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Old 27-11-2010, 13:57   #31
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Originally Posted by SaltyMonkey View Post
Junk rig has big chafe issues, heave to issues, reefing (gears) issues, placement of mast forward more refit issues, and the myth that you can make your own sails out of old used diapers.
I hear you, sir. And thanks for all above comments so far. I have Annie Hill's book and most all the others. I've actually been interested in the Chinese set up since Hasler started writing about it when the OSTAR started. I put together a quicky junk rig on an old p.o.s. in about 1980, with the then-wife sewing the sails out of heavy cotton. It sailed very poorly but there were other reasons for that!

I then built a Wharram Hinemoa. Talk about a boat that wouldn't go to weather! I gave up trying to get her to tack and jibed around every time, or dropped the sails and rowed in close quarters. If the rig will tack, I'll be happy. A low standard to be sure, eh?

The refit issue is the main thing. If I had a sound boat, I'd be stepping the mast and taking off soon. But I do not trust the new cabin at all. Moving the mast way forward lessens that problem and allows the dink on deck. A very good thing. Brent's point about the disturbed air on one side of the sail is quite valid I'm sure. I'd never considered it but it seems obvious now. Another compromise.

I think for me, not "bending the boat" as my favorite skipper used to say is key. Nor do I want to redo the whole deck. It would take too long to do it right. Time is starting to matter.
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Old 27-11-2010, 14:13   #32
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I dunno...but i get kinda tired of hearing the Annie Hall and Hasler gurgitations. Reminds me of china in the 60s - everyone holding up a red book and screaming "MAO MAO!"

gave up on junkies and gaffers and luggers. Think also that top head boom is gonna clunk on my monkey head.
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Old 27-11-2010, 14:47   #33
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Horse's for course's.... different strokes for different folks...
Just coz summat aint good for you does not mean it will not work for someone else... as the vid's I posted demonstrate... they'll take you where you want to go... maybe not as fast or as efficiently... but they get you there.
The Hinemoa was a heavy boat which had difficulty building up the speed cats need to get past the 'irons' stage without leaving the jib to 'back'...
Now the Tiki 21 was a whole different game... I never had a problem tacking... as a matter of fact I used to blow folks minds in Poole Harbour when I used to 3 point turn her in amongst the moorings.... turn head to wind let the jib fly which would nearly stop her dead... centre the main, reverse rudder... and she'd sail backwards till the wind filled the main, sheet in the jib and away... yes I know... thats not a tack... but she did tack well to boot... agile as hell and fast....
Each rig has its merits and faults.... just coz you don't like it does not mean its crap....
I don't like in-mast furling... many do.... its all down to trust... I trust 'slab'..
I love the Gaff Wing main... but its a pain to reef...
So... Junk Rig...??
Why not.. try it... don't like it..??.... Move on..

PS; I've never read anyone's books/opinions on anything... I buy... I try... for the above reason... personal prejudice is never honest
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Old 27-11-2010, 14:57   #34
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You must havea lotta monkey money to try so many boats. hence we poor little monkeys wanna justa limit our wall -yit$

cat ketches and herringbone rigs. now that is a boat!
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Old 27-11-2010, 15:18   #35
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Horse's for course's.... different strokes for different folks...
Just coz summat aint good for you does not mean it will not work for someone else... as the vid's I posted demonstrate... they'll take you where you want to go... maybe not as fast or as efficiently... but they get you there.
The Hinemoa was a heavy boat which had difficulty building up the speed cats need to get past the 'irons' stage without leaving the jib to 'back'...
Now the Tiki 21 was a whole different game... I never had a problem tacking... as a matter of fact I used to blow folks minds in Poole Harbour when I used to 3 point turn her in amongst the moorings.... turn head to wind let the jib fly which would nearly stop her dead... centre the main, reverse rudder... and she'd sail backwards till the wind filled the main, sheet in the jib and away... yes I know... thats not a tack... but she did tack well to boot... agile as hell and fast....
Each rig has its merits and faults.... just coz you don't like it does not mean its crap....
I don't like in-mast furling... many do.... its all down to trust... I trust 'slab'..
I love the Gaff Wing main... but its a pain to reef...
So... Junk Rig...??
Why not.. try it... don't like it..??.... Move on..

PS; I've never read anyone's books/opinions on anything... I buy... I try... for the above reason... personal prejudice is never honest

AMEN!

I looked for the videos and did not find them could you post a link please . saw the snap sits sweet boat!

Barb
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Old 27-11-2010, 15:36   #36
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AMEN!

I looked for the videos and did not find them could you post a link please . saw the snap sits sweet boat!

Barb
Video's were Youtube for the Corribee Junk in earlier post... sadly none of my Tiki... I'll check for others tho'... you'll see why I designed and made my own sprayhood...lol



Also had one of these.. the Tiki 26..
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Old 27-11-2010, 15:51   #37
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first video is disabled there boatboy
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Old 27-11-2010, 15:54   #38
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sweet that 26. i would love that thing!
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Old 27-11-2010, 16:02   #39
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first video is disabled there boatboy
Watch it on YouTube.... its woth it
On the my 26 'Tiki Motu' I was overtaking commercial vessels in the shipping lanes in the English Channel in a SW7... we were averaging 17kts with full sail...
Bit wet tho'... sailing gear was wet suit and wind cheater..
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Old 27-11-2010, 16:15   #40
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its like a modified hobicat.

fastest I was on was a Condor 40 tri across the Chesapeake @ 18 knots. I was hooked. Once you go that fast it pollutes all your boat buying decision$. =(

