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Old 31-12-2015, 02:58   #1
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How to salvage hard anti-fouling during haul-out?

We applied 4 coats of Interlux Ultra hard antifouling in February 2015. Berthed in the Kuching river in Malaysia, a large tree snarled with roots, vines and debris was swept under the keel and lodged around the rudder and prop. We were able to free the boat after 2 days of sawing in croc-infested waters. Our insurer (Pantaenius USA) insists that we haul out to inspect for damage.

International Paints' technical support people, both in SE Asia and in the USA, are out for a 3-week holiday. The Interlux "Antifouling 101" primer says: "Hard antifoulings do not retain their antifouling ability if kept out of the water, and cannot be hauled and relaunched without repainting." We cannot get Ultra, or any hard anti-fouling, here in Kuching.

Our sole option is to haul out on a small railway, during the half-hour window of slack at high tide. The river is tidal and currents in/out can exceed 6 knots. We will not be able to relaunch for a minimum of 25 hours. If damage is found we will be on the railway for several days.

Any advice or experience on how to keep hard antifouling viable when out of the water? Anything we can do prior to relaunch -- light re-sanding, scrub down with Scotchbrites and thinner? -- to get more service out of our antifouling?

Our last application of Trinidad lasted over 3 years in these harsh tropical waters -- and here this Ultra won't last a year.
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Old 31-12-2015, 17:39   #2
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Re: How to salvage hard anti-fouling during haul-out???

Keep it wet or damp as best you can. You may have too much concern, it's just 1 day.
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Old 31-12-2015, 19:56   #3
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Re: How to salvage hard anti-fouling during haul-out???

I'm not clear as to why it's sounding like you're being "forced" to haul out for an extended period. Though I'll offer up some suggestions about such. But it would be good if you could clarify my/our befuddlement.
Particularly as, generally when doing a survey, unless there's an obvious problem, a surveyor doesn't spend 1/2hr looking over a boat's underwater bits. So that too raises a question for me, as to the (true necessity) for you to be out of the water for long.
More info would be helpful here.

That said; if you Have To be out of the water for an extended period, here's...

Plan A:
Have a SERIOUS chat with your insurance company. Asking them where they want you to take your boat to have all of your new, now non-viable, paint, professionally stripped off. And your bottom then re-coated at their expense. Because of what their current directives will do to your new anti-fouling job.

Including, showing them the recipts & tech specs for the paint which you just recently applied, & that their mandated extensive haulout, will ruin. And also, don't be shy about adding in the costs of; all off the consumables used, yard time, protective equipment, hours of labor at $50+ per (as a minimum), etc., etc.
Bottom jobs ain't cheap, nor just about the cost of the paint. And $ is a language which they understand.

Plus, you might do a little "fishing" in the local cruising community for an attorney to pen something regarding the above, for the price of a few bottles of rum ;-)
And while I hate to suggest using such means (faux hiring a lawyer), it's a language that the insurance company is likely to understand.

Plan B:
Find/buy some kind of (disposable) cheap cloth, with which to wrap the hull & foils. And then wet the cloth frequently.
It's far from ideal, but it'll help to keep moisture on things a lot longer. More so than just wetting down the bare hull would anyway.

Then, just prior to re-launching, give the hull a light sanding, to expose some fresh paint. And or, a light sanding, followed by 1 new coat of the same paint which is already on there.

Plan C:
This thought is purely theoretical. But what if you were to put a couple of coats of some other paint on top of your new anti-fouling (something in another color). In order to seal it off from the air completely. And then, just prior to relaunching, sand off said "sealer coat". Thus re-exposing your active, anti-fouling agent.

That, or put a couple of coats of antifouling on top of that which you recently applied. Using a paint which isn't sensitive to being hauled out (using a different colored paint for this). Or one that's not nearly as sensitive anyway.
As there are definitely some paints which meet said criteria. The only catch really, is making sure that they're compatible with that which you have on there already.

But regardless of which of the 2 choices that you pick, I'd imagine that they'll give you a bit of wiggle room, in terms of how long you're on the hard for, & still maintaining the viability of your recent bottom job.


PS: Now would be a good time to be reading the fine print in your insurance policy (SIC).
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Old 31-12-2015, 20:19   #4
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Re: How to salvage hard anti-fouling during haul-out???

72 hours is the number I've heard.
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Old 31-12-2015, 20:30   #5
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Re: How to salvage hard anti-fouling during haul-out?

You might see if the insurance company would accept/allow a diver to do a real thorough video of the hull and "underwater important parts" to see if there is a solid reason to haul the boat. That might save you and the insurer some money in the end.
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Old 31-12-2015, 23:14   #6
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Re: How to salvage hard anti-fouling during haul-out???

Quote:
Originally Posted by fstbttms View Post
72 hours is the number I've heard.



Depends on the paint. Can be as much as six weeks.


For Ultra:



Storage and launching Instructions
for boats painted with hard antifoulings
Hard or contact leaching antifouling paint dries to a hard but porous film
that is packed with biocide. The biocide begins to leach out on contact
with water to prevent fouling growth. This leaching is chemically
designed to release biocide while the boat is in the water. Out of the
water the paint film will oxidize and slow the release of the biocides
to the point where there may not be enough biocide coming out of the
paint film to maintain fouling protection. One of the main benefits of this
type of antifouling is its resistance to abrasion and rubbing. This makes
it ideal for fast powerboats, racing sailboats or boats where the owners
have the bottoms scrubbed regularly.
n Initial maximum time before launch – follow label instructions
n Boats that have been painted and are past the maximum time before
launch on the label but no more than 12 months past their launch
date – scuff sand with 220 grit sandpaper or a maroon Scotch-Brite™
pad prior to launch.
n Boats painted more than 12 months prior to being launched –
sand with 80 - 100 grit sandpaper and recoat prior to launch
n Boats that have been launched but are in the water for less than
24 hours – lightly pressure wash to remove surface contamination
(salt and dirt etc.). Follow label instructions for maximum launch time
from date of painting.
n Boats that have been in the water for more than 24 hours but
less than 30 days – pressure wash immediately after hauling.
No additional work is needed if the boat is relaunched with 72 hours.
If the boat will be out of the water for more than 72 hours will need to
be sanded with 220 grit sandpaper immediately prior to relaunching.
n Boats that have been in the water for more than 30 days – pressure
wash when hauled, sand with 80 or 100 grit sandpaper and recoat.
Recoating is necessary even if the boat will be out of the water for
less than 72 hours.



