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Old 28-12-2015, 03:10   #136
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Re: Hull painting with Roller and Tipping

Hey RC, looks great! Nice work with all the filling and sanding.

That extra hole you found in your bilge.... are you pretty confident that's the last one? Might be worth having a surveyor just ultrasound the keel to make 100% sure - easier than finding another hole once you've finished all the painting and relaunched!!!

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Old 28-12-2015, 03:24   #137
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Re: Hull painting with Roller and Tipping

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Hey RC, looks great! Nice work with all the filling and sanding.

That extra hole you found in your bilge.... are you pretty confident that's the last one? Might be worth having a surveyor just ultrasound the keel to make 100% sure - easier than finding another hole once you've finished all the painting and relaunched!!!

n
Am I confident it's the last one it's a steel boat , NO,

My bilge was the most neglected part of my boat by the former owner. I'd guess that he kept the water in it 24/7 year round. It's about 300 x 450 x 450 deep. I ground all the rust out if it and I suspect weekend the bottom doing so but it had to be cleaned.

Can any surveyor ultrasound it?
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Old 30-12-2015, 09:40   #138
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Re: Hull painting with Roller and Tipping

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Can any surveyor ultrasound it?
Ideally you want a steel boat surveyor to do it - I once had a standard GRP / wood guy come out and he tried telling me a 5mm plate on my hull was 7mm thick... just because the machine said so (turns out it was the paint). A good surveyor will divide the hull / section into squares (20cm x 20cm ish), scrape off a small section of paint, test it then mark it with chalk. You'll then be able to tell all the section where the weaker spots are.

Hope that helps!!!

n
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Old 30-12-2015, 14:57   #139
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Re: Hull painting with Roller and Tipping

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Originally Posted by ausnp84 View Post
Ideally you want a steel boat surveyor to do it - I once had a standard GRP / wood guy come out and he tried telling me a 5mm plate on my hull was 7mm thick... just because the machine said so (turns out it was the paint). A good surveyor will divide the hull / section into squares (20cm x 20cm ish), scrape off a small section of paint, test it then mark it with chalk. You'll then be able to tell all the section where the weaker spots are.

Hope that helps!!!

n
Well then, won't be doing that. I've just put 3 coats of red oxide on the below water I'm not having anyone scrape it off

I had an insurance inspector go over it last year with some little thickness device, but I think that was checking paint thickness, though he did put in the survey that the hull is in good condition. I've got no more rust anywhere in the hull, BUT, the bilge and fuel tank area in the keel are both unknowns. The keel is solid around the front when I hit it with a hammer. Though it has a dent in the bottom. I'll post a picture of that later and ask advice on whether I should 'fill' the dent.

The bilge I have now (yesterday) cleaned the hole which is about a 50 cent piece. I treated it overnight with prosperous acid, and yesterday I red oxide it. Today I'll plug the hole with a two part plumbing putty. The bilge will never have any weight in it, so I'm betting that as long as I seal it properly and then keep it dry when not in use, it should be fine.
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Old 30-12-2015, 15:05   #140
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Re: Hull painting with Roller and Tipping

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...The bilge I have now (yesterday) cleaned the hole which is about a 50 cent piece. I treated it overnight with prosperous acid, and yesterday I red oxide it. Today I'll plug the hole with a two part plumbing putty. The bilge will never have any weight in it, so I'm betting that as long as I seal it properly and then keep it dry when not in use, it should be fine.
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Old 30-12-2015, 15:09   #141
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Re: Hull painting with Roller and Tipping

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Originally Posted by ausnp84 View Post
Ideally you want a steel boat surveyor to do it - I once had a standard GRP / wood guy come out and he tried telling me a 5mm plate on my hull was 7mm thick... just because the machine said so (turns out it was the paint). A good surveyor will divide the hull / section into squares (20cm x 20cm ish), scrape off a small section of paint, test it then mark it with chalk. You'll then be able to tell all the section where the weaker spots are.

Hope that helps!!!

n
You have a nice looking boat in hindsight I should have got one with a closed in cockpit.
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Old 30-12-2015, 15:11   #142
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Re: Hull painting with Roller and Tipping

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Don't go doing that Terra, now I'm going to be fretting on what you see as dangerous? come on spill the beans. I'll take some pictures of the bilge tonight.
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Old 30-12-2015, 15:14   #143
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Re: Hull painting with Roller and Tipping

Puttying a hole instead of welding? Skipping the survey? These are the types of shortcuts that can precede losing your boat.
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Old 30-12-2015, 15:43   #144
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Re: Hull painting with Roller and Tipping

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Puttying a hole instead of welding? Skipping the survey? These are the types of shortcuts that can precede losing your boat.
It was surveyed last year, which is why I sandblasted and painted this year.

