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Old 19-09-2015, 11:23   #61
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Re: Lightweight but strong backing material

"PVC contains harmful carcinogens, most notably VCM. Other chemicals such as dioxin and phthalates, both carcinogenic, may also be released into an indoor environment, endangering the people who work and live in buildings that use PVC. Dioxin is a super-toxic chemical released when plastic that contains chlorine is burned. Aside from cancer, Dioxin can also trigger nervous system disorders and birth defects. Phthalates are carcinogenic chemicals often used in plastics to make them flexible. While the fact that vinyl contains carcinogens should be reason enough to avoid it, PVC is increasingly dangerous when burned. Therefore, house and building fires involving PVC are dangerous not only for homeowners and workers, but for firefighters and rescue workers as well."
Is PVC Safe? The Vinyl Debate
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Old 19-09-2015, 13:13   #62
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Re: Lightweight but strong backing material

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"PVC contains harmful carcinogens, most notably VCM. Other chemicals such as dioxin and phthalates, both carcinogenic, may also be released into an indoor environment, endangering the people who work and live in buildings that use PVC. Dioxin is a super-toxic chemical released when plastic that contains chlorine is burned. Aside from cancer, Dioxin can also trigger nervous system disorders and birth defects. Phthalates are carcinogenic chemicals often used in plastics to make them flexible. While the fact that vinyl contains carcinogens should be reason enough to avoid it, PVC is increasingly dangerous when burned. Therefore, house and building fires involving PVC are dangerous not only for homeowners and workers, but for firefighters and rescue workers as well."
Is PVC Safe? The Vinyl Debate
That explains a lot. Now I know why I walk and talk funny after all those years of exposure to PVC.

Dagnabit.
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Old 19-09-2015, 14:55   #63
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Re: Lightweight but strong backing material

And why you make so many bum recommendations.
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Old 19-09-2015, 18:49   #64
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Re: Lightweight but strong backing material

I think what we will end up doing to keeping all the old teak in storage at my in-laws labeled with their positions - so if the new buyer wants to go back and replace it then so be it.

The boat is not a fixer-upper but she is definitely no spring chicken! She had a lot of differed maintenance.

The ceiling is white vinyl and done very classy but it has some stains in it and we are either going to take this opportunity to replace it or replace it or maybe just paint the fiberglass white so we can maintain access to the deck hardware bolts... which means that since we are in there, we might as well repaint the deck... and so on and so on and so on!
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Old 19-09-2015, 19:45   #65
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Re: Lightweight but strong backing material

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And why you make so many bum recommendations.
I know. Epoxy and fiberglass are very healthy products. I am sure PVC is much more toxic than his current vinyl ceiling. Oh yeah PVC is vinyl.

Whatever TN. Your name would be much better if you added a another word starting with a T to the end so your acronym was TNT. That sh*t's really unhealthy.
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Old 20-09-2015, 19:18   #66
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Re: Lightweight but strong backing material

I'm not worried about toxicity. We are all going to die. If I'm going to die from PVC that the damage is already done.

Just as long as I don't grow breasts.
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Old 20-09-2015, 19:47   #67
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Re: Lightweight but strong backing material

Many, perhaps most of us are able to tolerate the toxic fumes that continue to outgas from PVC--it smells like vinyl. It seems to be everywhere. Most automobile and most small, cheap boats have largely vinyl lined interiors. But a great number of people are very sensitive to PVC and even the glues used to make plywood.
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Old 20-09-2015, 19:54   #68
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Re: Lightweight but strong backing material

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Many, perhaps most of us are able to tolerate the toxic fumes that continue to outgas from PVC--it smells like vinyl. It seems to be everywhere. Most automobile and most small, cheap boats have largely vinyl lined interiors. But a great number of people are very sensitive to PVC and even the glues used to make plywood.
New PVC certainly has that distinct smell.

I am allergic to the smell of mold and sharp chemicals myself... it triggers my asthma.

My wife and I were talking about this today... do we use the existing headliner as a template? It's very nice and high end even for today, just old. Maybe we do something completely different. Not sure what is available today that is like vinyl with the same lifespan.
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Old 20-09-2015, 20:17   #69
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Re: Lightweight but strong backing material

Iron Bark, Blue Gum or She Oak will do the job quiet nicely and the rest of the boat will rot away around it.
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Old 20-09-2015, 20:19   #70
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Re: Lightweight but strong backing material

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Just as long as I don't grow breasts.
Because you would be too busy playing with them to finish the boat?

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Old 20-09-2015, 20:43   #71
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Re: Lightweight but strong backing material

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Because you would be too busy playing with them to finish the boat?

Mark
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Iron Bark, Blue Gum or She Oak will do the job quiet nicely and the rest of the boat will rot away around it.
I'm sure that would be awesome and very upscale but I am lacking the the wood working skill regard. I could do it but it would clearly look mickey-moused! As such we are looking for something like the vinyl we currently have - or just renew the vinyl. They have new versions that don't off-gas.
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Old 21-09-2015, 09:14   #72
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Re: Lightweight but strong backing material

I had to cut some new headliners due to adding a wire run on the overhead. I used the old headliners as a pattern. If you pad the vinyl (or whatever "fabric" underneath) you have to add a tiny bit for the radius. It was a fairly easy job but easy to screw up the corners if you cut them too close. I used contact cement, which is pretty toxic in its own right. I sprayed it in an open garage or outside. You need to stretch the fabric fairly tight. I used velcro to put it up. Works great.
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Old 25-09-2015, 09:12   #73
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Re: Lightweight but strong backing material

It turns out the rot was not as extensive as I first thought.

After getting off the porthole and getting the teak off I discovered that Cabo Rico had used several pieces of plywood next to each other (separated by a thin bead of what I assume is 5200) rather than using one big piece. It appears that they also had treated the ply to an epoxy coating so that seemed to help. I think the water got in where the screws holding the port to the hull penetrated the ply.

The result is that the rot stopped where the ply stopped.

This is a lesson for when I put the new backing on- use several pieces rather than one big piece, use epoxy, and separate by a very small bead of 3M 4200 or 3M 4000. Also, fill the screw/bolt holes with sealant.

However, we are still committed to removing the rest of the teak... some of the teak needs to be replaced anyhow and I'd like to make sure its all done very uniformly and done correctly.

But... unless we have signs of rot in the rest of the holes we do not plan on replacing teh teak with some other brighter material.
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Old 25-09-2015, 13:16   #74
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Re: Lightweight but strong backing material

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...This is a lesson for when I put the new backing on- use several pieces rather than one big piece, use epoxy, and separate by a very small bead of 3M 4200 or 3M 4000...
Uh...no, it is a lesson to properly bed all fasteners. And to renew that bedding at the first sign of failure. The plywood core around the port is better as 1-piece.
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Old 25-09-2015, 15:03   #75
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Re: Lightweight but strong backing material

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Uh...no, it is a lesson to properly bed all fasteners. And to renew that bedding at the first sign of failure. The plywood core around the port is better as 1-piece.

Sorry, I don't think I described it correctly. Across the the side of the cabin top (which covers three ports) they used 3 pieces of ply - one for each port. They did not use multiple pieces around one port.

The screws were not what ended up leaking, it was the area of the cutout between cutout and the port. I assume it was made a little larger to take into account the differences in expansion due to heating and cooling.

I guess after so many years 5200 does eventually leak!

FYI - I have found that the Debond corp Marine Formula works pretty well to goo up the old 5200.
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