failures". It does not mention if that 1% includes things jammed in the rudder, quadrant failures, sheave failures, broken cables and other steering issues, which seem to me to be probable enough to account for 1%.

Without references, I do not believe that 1% of rudders are lost or damaged beyond field-servicing. If that is true, of the 100,000 boats easily being sailed at any specific point in time, 1,000 would be losing their rudders. That is too large to not hear of this.

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Old 31-10-2013, 10:07   #313
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Re: Rudder nightmare at sea

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Originally Posted by goboatingnow View Post
That article doesn't say 1%. I mean its not credible to suggest 1in 100 are failing. Furthermore the article address all sorts of rudder issues across all rudder types

Dave
It states "close to 1%"

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Old 31-10-2013, 10:16   #314
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Re: Rudder nightmare at sea

I have not met a single boat in the 3 years we have sailed through the entire Caribbean that had a backup rudder with the extremely few exceptions of those who had a vane steering system that used an auxiliary rudder to steer the boat.

Well, except those types with standard spare rudders like us...

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Old 31-10-2013, 11:24   #315
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Re: Rudder nightmare at sea

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Originally Posted by colemj View Post
I have not met a single boat in the 3 years we have sailed through the entire Caribbean that had a backup rudder with the extremely few exceptions of those who had a vane steering system that used an auxiliary rudder to steer the boat.

Well, except those types with standard spare rudders like us...

Mark
Nowhere in any of my posts did I talk about having an actual backup or extra complete rudder. I am trying to make the point that it is prudent seamanship have a backup a strategy or plan in case of a failure. For example, this may mean a couple drogues to rig for steering, a spare tiller, extra clamps and a predrilled board for the spinnaker pole, etc.

This approach requires minimal effort to prepare and would have a large payoff. At minimum the OP may have been able to limp to the harbor and save $5000.00 plus an EPIRB. At best it may save your life.

Personally, I think everyone should prepare to the level that they are comfortable with. If your plan is to light the EPIRB and wait for help good for you.
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