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Old 20-11-2015, 08:43   #16
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Re: Is a windvane possible with an arch and davits

If you mean can you run a wind vane with the davits and tender loaded on back along with the arches; the answer is maybe. Need to extent the vane well clear of the tender. It will look god awful but will work.
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Old 20-11-2015, 08:49   #17
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Re: Is a windvane possible with an arch and davits

Good information in this thread. Thanks for the education guys!
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Old 20-11-2015, 08:55   #18
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Re: Is a windvane possible with an arch and davits

I fitted a Hydrovane to my Bowman ketch six years ago, which works wonderfully well. it steered the boat effortlessly in F8 in the bay of biscay this summer. My mizzen boom extends beyond the stern, but the vane is easily lived out for a tack or gybe - wind vanes are not going to be used when short tacking anyway. It is also off centre, in order to keep my transom hung ladder in place. The only down side is that fitting / removing the auxiliary rudder is a pain in the ass in anything but very calm conditions, but the upside of this is that they are extremely strong. One of my reasons for choosing Hydrovane was that I never heard of one breaking.
Hydrovane were very helpful when I approached them first, supplying details with pictures of how vanes were fitted to boats similar and identical to mine and plenty of advice as to how to fit (I fitted it myself). You should call and put your question to them, I reckon they will give you a straight answer.
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Old 20-11-2015, 09:11   #19
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Re: Is a windvane possible with an arch and davits

TO: GILOW - Matt,

I would like to see a photo of your current or new stern setup when you can post a photo of that. I was recently looking at two canoe stern boats, each with relatively high freeboard at the sterns and wondered about this issue of canoe sterns with davits and arch and vane use.

Thanks for posting the link to the earlier thread, I took the time to read that and the photo there was useful. I think photos help.
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Old 20-11-2015, 09:19   #20
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Re: Is a windvane possible with an arch and davits

This is not one of the boats I mentioned earlier, but I found this photo quickly while on this thread.

Notice the stern (not a canoe) but here what I wonder about is the arch + davits + solar panels and how a wind vane would work with the solar panels on the arch etc.

Anyone reading this thread, if you have a boat with an arch with solar panels on it AND you have a wind vane on it that works well please post it.

If you have a boat with Arch + Davits + Solar + Wind Vane, please post that too.
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Old 20-11-2015, 09:27   #21
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Re: Is a windvane possible with an arch and davits

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Originally Posted by Meandercp View Post
If you don't mind having an auxiliary rudder, take a look at the Autohelm from Scanmar marine (selfsteer.com). You can separate the wind blade and put it on top of the arch.
I second this option. It has worked well for me, is less expensive than other vane gear and is very adaptable.
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Old 20-11-2015, 09:40   #22
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Re: Is a windvane possible with an arch and davits

We have both a Monitor vane and a solar panel/davit arch on the back of our 35' yacht. The arch was there first, so I carefully measured and ultimately set the Monitor about 1" lower than the optimum recommended in order to achieve 1/2" clearance on the wind-blade's tip; in hindsight I doubt if cutting an inch off the top of the blade would've noticeably effected it's performance anyway. Friends have a wind vane (I think a Monitor, though maybe it's an Aries?) fitted on a small yawl rigged yacht that allows insufficient clearance for the wind-blade; instead of fitting a 6" x 30" tall 'normal' blade, they made and fitted one that is perhaps 15" x 15" and report that it still works just fine.

Whilst I could probably still suspend a dink below the arch, it'd require my removing the vane's wind-blade (a two minute task) but to do so would put the wind vane out of commission; as I didn't use that facility even before the vane went on, I've never bothered trying. The proximity of the arch's framework doesn't appear to have any significant effect on the air flow - the vane certainly works well enough, so I wouldn't worry about that.
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Old 20-11-2015, 10:04   #23
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Re: Is a windvane possible with an arch and davits

I attach a couple of images, one of my own boat on a pontoon, and one of a similar bowman with an arch, sent by Hydrovane. I haven't got an image of my own boat sailing with the Hydrovane in use, one tends to have lots of images of other people on passage, but none of one's own! On the shot of climb, you can see the Mizzen staysail sheet tied off to starboard from a block on the boom. I use this to prevent the boom hitting the vane in an accidental gybe.
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Old 20-11-2015, 10:18   #24
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Re: Is a windvane possible with an arch and davits

