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Old 12-06-2014, 01:10   #1
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New Fridge Solution? Or Just Clever Marketing?

Hey folks,

Came across this campaign on indiegogo (I have no affiliation)... just interested since I've recently spent a boat unit changing my fridge compressor and evap only to find that I need to rip it all out again and fix the insulation! Grumble grumble...

This looks very interesting... I'm just intrigued at how small it looks, especially since they say it is compressor cooled...

https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/a...ezer-warmer--2

Discuss?
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Old 12-06-2014, 02:38   #2
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Re: New Fridge Solution? Or Just clever marketing?

From the specs: Power: 60 W / 1 A WTF? Is it a 60V compressor? And do you really think that a 60W compressor can possibly "rapidly cool the unit to -7F"?

Those solar panels look as though they would be a total of 20W at best, so you're not going to be running it constantly just on solar.

And you have to wonder about how well insulated it is. The walls look pretty thin and the joints look VERY flimsy when you zoom in on the photos.

I think I'll pass on that one.
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Old 12-06-2014, 09:05   #3
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Re: New Fridge Solution? Or Just Clever Marketing?

I can't disagree... it's one of these too good to be true things perhaps.

Meanwhile I'm planning running some heavier gauge wiring to my new danfoss setup to see if it'll make the compressor happier!
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Old 12-06-2014, 09:22   #4
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Re: New Fridge Solution? Or Just Clever Marketing?

It's obviously a Peltier-effect solid-state cooler, and the limitations of these are well-known.

They are notoriously inefficient and -- in most practicable applications -- can only create a temperature differential of 35 degrees C or so between the inside and outside of the box.

Note that the page touts the ability to charge via the solar panel during the day and run on the battery at night, but nowhere does it claim that the solar panel can keep up with the load... hence the need for the external charging input connectors.

Marketing? Yes. Clever? Not so much... only when targeting those who are naive about the Laws of Physics.

EDIT: Just noticed well down the page that it claims to be compressor based. Hmm.

The cooling module appears to be only about 3" thick. Anyone know of a compressor that compact?
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Old 12-06-2014, 16:40   #5
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Re: New Fridge Solution? Or Just Clever Marketing?

I feel sure it's a money raising scam.

How do you fold a compressor driven fridge into 5" thick? After 3 years in development they are still testing prototype 2? Yet they go into production next month. The project timeline doesn't make sense.

Apart from StuM's observation about Power: 60W / 1A here is a gem from one of the "comments" on their website - bolding is mine.
The Anywhere Fridge does not even need to be plugged in it just needs to be in the sun, but if you do want to plug it in it doesn’t use all the voltage. The Anywhere Fridge only uses 115 volts; therefore, the answer is yes you will be able to use it in Asia and in that matter anywhere. Please see the below specs and thank you for your question and interest in our product.
(Input voltage: 115V AC / 12/24 V DC / 60Hz).

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Old 12-06-2014, 16:49   #6
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Re: New Fridge Solution? Or Just Clever Marketing?

scam.
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Old 12-06-2014, 17:35   #7
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Re: New Fridge Solution? Or Just Clever Marketing?

Peltier units can freeze things ... sometimes.

A few years back mine froze ... rock solid, a quart of milk ... into a literal brick.

Peltiers ... all peltiers can freeze and mine regularly freezes any water vapor into ice, which I often have to break off.

So far nothing seems to be a lie and it appears to be a peltier cooler.

Now ... read carefully ... "compressor based", cooling, nothing in the ad indicates a refrigerant, so there's really nothing to "compress".

"Compressor based", cooling could mean so much ... or so little. I might mean the compression of air when the fan(on the peltier), is blowing(compressing) air.


Did I say, I have been very, very satisfied with my Coleman peltier cooler for, I think 5 ... maybe 6 years now ... cold(not freezing) pop on the hottest of days, keeps food cold and fresh ... but ...no ice-cream bars or popsicles.
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Old 12-06-2014, 17:37   #8
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Oh ... that milk ...

it froze in June ... Not March,or April or November ... June!
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Old 13-06-2014, 09:39   #9
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Re: New Fridge Solution? Or Just Clever Marketing?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SURV69 View Post
Peltier units can freeze things ... sometimes.

A few years back mine froze ... rock solid, a quart of milk ... into a literal brick.

Peltiers ... all peltiers can freeze and mine regularly freezes any water vapor into ice, which I often have to break off.

So far nothing seems to be a lie and it appears to be a peltier cooler.

Now ... read carefully ... "compressor based", cooling, nothing in the ad indicates a refrigerant, so there's really nothing to "compress".

"Compressor based", cooling could mean so much ... or so little. I might mean the compression of air when the fan(on the peltier), is blowing(compressing) air.


Did I say, I have been very, very satisfied with my Coleman peltier cooler for, I think 5 ... maybe 6 years now ... cold(not freezing) pop on the hottest of days, keeps food cold and fresh ... but ...no ice-cream bars or popsicles.
Nobody ever said Peltier-effect coolers couldn't freeze things... just that they normally (with a simple single-stage device) can't produce a temperature differential of more than about 35 degrees C between the inside and outside.

In other words, you can't expect a Peltier device to freeze something on a 95-degree F day.

More importantly, they are not nearly as efficient as a good compressor.
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Old 13-06-2014, 15:31   #10
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Re: New Fridge Solution? Or Just Clever Marketing?

Please don't take my "bragging", about my frozen milk as some sort of endorsement of a peltier unit(or this thing), as a "viable" freezer.

