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Old 25-07-2007, 12:06   #16
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"LEDs have an abysmally high failure rate in my experience.A flashlight I bought in november crapped out by march."
I'll bet you paid under $10 for it and it said "MADE IN CHINA".
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Old 25-07-2007, 13:37   #17
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And how many years ago was that Brent?
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Old 25-07-2007, 15:22   #18
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LED

Hi,

I looked this up on wickipedia, and it seems that there are many ways to make an LED bulb, and so it may be that the cheaper led products like some of the flashlights on sale are cashing in on the hgh efficency of the latest technology using cheaper old-school LEDs.

It seems that certain kinds of white LEDs that use a near infrared light to produce a white LED can have higher failure rates, but the leatest technology (that I hope you would get from a good dealer of LED bulbs) would live up to the hype of long life cycles.

A friend used a LED headlamp for biking that was by no means cheap, but the damn thing was like the surface of the sun. So bright that people at an out door event yelled for him to turn it off because it was like a floodlight. This from a tiny little thing that ran off a few aa batteries.

I've seen the small circular lights that westmarine sells for boat applications, and I have to admit, they look pretty weak, and I cant see them filling a boat with light. They cant be the same ones in his headlamp. Roughly the same amount of leds but not even close to the power. Circumstantial evidence I know.

Most big advances dont seem to have been around that long, and you know they are throwing big money at this on the R&D end.


Cheers,

B

P.S. we havet given up on our schooner, just looking for more things to buy at the moment
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Old 26-07-2007, 00:42   #19
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The LED discussion was another topic that lots on info is burried in the archives. A Search will bring up a lot of info. As Brian has said, there are many many ways to make the light work. Mostly the real tricks are done in the regulators. In expensive lights, the regulators are complex voltage pulsing devices.
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Old 26-07-2007, 01:58   #20
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forget leds go cold cathode flourescent, nearly as good effieciency as led but way more light in my opinion
sean
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Old 26-07-2007, 02:12   #21
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I am having a mix.

LED's for low level lighting, and headboard mounted reading lights in bunks. Low current draw, where lights are going to be on for long periods. LED nav lights too.

Flourescent lights for cabin lighting - relatively short duration lighting.

CCF for galley and saloon lighting - bright light but little current draw. I would use CCf in more areas but the slow warm-up and their realtive bulky size goes against them in some applications.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Wheeler
there are many many ways to make the light work.
Isn't the proverb "Many hands make light work"?
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Old 26-07-2007, 02:38   #22
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That's a Chinese proverb. I was using another version ;-) :-)
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Old 02-08-2007, 17:28   #23
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LEDs

You couldn't ask for better voltage regulation than a dry cell .
Brent

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Wheeler
The LED discussion was another topic that lots on info is burried in the archives. A Search will bring up a lot of info. As Brian has said, there are many many ways to make the light work. Mostly the real tricks are done in the regulators. In expensive lights, the regulators are complex voltage pulsing devices.
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Old 02-08-2007, 17:31   #24
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KISS. Keep it simple. The mere complexity of LED regulators make them a poor choice if you want to keep a boat simple. Complexity = vulnerability.
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Old 02-08-2007, 18:01   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Louis Riel
You couldn't ask for better voltage regulation than a dry cell .
Brent
Come on, you know that isn't correct. True, you won't get transients, and reverse polarity, but the typical alkaline dry cell will range from about 1.6V fresh out of the box, down to 1.0 or 0.9V where you might consider then at "end of life".

If you use a resistor for regulation you will be throwing away a lot of power and/or operating the LED over a very wide current range, which is probably why the cheap lamps burn out more often. This is true for two cells, eight cells, or any number. Even a constant-current regulator will waste a fair bit of power, but at least it keeps the LED current well-controlled, and is appropriate in some applications (a resistor can be appropriate as well, it depends on the application). The fancy switching regulators do have their advantages, and a well-designed one is relatively bullet-proof.
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Old 02-08-2007, 18:24   #26
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I have been using Taylormade cold cathode flourescents for several years now. They take only a minute or less to reach full illumination, and are vastly superior to all other fluorescents I have purchased over the last thirty or so years.

