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Old 10-07-2016, 15:37   #91
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Re: Nav Station Design Ideas

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Originally Posted by El Pinguino View Post
I like discreet displays with large numbers..... don't have to change to my reading glasses or take my gloves off to know what is going on.....

... and please don't say multifocals.....
This is an excellent point. A typical smart phone has 3 or 4 buttons and does 500 things!

I prefer data on readable discreet displays where I need the data... cockpit dash for speed and wind data... and of course heading and course info.

I have had the C 80 and I still have trouble drilling through menus to find things.
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Old 10-07-2016, 15:54   #92
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Re: Nav Station Design Ideas

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Your nav station would be just right for me I like the idea of a separate chart table for concentrated chart work, not in front of the wheel.

My boat could be ordered with one of the cabins set up as a dedicated office, with a folding down bunk so you could also use it for sleeping.

Sounds like a good idea, but that cabin does not have any view to the outside, and the only natural light/ventilation comes from a hatch. I would not be able to work there for whole days at a time; I would go crazy.

So on my next boat, instead of a dedicated office, the master cabin will have a desk in it, so I can work there. I DO need space to work alone and out of the salon (or pilothouse) -- so that I can concentrate on my work while my crew do other things.
My master cabin desk is exactly as you describe, and it has two large portholes at seated level for a good view outside and to provide natural light.

The designer put in a full height shelved closet behind the desk seat that is sized in depth to accommodate cased binders and also forms the hallway dogleg to my cabin from the pilothouse.

Access door from my desk and another offset door in the hallway gives me great access to spares and maintenance materials from the hallway.

The chart table and pilothouse seating with table is great for business meetings or doing formalities , but now only used for reviewing the detailed harbour charts, not covered in the ECS system.
All my paper charts do get "prepared" before going to sea with highlighted dangers and parallel indexes, but those are transferred to the ECS at the same time, so I have them on standby, but rarely pull them out on passage.
The detailed harbour charts I prepare approaches and anchor index, then photocopy key section to keep at helm to supplement the ECS.
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Old 10-07-2016, 16:26   #93
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Wink Re: Nav Station Design Ideas

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Originally Posted by Sandero View Post
This is an excellent point. A typical smart phone has 3 or 4 buttons and does 500 things!

I prefer data on readable discreet displays where I need the data... cockpit dash for speed and wind data... and of course heading and course info.

I have had the C 80 and I still have trouble drilling through menus to find things.
Yep, upstairs I have a rack of Raymarines readable from the helm - wind,depth, speed and a 'multi' which can give me anything and almost everything.
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Old 10-07-2016, 19:54   #94
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Re: Nav Station Design Ideas

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I have had the C 80 and I still have trouble drilling through menus to find things.
Ir is truly unfortunate that some manufacturers do not seem to understand that how skippers use their darned products DOES matter.

It's like offices who have receptionists or answering services that don't work, 'cuz the idiots who pay for those "services" never even try them out before they purchase them.

My friend had a Garmin about 15 years ago. It was so impossible to use that I gave up completely on them. I finally tried a newer one, and it was so intuitive that I bought it.

Unless it's on your boat already, for goodness sake, try it out first and see if it works for you.

If not, build up your own "manual" and make it work for you.
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Old 11-07-2016, 00:20   #95
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Re: Nav Station Design Ideas

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Originally Posted by Pelagic View Post
My master cabin desk is exactly as you describe, and it has two large portholes at seated level for a good view outside and to provide natural light.

The designer put in a full height shelved closet behind the desk seat that is sized in depth to accommodate cased binders and also forms the hallway dogleg to my cabin from the pilothouse.

Access door from my desk and another offset door in the hallway gives me great access to spares and maintenance materials from the hallway.

