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Old 06-02-2015, 19:28   #1
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Planning for a roll-over

Hello Cruisers,

GordMay suggested this thread in the midst of my hand-wringing over securing our engine against a roll-over. To quote...

Quote:
Originally Posted by GordMay View Post
Having discovered several effective secondary (after the “fail-safe” captive mounts) methods of securing the engine against a rollover; perhaps, it would be worthwhile to discuss methods of securing other potential “missiles” against a capsize.
Ie:
Refer’ Compressor
Batteries
Tool Boxes
Canned goods
etc

So, yesterday as I was pottering along out on the Gulf St Vincent, I went from bow to stern on our boat, trying to spot problems in a roll-over. What a depressing investigation.

When I started looking for problems, I sure found them. Our whole sail locker is a nightmare to begin with, two spare anchors inadequately secured against a roll-over. Bailing buckets, jerry cans, all those lovely rows of neatly coiled lines hanging on hooks. There'd be a complete disaster in the bow, and I think the anchors have the potential to do real hull damage too, the only hope being that the sea anchor and associated cables would cushion the blow(s).

Moving aft, the head was ok, the cupboards would end up in a mess and sorting the sunscreen from the mozzie spray would take some work, but all cupboard doors have good positive locks and would be unlikely to spill their contents.

The main saloon was the real shocker. Every settee has lovely big storage bins under the seats, and yep, the tops are held down by gravity and nothing else. Aside from a likely coating of splattered paint over everything, maybe engine oil too, there are some heavy items that could do damage to a human, though probably not the boat itself. The same went for the midships single cabin, only it had the nasty heavy stuff, like the spare prop, the dive weights, two spare winches. Heavy, hard and dangerous in there.

The water and fuel tanks seem well fastened, though it is hard to tell if the straps are adequate. I have decided to add additional restraints before we do around Oz, just in case.

I recently moved our battery bank from the stern to mid-ships to improve weight distribution, so I was already pretty happy with the battery bank setup, but I can still see room for improvement, and HappyMdRSailor's remark about a "top bar pressing firmly down" has given me the next step in improving things. (Thanks HMRS!)

The galley was excellent, provided all the door and drawer latches were engaged, and they usually are when under way, plus I had recently reinforced all the drawer latches with beefy aluminium striker plates anyway. I think you could possible lift the boat via attachments to the fridge, so no problems their either, and good strong secondary latches on the fridge door means at worst you'll be sorting out scrambled eggs inside the fridge, not inside the boat.

GordMay had already brought the toolbox(s) to my attention, so no surprises in the main companionway (unless you count a toolbox hitting you in the head as a surprise) which leaves the aft cabin, which surprised me by being very good, so probably the best place to be in our boat should we get rolled.

Food for thought, and enough to make me start this thread as I hope it gets you thinking the way GordMay got me thinking. Before that walk-through I would have said everything was fine and sea-worthy on the Good Swanson Manera. Now I see I have more work ahead of me.

Happy travels,

Matt
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Old 07-02-2015, 01:07   #2
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Re: Planning for a roll-over

Matt:

Barrell bolts for the drop lockers under bunks and settees.

Rabbit hutch discs for positive closure of cupboards. Some cupboards might also need an internal stopper for tall items to not rush agains the doors.

Open stuff? can bond pad eyes and make secure netting for items stowed in berths.

Do KISS. Chances of rollovers are much less these days, given how far the met bureaus can look into the future.

Ann
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Old 07-02-2015, 05:25   #3
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Re: Planning for a roll-over

-- and hope the holding tank input hose clamps don't fail.
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Old 07-02-2015, 05:54   #4
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Re: Planning for a roll-over

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Old 07-02-2015, 06:33   #5
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Re: Planning for a roll-over

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Stocking View Post
-- and hope the holding tank input hose clamps don't fail.

Indeed, and a mention of the basics is called for. Fuel tanks chained down, water tanks as well. Click image for larger version

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Old 07-02-2015, 06:43   #6
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Re: Planning for a roll-over

One thing a person might not think about is what happens to the liquor in the liquer Cabinet. Of course Most of my liquor come in plastic bottles. Mac
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Old 07-02-2015, 11:55   #7
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Re: Planning for a roll-over

Quote:
Originally Posted by GILow View Post
Hello Cruisers,

<snip>


So, yesterday as I was pottering along out on the Gulf St Vincent, I went from bow to stern on our boat, trying to spot problems in a roll-over. What a depressing investigation.
<clip>

Happy travels,

Matt
I thank you for the post. Perhaps it was because I was raised riding motorbikes and then learned to fly aircraft but when my eyes looks at boats what my brain reads is that would hurt, oh my, and that ain't good either kinds of assessments of everything aboard. Bear in mind that I have never sailed farther out than the rivers in the lower Chesapeake bay, but that hasn't stopped my brain from sorting consequences.

