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Old 30-04-2011, 17:50   #16
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Re: Painting the Hull Above the Water Line ?

SOME EPOXY ONE PART PAINTS ARE ROLLABLE WITH EXCELLENT RESULTS--ALSO BRUSHable--seen it happen to perfection-- have fun and goood luck.
please excuse my typoing-----


i2f looks awesome!!!!! great job!!!!!
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Old 30-04-2011, 18:08   #17
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Re: Painting the Hull Above the Water Line ?

We just painted a club 19 foot West Wight Potter with an industrial paint much like IMRON made by Cardinal. Used the roll and tip method and none had any experience. Aqua blue over white. It turned out respectable with one coat. It will be trailered so we can touch up pretty easily. I would recommend it for a sailing, hard use working boat but will spray mine when I get the hull ready in a few months.
Probably could have done a better job had we thinned the paint a bit before application and done two coats.
kind regards,
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Old 30-04-2011, 18:17   #18
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Re: Painting the Hull Above the Water Line ?

We use awlgrip products on customer boats mainly because they have been well marketed and most people are happy with the boring color choices available in the marine paints. Awlgrip which is a polyester urethane goes on really well either by spray or roll and tipped, either method will give equal gloss and be virtually indistinguishable from one another if applied with equal skill, ie,orange peel or too dry will give away the spray job, brush strokes the roll and tipped job. I have had the rather unique experience of working on a beautiful dark blue Cherubini 44 which had one side in the original awlgrip(sprayed) and the other side had been scratched up on the dock and, because awlgrip is not really repairable,had had the whole side repainted with the same paint but roll and tipped, on very close inspection, i would say the roll and tipped side was better than the original which had orange peel which while not bad,was worse than any brush strokes on the other side (no we didnt do the painting). I have been using automotive paints on my own boats for 20 years not because of any cost savings(i can buy awlgrip cheaper) but because of the unlimited color choices and the fact that most of them are acrylic urethanes which is the same chemistry as the newer Awlcraft product which is repairable so if i need to do a repair i can have it mixed anywhere. I have used Dupont and PPG products and these companies have been making the acrylic urethanes a lot longer than the boat paint companies. Currently i have been using Nason Fullthane and am very happy with it. Where i live car paints have to endure much harsher conditions than boats do having to put up with being pelted with sand, salt and grit at 70mph in sub zero conditions in the wintertime and they take it amazingly well.
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Old 30-04-2011, 18:39   #19
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Re: Painting the Hull Above the Water Line ?

Use the best tie-coat you can find. Substrate prep is 50% success. Make sure the hull is perfectly even and smooth before painting. All irregularities will show up.

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Old 30-04-2011, 20:38   #20
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Re: Painting the Hull Above the Water Line ?

Awlgrip (and similar products) will give you the ultimate shine. Automotive paint is much easier to work with. Once you apply the paint it is final (especially with a dark color). You can work it a little with a buffer, but it not much at all.

IMO damage repair is the biggest issue with these types of coatings. A little sand from the beach left on your dink will turn a beautiful paint job into something that you will stare at with disgust every time you approach the boat.

Why not gel coat? It is considerably easier to repair and handles dock/launch rash much better. It can be sprayed or rolled to a less than perfect surface. The big drawback is you are going to have to do some sanding and buffing after the application to get a good shine.
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Old 30-04-2011, 23:44   #21
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Re: Painting the Hull Above the Water Line ?

G'Day Rocketman,

There is a lot of good advice here so it will depend on you if you go for spray or roll and tip.
The main work is not in the application of the finish coat, that takes only a few hours. The real work and time is in the prep. I, like you, hauled out and was only going to do a quick roll and tip job thinking that would be good enough. Once I started the project I realised that the prep work that was required meant that we might as well spray and go for the ultimate shine as the prep work for either method was the same.
6 years on and thousands of miles under the keel the hull still draws comment when ever we pull into a new anchorage or marina and is a source of great pride. It also means that it is actually easier to keep it looking good with alittle wax every now and again.
I painted (rolled and tipped) a friends boat with International Perfection after spraying my own. The finish was reasonable although when our boats were close the difference was remarkable. The roll and tip certainly falls into the 15 metre rule.
The main difference between auto work and boats is planning to ensure you keep a wet edge on the large surfaces and you don't overspray at the end of the coat onto the start of the job. I actually think the spraying of the top coat was easier than auto work.
We documented the spray job on our web site Home Page: Spirit of Sobraon's Travel Log The.... I have provided the link direct to the respray project (Blog) Painting Spirit of Sobraon: We decided in 2005...
I'll try to find some pictures of the roll and tip job to show you the difference.
Good luck with your job.