If you read older posts by me here or elsewhere, I ran the cooler predominately at night or early morning(cool periods), and NEVER ran it during the hot times of the day(when the cooling capability would actually be warming the coolness resulted from the nightime cooling). I actually had the cooler on a timer for this purpose. I took advantage of the peltier at ONLY the most efficient times.

In a round-a-bout way, I think the ad is implying that "compressor based" cooling can freeze things, leaving a reader to assume that since this unit "freezes", and is "compressor based", that it must be much more than a peltier cooler.

Nowhere in the ad does it say it's a peltier, and nowhere in the does it say it isn't a peltier.

All the earmarks of being a peltier unit are there ... very little mechanical movement, the 12 volt requirement and the capability of warming things at a whim.

Virtually all the ad information appears to be nothing more that a parsing of words or a lack of acknowledgement of what the thing really is.
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Old 14-06-2014, 14:39   #11
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Re: New Fridge Solution? Or Just Clever Marketing?

It's a scam.

If it were real, the outside wall would be white, not any color you want, to reduce heating from the sun.

If it were real, the project industrial timeline would be spread over years, not months.

Alain
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Old 19-07-2014, 09:04   #12
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Re: New Fridge Solution? Or Just Clever Marketing?

I'd like to redirect this thread to my observations on my peltier cooler ... if I may.

I have a Coleman peltier cooler that I've used for about 5 years and I've been very satisfied with it.

The unit is almost always about 30+ degrees below ambient. So even on hot days, a drink feels cold.

With run-time manipulation(only running the unit in cold night and morning temps), the unit would reach 30+ degrres below ambient "night-time or morning temps, which could effectively make the temps 35-40 degrees below the hot time of day temperatures.

This year, I ran an experiment and found that the cooler was losing about 2 degrees an hour ... when not running, and ... regardless of the outside temperatures(70-90 degrees).

So, I added 1" foam inside the cooler ... and voila ...now the cooler was reaching 45-50 degrees below ambient. On an 88 degree day, the cooler temperature was reaching 28 degrees ... that's good.

The idea struck me that the insulation was the key to greatly improving the efficiency ... duh.

A couple days ago, I cleaned out my cooler, allowed the temps in the cooler to reach upper 60's and put my foods back in. Within about an hour, I was reading 35 degrees and about another 1/2 hour later ... on a 78 degree day ... I was at 31 degrees.

Last night was cold(mid-upper 60's) and I repeated my unit-off experiment. I expected the cooler, with it's added insulation, to hold almost all the cold.

No way! The cooler, with all that added insulation, still lost cold at the same exact rate as before the insulation ... about 2 degrees per hour.

From 11pm to 9am this morning(10 hours), the temperature went from 28 degrees to 47 degrees. I turned the unit back on at a little after 9 til now(10:45)... about 1-1/2 hours, the temperature is now 36 degrees.(69 degrees ambient). I expect that as all the foodstuff cool, the temperature will reach below 30 degrees(maybe lower), even as outside temperatures rise.

ANYWAY .... through all this, it looks to me that the actual peltier module is my source of cooling loss. I wonder if the peltier is actually transferring cold to hot(to make electricity), and causing this 2 degree per hour loss, especially so, since the amount of insulation has had no effect on this loss(while the unit is off), but has substantially increased the cooling(while the unit is on).

I wonder what might happen if I find a way to isolate(insulate), the cold side of the peltier from the foodstuff, when the unit is turned off?

Any ideas?

I would like to imagine a peltier cooler running 4 amps+ to be able to run ... maybe a total of 6-12 hours a day(mostly at night), to keep foodstuff reasonably cold during the heat of the day ... while not running.
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Old 19-07-2014, 09:31   #13
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Re: New Fridge Solution? Or Just Clever Marketing?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SURV69 View Post
I have a Coleman peltier cooler that I've used for about 5 years and I've been very satisfied with it.

The unit is almost always about 30+ degrees below ambient. So even on hot days, a drink feels cold.
I'd love to see pics of what you did. I have one of the -30 ambient machines as well.

Of course -30f here takes the inside to a mild like 70* - LOL.. Nah, it's better than that but it's freaking hot here - LOL.

I mount mine on it's back throw in a couple of pre-frozen quart ziplocs and pile the food on top. Separate cooler for drinks and ice.
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Old 19-07-2014, 14:45   #14
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Re: New Fridge Solution? Or Just Clever Marketing?

I'll get some pictures, but til then imagine....

1" of the construction foam ... bottom, three sides and around the peltier unit.

A 1" piece of foam with the center missing to split the cooler in half, with the missing center allowing the cold to enter into the end farthest from the peltier, then some flimsy 1/2" filter-type foam, in two pieces on top.

When I open the cooler to get a cold drink or milk, I remove the top foam from nearest the peltier, remove the drink, replace the foam, pour what I want, then place the bottle back in... re-replacing the top foam.

Same with if I want lunch meat or cheese(in the second section).

The first section is the one that gets as low as 28 degrees. The second section gets almost as cold(can't tell much difference), and I don't want the cheese, lunch meat and puddings to get too cold.

Now that I can get the cooler cold, like I want, if I can only figure a way to keep it from losing the cold so fast.
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Old 19-07-2014, 17:10   #15
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Re: New Fridge Solution? Or Just Clever Marketing?

Sounds like you have it "top loading" which is exactly what I plan to do. I've sound it keeps the luncheon meats, mayonnaise etc "cool" - Not near cool enough for drinks.

This may be a simple improvement for me.

Did you glue the side pieces in or just "snug" fit them?
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