It's a little hard to explain, a picture might help, but I can't 'weld' where this hole is.

It's possible the entire bilge could be cut out, sides ground, and put in a new piece, but then it would have to have a supporting piece of solid steel cut out and welded back in after. and then the outside of the keel would have to be re-cleaned and prep and painted all over again. I just don't think it's worth the expense and time (a day at least by a professional welder) to replace what is essentially a non structural bottom. I'll always know if it developed another hole as it will simply not hold water.
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Old 30-12-2015, 16:35   #145
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Re: Hull painting with Roller and Tipping

This is a picture of my bilge before I painted it with two pack red oxide apoxy. You can see it was pretty badly neglected. It was the first thing I cleaned when I purchased her four years ago, but I then realised that it was a risk to do too much with it in the water, so I cleaned and painted it and left it for a thorough grind out this year, being on the slip.

You can see on the right, about half way along, there is a dark spot with wetness in it. That's where I went through it with the screw driver. I've attempted to put it through every where else, but this seems the worst spot.

The square hole down on the front right side letting the light in is where I did cut out a hole of rust and welded in a new plate. That's been repaired now.
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Old 30-12-2015, 23:31   #146
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Re: Hull painting with Roller and Tipping

You see this dent in my keel?

Is it something I should fill with bog? It will take about 3kg and at the Norglass price that's about $200, so is it necessary?
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Old 30-12-2015, 23:38   #147
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Re: Hull painting with Roller and Tipping

Fairing your keel is something you can chip away at, each time you haul out, if you can't face it all at once.
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Old 30-12-2015, 23:49   #148
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Re: Hull painting with Roller and Tipping

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Fairing your keel is something you can chip away at, each time you haul out, if you can't face it all at once.
I'm going to be coppercoating it though. Will it make a lot of difference to performance of I leave it?
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Old 31-12-2015, 01:25   #149
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Re: Hull painting with Roller and Tipping

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You have a nice looking boat in hindsight I should have got one with a closed in cockpit.
Ta! Although in the end we moved the steering out of the wheelhouse and onto the aft deck, as moving about in European marinas just wasn't possible from inside!

I'm sure we'll stand many watches in the wheelhouse though as we slowly make our way back to South Aus

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Old 31-12-2015, 01:33   #150
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Re: Hull painting with Roller and Tipping

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rustic Charm View Post
This is a picture of my bilge before I painted it with two pack red oxide apoxy. You can see it was pretty badly neglected. It was the first thing I cleaned when I purchased her four years ago, but I then realised that it was a risk to do too much with it in the water, so I cleaned and painted it and left it for a thorough grind out this year, being on the slip.

You can see on the right, about half way along, there is a dark spot with wetness in it. That's where I went through it with the screw driver. I've attempted to put it through every where else, but this seems the worst spot.

The square hole down on the front right side letting the light in is where I did cut out a hole of rust and welded in a new plate. That's been repaired now.
Ok:

1.) Don't worry about the dent. It's negligible and might cost you 0.01kt. You're not a racing boat so for the time and money, it's just not really worth it.

2.) I can't quite get my head around your bilge layout, but filling a hole below the waterline rings alarm bells. What's below that wet spot in the bilge? Is it an empty cavity, or if you drilled a hole in the wet spot, would it let salt water in? If it's just a cavity, yep, go nuts, plug it with filler, paint if properly and you'll be gold. If on the other hand it's steel that seperates the salt water from the inside of the boat, you need to weld plate in. The pressure of the water, coupled with movement and vibration over time, will work filler loose. You've gone to a hell of a lot of effort with your boat, getting it cleaned up and looking good - the last thing you want is to always be wondering if that bit of filler is still solid.

3.) No worries on the survey - in that case, just check for any areas of pitting or wastage, it's quite noticeable when it happens and you'll be able to tell any thin areas. I was devastated when having just finished painting, I found a weak spot and had to chop it out, replace, repaint, etc etc. Three years after launching, I'm glad I did it.

4.) Be VERY careful with copper coat and dissimilar metals. I've seen a couple of boats now where it's been applied to steel and stainless, and completely failed. I'm not saying don't use it (if we had the 7k, I'd highly consider it), but just spend your time prepping properly.

n

EDIT: I think I know how your bilge works... is it just a box that sits inside your keel? If so, fill and fair the hole - no worries. Just be really careful though of any water seeping out of that bilge box and into your keel itself - that's where you'll get rust. If you can, fill your bilge with spray foam (if you haven't already) - that'll help limit water intrusion.
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