I also replaced my bunk reading lights with Dr. LED bayonet base bulbs and am very pleased with their light output in the relatively narrow beam width they give out. Far better than incandescents, and at a much lower current consumption.

As a result of these successes, I now have all Dr. LED bulbs for my Aquasignal nav lights, AND just purchased a couple LED dome lights from them to replace some incandescent fixtures aboard WILDERNESS, a Searunner 40 tri.

As I understand the nav light issue, it is a matter of lumens, a measure of light output, that the laws address, not so much brands. The LEDs on the market must put out enough light to reach three miles for white light and somewhat less for red and green. Also, Dr. LED reminds us that one can't use white LEDs behind colored lenses. You must use red LEDs for red lamps, Green for green lenses, and of course, white.

I have purchased my Taylormades CCFs from Port Supply, the commercial side of WEST Marine, and my Dr. LEDs were ordered from San Diego Marine Exchange.

On a side note, I am awaiting my high intensity discharge deck lights from Pyramid Marine. They produce 2 1/2 times the light output of conventional deck lights of 55 watts for only 21 watts of power consumption. But, they are pricey.
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Old 02-08-2007, 18:26   #27
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A dry cell provides zero regulation. A simple integral regulator chip is just as reliable as the LED it is connected to, and by ensuring regulated power it puts the LED into the "properly designed" operating range, which could be a tenfold increase in operating life.

the LED only has a 100,000 hour life expectancy, but the regulator has one of 1,000 years, when properly selected and fit to the use.

Roy-
"As I understand the nav light issue, it is a matter of lumens, a measure of light output, that the laws address, not so much brands." Lumens is the least of it. A nav light (the complete light, not just the bulb) must put out x lumens at a spectral range of y frequency (color) AND it must put it out across z degrees of beamspread. Sometimes both horizontal and vertical.

So the problem is, a tungsten bulb is pretty much x lumens in a 360-degree sphere of light, blocked only by the base. An LED is very different. It has a full 180-degree blind spot (from its base) so it puts out light in a hemisphere, not a sphere. Except, the light is so weak that it is focused by the plastic lens, and the light output is usually measured into a 10-by-10 degree cone. Or a 20-by-20 cone for a "wide" LED. Outside of that cone, the brightness plummets. So making an LED replace a tungsten bulb, you either need a very special LED with a wide bright light ($$ and only recently made) or you need a cluster of LEDs, each carefully mounted and overlapping so that 10-degree range builds up to 120 degrees or more.

Then, in order to replace the tungsten bulb, you still need to make sure the LED replacement will be properly oriented IN THE NAV LAMP so those orientations match.

Not impossible--but only recently possible at any reasonable cost. And that's ignoring the spectral (color) issues.

And the LEDs that meet these requirements? Are often pricey enough that you want to add regulator and voltage control IC's, to make sure they work reliably. Then there are more twists a clever maker can put in, for instance, blinking an LED 60x per second will make it look like a solid light--but might use half the power of a solidly lit light.

Not quite as simple as the $10 lights you see in the auto shops, that are expected to burn out in a year or two anyway.<G>
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Old 02-08-2007, 18:28   #28
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check out alpen glow lights. I have heard nothing but good things
Alpen glow lights link: Home
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Old 02-08-2007, 19:40   #29
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I have and have had Alpenglow lights in my current and previous boats.
They're wonderful. Great even light with no glare and NO shadows in the light distribution, i.e. it washes surfaces with light and you don't get any dim or bright spots.

Steve B.
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Old 02-08-2007, 19:42   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JusDreaming
check out alpen glow lights. I have heard nothing but good things
Alpen glow lights link: Home
The link didn't work for me
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