Garry
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Home Page: Spirit of Sobraon's Travel Log The...
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Old 01-05-2011, 07:00   #22
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Re: Painting the Hull Above the Water Line ?

I am loving all of the great advise, The Spirit OF Sobraon, is a Glorious looking boat I would incourage everyone to take a look at her on your threads, Great job.
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Old 01-05-2011, 07:36   #23
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Re: Painting the Hull Above the Water Line ?

My topsides had previously been painted with a one-part urethane. If that's the case, then you can't use two-part urethane without sanding all the way back down to bare gelcoat. So I rolled and tipped a one-part urethane (Interlux Brightsides), which looked great. But after a couple of years, I've got fender rash on both sides, and I'm getting ready to put another coat on this week to see if I can improve it. The two-part paint lasts longer, I hear.

My experience: don't scrimp on the prep. Sand, sand, and sand some more. I was an experienced boat painter, too, but had never tried the roll and tip method. I followed whatever written instructions I could find, and it didn't come out well. I didn't really understand the concept of a wet edge from the written instructions, plus I didn't have the paint thin enough. Fortunately, a buddy who had experience came by, lent me his orbital sander and a lot of sanding discs to sand it all off, and then showed me how to do it. You need to get a hands-on demo of the technique (which is not that hard once you understand it.)
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Old 01-05-2011, 08:08   #24
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Re: Painting the Hull Above the Water Line ?

Roll and tip with awl grip is a great way to go as long as you keep it a light color. My boat is done in dark green awl grip. My guy put 4 coats roll and tipped before he gave up and had to spray. Even the manufacturer will tell you there are problems with the very dark colors. The deck and house was rolled and tipped in egg shell and cinnamon awl grip and is perfect.
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Old 01-05-2011, 13:59   #25
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Re: Painting the Hull Above the Water Line ?

Personally, I do not share the view that gelcoat can be applied in post production. How do you do this? (Other than repairing small scratches?)

If someone knows a good link to informative source from any boatbuilder / manufacturer on how to apply gelcoat in this manner, I would love to educate myself.

THX,
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Old 01-05-2011, 18:46   #26
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Re: Painting the Hull Above the Water Line ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by moonrsn View Post


(the picture)

A M A Z I N G !!!

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Old 01-05-2011, 19:18   #27
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Re: Painting the Hull Above the Water Line ?

Roll and tip is not too bad,removing the nasty Brushed on bay blue 20 year old paint was a chore. we did have to sand between coats but she came out Awesome!!! Phil at the Clearwater fl finishmaster gave me incredible tips and wrote down all the exact % of thinner etc. I have never roll and tipped or used awl grip b4 this. The first two coats were scary looking then after the 3rd she was beautifull.
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Old 01-05-2011, 19:49   #28
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Re: Painting the Hull Above the Water Line ?

It is not practical to use gelcoat other than for what its designed for which is inside a female mold as it needs to be air inhibited to cure properly,when sprayed in the mold it is the mold surface that gives the perfect finish,the layup side looks like crap and remains tacky ready for the skin coat. While i dont doubt its been done it would be an awful lot of work as you would have to wet sand it and then buff it to get the shine which would not equal the gloss of the urethanes and would not be as durable as gelcoat out of the mold.
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Old 02-05-2011, 11:04   #29
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Re: Painting the Hull Above the Water Line ?

gel coat can absolutely be used post production...have a friend that has done several boats this manner and several finishing companies are offering this as an alternative to paint as repairs are easier. spray or roll...it's just resin and another coat with the right prep is all it takes. finish sanding is tedious if there are runs/sags...but they can be finished out where a drip, run or sag in paint can be a much bigger issue.

also auto paints aren't what a lot are saying...they will last and shine just as well...many think they are easier to touch up than awlgrip.

roll and tip CAN look great...just hard to get the right conditions where rolling and tipping large relatively flat surfaces are easy to do....takes experience and great conditions to work perfectly...even then some paints will never look as good as sprayed...though many come so close it doesn't matter to the average person because it passes the 10 foot test.
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Old 02-05-2011, 11:34   #30
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Re: Painting the Hull Above the Water Line ?

gelcoat CAN be applied post production, but do NOT think is not bludi pricy---will cost more than $25000 for a 30 ft boat to be done in full.......at least it was that much 5 yrs ago.... must be more now... gooood lucki!
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