There is a vane already out there to use with Davits. We looked at it since the solar panels would be in the way and they drew it up with the Autohelm below.

http://selfsteer.com/products/autohelm/index.php

We have not made the purchase yet or settled on it, but that is what we found since in the Bahamas, I would like to keep the dingy on the davits, but still use self-steering on shorter trips. Not to get in a discussion about keeping the dingy on davits offshore please...
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Old 20-11-2015, 10:28   #25
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Re: Is a windvane possible with an arch and davits

On the subject of autopilots that have a wind sensor so it can be used with AW vs. compass course what are some brands with that functionality? The current AP is a little whimpy so I'm shopping for an upgrade anyway. (Our Gulfstar 44 has a 27,000# displacement). Seems like that would be a good compromise for dealing with the structural challenges of dinghies and davits and windvanes.

J.M.
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Old 20-11-2015, 10:44   #26
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Re: Is a windvane possible with an arch and davits

Here's another vote for the hydrovane. did an atlantic crossing (Cabo Verde-Trinidad) last January and it worked like a champ everywhere except an area with lots of seaweed - For about a day and a half we had to use the mechanical AP when the vane's rudder kept getting fouled with mats of weed.
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Old 20-11-2015, 10:45   #27
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Re: Is a windvane possible with an arch and davits

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Originally Posted by JMK View Post
On the subject of autopilots that have a wind sensor so it can be used with AW vs. compass course what are some brands with that functionality? The current AP is a little whimpy so I'm shopping for an upgrade anyway. (Our Gulfstar 44 has a 27,000# displacement). Seems like that would be a good compromise for dealing with the structural challenges of dinghies and davits and windvanes.

J.M.
All of the major brands of electronic autopilots have a wind option. Funny you should present this question as we started out in that direction, but found most of the big pilots that would handle the boat under sail use a lot of amps. The Scanmar Autohelm can have a simple tiller pilot hooked to it (as a number of other vane self steering) to steer to compass and use very little power and a simple to use and replace tiller pilot? In our case, we can keep the old reliable CPT as a backup.

Redundant rudder, steer to wind, steer to compass (low amp draw), keep old wheel pilot for redundancy...

We are still not settled on a solution before setting off again, but another thing that made the solution attractive.
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Old 20-11-2015, 11:31   #28
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Re: Is a windvane possible with an arch and davits

I have an Aries lift up, I extended the wind vane up a couple feet to get it above a fiberglass deck box I mounted between the davits, that box is where I keep my propane cylinders. When I bought the boat the propane tank was in a wood box in the center cockpit, a terrible place for many reasons. I have since added a stainless deck crane. I found it unused and then modified to make it swivel. It was unused because somebody didn't understand forces, mounted it with just a fixed bottom plate and it tore out part of their fiberglass deck. I decided it needed to swivel, and needed an upper support. I built both, bottom swivel and upper support, then added the winch. I haven't run the control lines for the Aries to the wheel yet, I might go directly to the rudder wheel but haven't figured out the quick disconnect from the steering station. The sailing dinghy is 2 piece, it can be lifted vertical as shown or the bow removes and fits in the stern section to store away more compact. It can lift up and sit horizontal right under the propane box or be lashed down on deck, if the going gets real rough.

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Old 20-11-2015, 12:19   #29
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Re: Is a windvane possible with an arch and davits

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheechako View Post
What the world needs is a small electronic wind sensor, readily located anywhere you want. then a small servo or solenoid to actuate the windvane hydro rudder like the wood blade does. It should work better than the blade anyway and be in more clear air, yet keep the power of water to steer.

Most of the electronic steering systems will do this, but defeats the purpose of having a vane in the first place. Probably will use as much if not more current than just going under auto pilot.
No, current draw is related to the force required. An AP must move the ship's rudder against the forces of the sea. There is very little force required to manipulate the wind vane control.
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Old 20-11-2015, 17:12   #30
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Re: Is a windvane possible with an arch and davits

Re extending the vane mount too high: The higher the vane, the more the apparent wind it is sensing will vary with the rolling of the boat. This can lead to a lot of yawing when sailing deep down wind angles on some boat designs.

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