The chart table and pilothouse seating with table is great for business meetings or doing formalities , but now only used for reviewing the detailed harbour charts, not covered in the ECS system.
All my paper charts do get "prepared" before going to sea with highlighted dangers and parallel indexes, but those are transferred to the ECS at the same time, so I have them on standby, but rarely pull them out on passage.
The detailed harbour charts I prepare approaches and anchor index, then photocopy key section to keep at helm to supplement the ECS.
That sounds perfect! Pics?
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Old 13-07-2016, 19:14   #96
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Re: Nav Station Design Ideas

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Originally Posted by Dockhead View Post
That sounds perfect! Pics?
Probably easier to show you on my storage Plan View.

From outside cockpit I go down 4 steps into Pilothouse, 180 turn and 4 steps down to master hallway #44

#42 is file closet with 2 doors (one in office, one in hallway)
#43 is hanging locker
The dogleg part of 42 is a library seen from the inside, but it provides great privacy for those in the master cabin.

Ergonomically this works great as everything is at hand and easy to find
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Old 14-07-2016, 00:12   #97
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Re: Nav Station Design Ideas

Back to Nav Station design
I am just finalizing my own upgrade and would appreciate advice on this other Thread.

MFD NavNet Touch2 TZTL15F or TZT14?
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Old 14-07-2016, 00:38   #98
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Re: Nav Station Design Ideas

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Originally Posted by Pelagic View Post
Probably easier to show you on my storage Plan View.

From outside cockpit I go down 4 steps into Pilothouse, 180 turn and 4 steps down to master hallway #44

#42 is file closet with 2 doors (one in office, one in hallway)
#43 is hanging locker
The dogleg part of 42 is a library seen from the inside, but it provides great privacy for those in the master cabin.

Ergonomically this works great as everything is at hand and easy to find
Very nice layout. The office space is perfect.

This is relevant to my new boat design as the dimensions are similar -- 60 - 65' and narrowish, quite like this.

Like many pilothouse boats, you have galley and dining opposite each other, and dining seating and salon lounging functions are separated. This is a less efficient use of space, but maybe nice to have separate places to sit. I would be interested to hear how this works in real life.

As to your helm station (getting back to the original topic) --

I will not have a wheel in my own pilothouse, since I rarely use the wheel anyway (I will have redundant and very powerful hydraulic autopilots). I suppose you could eliminate the helm station in your pilothouse and do everything from the chart table. I would be satisfied with that space I guess. Steer with a joystick if needed. I presume you have another wheel in the cockpit, correct?
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Old 14-07-2016, 02:13   #99
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Re: Nav Station Design Ideas

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Originally Posted by Dockhead View Post
.

Like many pilothouse boats, you have galley and dining opposite each other, and dining seating and salon lounging functions are separated. This is a less efficient use of space, but maybe nice to have separate places to sit. I would be interested to hear how this works in real life.
Some designs focus on one large area to sit, but in reality more than one social space to sit works better for ourselves and another couple, who want some quiet time outside their cabin

The dining salon is very comfortable for 4 and easily converts to another double bunk when table is lowered.

With a privacy curtain, when weather is rough on an offshore passage it becomes a favourite off watch berth.

The Pilothouse seating for 4 is perfect dining for 2 and is my favorite place to sleep if I'm expecting a night time weather change at anchor... Or want a security watch. It is where I have meetings at the dock.

The outside dinning is used most nights in the Tropics and for dock parties.

Personally I prefer 3 choices as opposed to one
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Old 14-07-2016, 02:22   #100
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Re: Nav Station Design Ideas

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Originally Posted by Dockhead View Post
As to your helm station (getting back to the original topic) --

I will not have a wheel in my own pilothouse, since I rarely use the wheel anyway (I will have redundant and very powerful hydraulic autopilots). I suppose you could eliminate the helm station in your pilothouse and do everything from the chart table. I would be satisfied with that space I guess. Steer with a joystick if needed. I presume you have another wheel in the cockpit, correct?
My steering system is a bit different but very robust as the Dutch tend to do.