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How far did you go on your 21 or 26?
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Old 27-11-2010, 16:17   #41
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awesome video #1
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Old 27-11-2010, 16:26   #42
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Just as far as France and back (160miles round trip) and along the Sth Coast UK... but someone took a 21 around the world... he set of from the UK to join his GF in NZ... crossed the Atlantic and Pacific... stayed there 18mths then sailed on back to the UK.... that was about 19yrs ago.
This year he entered the Jesters Challange with the same boat and I believe he finished 2nd... not bad for a boat tied together with 12 bits of string...
THE RORY McDOUGAL STORY
A year later another epic voyage started, on August 6th 1991. Rory McDougal set sail and headed south from Lands End – England. Steve Turner introduced me to Rory in 1990, when he was building his famous Tiki 21 COOKING FAT. She is an interesting boat, basically a GRP boat, but in addition traditional bulkheads were fitted in (not necessary on the GRP design) and she had a deck and cabin style like the Tiki 36. Originally Rory wanted to go around the world in a 18 foot beach cat eg a Tornado….however the Tiki was a good choice. COOKIE did well in bad weather, could sail very fast (eg heart breaking surf through the Strait of Gibraltar), could stand some payload (remember the deck chairs & windsurfer on her foredeck in the Tasman Sea @ F8?). As many others he encountered very bad weather after leaving the Canary islands:’…Canaries harbours were bashed by F11 winds, accelerated between the steep mountainous islands. COOKIE rode out the storm very happily to a1 sq.m. sea anchor and 250 feet of nylon warp set over the sterns. She tended herself, allowing us to stay dry below and to rest. In fact the situation felt so settled and relaxed….’ It took him 29 days to cross the Atlantic (2800nm), ‘Arriving in the Caribbean was thrilling. I was especially proud to enter on my own brave little craft. No engine and no electrics. Just a sextant, 10 –year-old reduction tables and a compass.’ Following Rorys statement you can say that the size of the cat was only secondary – big achievement. He then sailed on to Panama. The passage through the canal is difficutlt for an engineless boat. First Rory tried to be picked up Piggy-back on a freighter, but this was not allowed by the Canal administration. Finally COOKIE was towed alongside a Swan 42. From here he sailed single handed. Rory was using a self steering system named ‘Harry’ which became a legend as well ’..For some wood, glue, bolts and string, I thought that Harry was a fantastic helmsman. He could cope with any strength or direction of wind blown at him…’(**) He took a rather unusual route across the South Pacific, because he did not want to spend the required cash at the Galapagos islands nor to pay a bond in Tahiti, which is required for visiting yachts. Rory was in a hurry to meet his girlfriend in New Zealand and consequently sailed quite long stretches having stops only at Easter Island, Mangareva and Rarotonga onto New Zealand. The final approach became difficult and became an endurance test: ‘ A succession of low pressures bombarded us, sweeping up from the southern ocean, creating rapid weather changes and plenty on work on deck. The weather gods wanted the last word with tree gales in succession, forcing me to lie-a-hull for 7 days. It was August, the depth of the southern winter, and I had no gloves or sea boots to defend my tropical limbs. When cooking fuel ran out I survived for nine days on rice and pasta, softened all day in cold water. It meant even more energy lost for batteling on, both physically and mentally. However at one’s lowest point there is only one way to go – up, and forewards.’ Other boots were heavily damaged in the same storms, Rory’s resume: ‘ Undoutable I owe my life to the fact that COOKIE is a deep-displacement, low freeboard catamaran built for strength and not lightweight speed.’ He dropped anchor there for almost 4 years. After concluding that this was long enough he started again in May 1996. Across the Tasman Sea, up the Queensland coast of Australia, Darwin, Bali, Singapore, Malacca Strait, Sri Lanka, Aden, Red Sea, Suez Canal (first time use of an engine onboard Cookie), Mediterranean, Gibraltar, ‘…Lisbon was quite an occasion as Cookie crossed her outward tracks of 6 years earlier. Well done Cookie! We have officially sailed around the world..Finally some favourable winds winged Cookie and crew in one hop up to the NE of Cape Finesterre and a perfect spot to head off across Biscay. I could almost smell the shores of England….Rory arrived just in time to join in directly to the PCA meeting in Milbrook and finally arrived home in Dartmouth August 23rd 1997.
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Old 27-11-2010, 16:43   #43
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thats awesome. i do love smaller boats, boatman....part of my dilemma. That 21 make my heart go pitta patta..what to do??

Corsair Marine Trailerable Trimarans - The worlds best trailerable trimaran yachts
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Old 27-11-2010, 16:52   #44
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thats awesome. i do love smaller boats, boatman....part of my dilemma. That 21 make my heart go pitta patta..what to do??

Corsair Marine Trailerable Trimarans - The worlds best trailerable trimaran yachts
The 26 with a centre pods the more viable option... or a larger version of my sprayhood.. more storage/tankage and a 4hp will push her at 6kts+...
She'll float in 18ins and sail at 10kts in 12kts apparent... a bit slower when loaded..
I'm a Catman at heart.. just not the Cats everyone on here has...
This one has the 'Pod'... still a bit overpriced...
For Sale. Wharram Tiki 26 - Almerimar, Spain - 1831067
Beware the 'Home Builds'.... tho some are superb
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Old 27-11-2010, 17:09   #45
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me confused though boatman...why go for a monny-hull Corribee 21? yu are a speed daemon too!
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