Thank you for the insightful post. As the Boy Scouts taught me "Be Prepared!"

Sundae
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Old 07-02-2015, 13:17   #8
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Re: Planning for a roll-over

"One thing a person might not think about is what happens to the liquor in the liquer Cabinet. Of course Most of my liquor come in plastic bottles."

I guess it depends upon how you desire your adult beverage of choice. Our good friend and my slightly less talented brother, Mr. James Bond, prefers his shaken, not stirred, so he should do just fine in a roll over!
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Old 07-02-2015, 14:03   #9
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Re: Planning for a roll-over

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Stocking View Post
-- and hope the holding tank input hose clamps don't fail.
Wifey B: Oh that would definitely be sh...ty
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Old 07-02-2015, 18:23   #10
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Re: Planning for a roll-over

You probably have read this tip in 'provisioning' ... but with a rollover there could also be a large amount of seawater sloshing around in the cabin/ gear. Can labels will soon come off your rolling around can goods, so it's a good idea during provisioning to use a permanent marker on the can tops to ID contents and 'use by' date. VHF marine radio could likely take a dunking and not work afterwards. While not in the same focus of securing everything that can clunk you/ do physical damage... it's a good idea to have a spare VHF/ HT & LED flashlights and batteries in a waterproof bag/ Baggie (possibly already in your emergency ditch bag w/ flares) so you will still have a means to get organized/ inspect for damage and/ or communicate/ flag down help if needed after a knockdown.


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Old 07-02-2015, 18:24   #11
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Re: Planning for a roll-over

Quote:
Originally Posted by ArmyDaveNY View Post
"One thing a person might not think about is what happens to the liquor in the liquer Cabinet. Of course Most of my liquor come in plastic bottles."

I guess it depends upon how you desire your adult beverage of choice. Our good friend and my slightly less talented brother, Mr. James Bond, prefers his shaken, not stirred, so he should do just fine in a roll over!

I've been thinking about the whole rollover motion and I fear that the drinks end up stirred not shaken. Thankfully I am not expecting a visit from Mr Bond any time soon.




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Old 07-02-2015, 18:26   #12
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Re: Planning for a roll-over

Quote:
Originally Posted by W3GAC View Post
You probably have read this tip in 'provisioning' ... but with a rollover there could also be a large amount of seawater sloshing around in the cabin/ gear. Can labels will soon come off your rolling around can goods, so it's a good idea during provisioning to use a permanent marker on the can tops to ID contents and 'use by' date. VHF marine radio could likely take a dunking and not work afterwards. While not in the same focus of securing everything that can clunk you/ do physical damage... it's a good idea to have a spare VHF/ HT & LED flashlights and batteries in a waterproof bag/ Baggie (possibly already in your emergency ditch bag w/ flares) so you will still have a means to get organized/ inspect for damage and/ or communicate/ flag down help if needed after a knockdown.


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Good point. The quantity of water shipped in the relatively benign yachting monthly video was staggering.


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Old 08-02-2015, 02:01   #13
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Re: Planning for a roll-over

Funny I thought they got off light, we were knee deep.

Remember to secure the oven if it is in gimbals, many will allow it to drop out when inverted, stick a bolt across the top of the gimbal.
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Old 08-02-2015, 05:06   #14
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Re: Planning for a roll-over

Some years ago we had an a big sea hit us , my boat went over - 50 degrees , not to serious , but we had a pile of 10 x supper plates ,burst out of the locker and fly across the saloon . they really damaged my woodwork , but would have hospitalized someone or worse, had they been hit . Bow / stern anchor and battery bank need to be attended to by me asap .food for thought . cheers Garth
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Old 08-02-2015, 05:59   #15
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Re: Planning for a roll-over

I am working on an electric solution. I have 4 225Ah batteries stacked one over the other in a steel rack that is carefully screwed into a locker amidships. Every battery has a main switch to disconnect it and the switches are about 1,8m above the saloons deck level. The highest battery about 1,5m above saloon deck level. All wires are carefully crimped and shrinked. All main 12V electricity wires 50mm˛ - Bowthruster 95mm˛ beeing able to run through water below 3 feet of water (including bilge) in the vessel.

So if there is a rollover I am sure that I will not get enough water in to ruin my electricity and my 2 x 45l and 1x250l /minute pumps. So even 10 m˛ of Water in my 20 tons Ketch should be out within 40 Minutes Cost = 10Ah
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