Outside is mechanical chain and Cable on large wheel

Inside is manual hydraulic pump driven by that wheel and a solenoid switch to engage...so I need that wheel if my hydraulic pump(s) were to fail.

Like you, I am mostly on autopilot, but I like the fact that I can hand steer hydraulically from inside with a smaller wheel, if the 24v pumps were down

My rudder is quite a barn door
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Old 14-07-2016, 14:45   #101
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Re: Nav Station Design Ideas

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I think we are in the early days of wifi, Bluetooth and multi function displays.


When I first launched my boat in 1987 I installed a 10" B&W TV, that progressed to a 10" colour then through a number of flat screens to where I now have a 23.5" flat screen with inbuilt DVD player. I can plug it into my computer, crank up OpenCPN and it displays about a 1/3 sized chart which I can zoom in and out with any degree of detail. It's power consumption is about 30 watts or half way between the 10" B&W and 10" Colour.


I notice that the formerly described "chart plotter" is now being referred to as a "multi function display" and there are all sorts of apps for displaying engine instrumentation etc on it as well as charts. I suspect that the multi function display which my TV has become will also include the ability to receive and display all this stuff fairly soon in the future and If I wanted I could already do it on some mobile phones.


I suspect it will not be to long before all marine instrumentation comes with wifi connectivity rather than cable interconnections and I will be switching nav lights on and off with my mobile phone or on my TV with the remote from my bunk in the V berth.
Quick question to those with big monitors Are you running these off inverters?
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Old 14-07-2016, 15:00   #102
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Re: Nav Station Design Ideas

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Quick question to those with big monitors Are you running these off inverters?
Look for one with an EXTERNAL power supply.

Then buy a DC-DC power supply, maybe like this one:

https://www.amazon.com/DROK-Regulato...TTVATWBZHKRY4D

Or step up if you are 12v. There are many of these and check to be sure that the max output is more, with a margin, than the max draw of the monitor.


Then whack off the DC cord from the AC power supply which came with the monitor, and wire it up to the DROK. Wire up a power supply from your main panel (use a fuse and/or circuit breaker).

And Bob's your mother's brother.
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Old 14-07-2016, 15:38   #103
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Re: Nav Station Design Ideas

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Originally Posted by RaymondR View Post
.


I suspect it will not be to long before all marine instrumentation comes with wifi connectivity rather than cable interconnections and I will be switching nav lights on and off with my mobile phone or on my TV with the remote from my bunk in the V berth.
ALL my new electronics from the FURUNO Touch 2 to the Vesper AIS can now be Wi-Fi connected.

It is tempting to rely on that network connection, but my instincts tell me to Hardwire also.

Am I being too paranoid about that?
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Old 14-07-2016, 21:48   #104
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Re: Nav Station Design Ideas

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Originally Posted by Dockhead View Post
Look for one with an EXTERNAL power supply.

Then buy a DC-DC power supply, maybe like this one:

https://www.amazon.com/DROK-Regulato...TTVATWBZHKRY4D

Or step up if you are 12v. There are many of these and check to be sure that the max output is more, with a margin, than the max draw of the monitor.


Then whack off the DC cord from the AC power supply which came with the monitor, and wire it up to the DROK. Wire up a power supply from your main panel (use a fuse and/or circuit breaker).

And Bob's your mother's brother.
Thanks Dockhead! We have a DC monitor that came with the boat but it's quite old and has terrible vision. I'll look out for a suitable replacement that we can also use for entertainment.

I am following this thread because as you can see from the images an upgrade is needed. Along with all of the other tasks of sorting out an older boat, the nav area plus switchboard is now beckoning. The wiring is not as bad as it looks. I've checked it over carefully and fused everything. It's just a mighty mess. I'm going to place a board at the back that I can then mount it all on.

Our chart table is large and is a great workplace. I have some teak saved to make (hopefully) and elegant shelf on the bulkhead with space underneath for a HF we have and other items.

It will look much better one day
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