http://www.yachtpaint.com/Literature...01_usa_eng.pdf




Thus, if it has been in the water more than 30 days, it must be sanded and recoated regardless of exposure time.


If it has been in the water less than 30 days, then Fstbttms is correct and it is OK to a maximum exposure time of 72 hours, after which a light sanding and no recoat would be OK.
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Old 01-01-2016, 03:27   #7
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Re: How to salvage hard anti-fouling during haul-out?

Thank you to all. I was once one of those nasty lawyers, and did quite a bit of insurance work. As my client now my advice is to deal with the fact that I chose to use hard anti-fouling, knowing that the insurance policy I've held for over a decade says:

"Following any occurrence involving potential damage, Pantaenius has the right to require an out of water condition survey AT NAMED INSURED'S EXPENSE ..."

Seti -- my husband is a dive professional and ultimately spent 1.5 hours in SCUBA under water to cut away the debris, despite the 2 crocodiles that regularly visit the marina. Visibility is like diving in cappuccino. His inspection-by-Braille didn't reveal serious damage but we can't photo-document that ... or be 100% certain.

Minaret -- the guidance you've posted is what I have, and we have been in the water way over 30 days. I like Uncivilized's idea of diapering the boat and trying to keep it wet for 25 hours before relaunch. Why 25 hours?? -- tidal currents on this river are fierce, slack lasts an hour at best. I do not expect that we can winch out, power-wash, inspect and get back in within that narrow window.
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Old 01-01-2016, 04:23   #8
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Re: How to salvage hard anti-fouling during haul-out?

How about a light coat of bio degradable grease? Butter? Might prevent it from drying out and will wear off once back in the water.

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Old 01-01-2016, 08:43   #9
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Re: How to salvage hard anti-fouling during haul-out?

Would it be possible to move the boat to another area where you would have a better tide situation? Possibly one with a marina that isn't restricted to high tide haulouts.
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Old 01-01-2016, 11:35   #10
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Re: How to salvage hard anti-fouling during haul-out?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Franziska View Post
How about a light coat of bio degradable grease? Butter? Might prevent it from drying out and will wear off once back in the water.

Welcome to the Woods Mira 35 - Catamaran Lady Rovers Website!
I had the same thought. I would imagine lack of water is not the enemy exposure to air is. A paint roller and a biodegradable oil might work?
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Old 01-01-2016, 12:11   #11
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Re: How to salvage hard anti-fouling during haul-out?

Hauling out for inspection should be considered a MUST, since even a hairline crack in the rudder could lead to subsequent failure, and unless you can convince your insurer that you can hire a really sharp-eyed local "diving surveyor"...hauling is the way to go.


If you are forced to keep the boat out of water, I would think that you could keep the bottom moist in several ways, similar to the ways that construction companies keep freshly poured concrete wet.


First, you could secure cheap (muslin? cotton duck?) cloth to the hull with ropes. Throw water on it, soak it, then cover with cheap plastic film/tarps to help trap the moisture and prevent the cloth from drying. Toss in more water a couple of times a day as needed.


Or, get some "leaky hose" used for drip irrigation and mist irrigation, run it around the waterline with some duct tape, and turn on the water. Let the mist or spray run down the hull.


For that matter, a couple of lawn sprinklers under the boat would probably do the same thing, assuming you don't have to pay a fortune for local "hose" water that way.


Just needs a little planning, including figuring out where to go in case you DO have to stay hauled out, and you need to go get the equipment "now" instead of first chasing around to locate it.
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Old 01-01-2016, 12:22   #12
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Re: How to salvage hard anti-fouling during haul-out?

I wouldn't worry about 24 hours.
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Old 01-01-2016, 12:44   #13
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Re: How to salvage hard anti-fouling during haul-out?

For the last 20 years we have been applying moderately priced ablative (of one color) over hard epoxy (different color). For your situation, the ablative would "seal" the epoxy and be less affected by time out of water. The ablative eventually washes off, exposing the epoxy. Even in Florida and Bahamian waters, we average 36 to 40+ months between bottom jobs with only 3 to 4 u/w scrubbings in the later months.
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Old 01-01-2016, 18:02   #14
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Re: How to salvage hard anti-fouling during haul-out?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alii View Post
We applied 4 coats of Interlux Ultra hard antifouling in February 2015. Berthed in the Kuching river in Malaysia, a large tree snarled with roots, vines and debris was swept under the keel and lodged around the rudder and prop. We were able to free the boat after 2 days of sawing in croc-infested waters. Our insurer (Pantaenius USA) insists that we haul out to inspect for damage.

International Paints' technical support people, both in SE Asia and in the USA, are out for a 3-week holiday. The Interlux "Antifouling 101" primer says: "Hard antifoulings do not retain their antifouling ability if kept out of the water, and cannot be hauled and relaunched without repainting." We cannot get Ultra, or any hard anti-fouling, here in Kuching.

Our sole option is to haul out on a small railway, during the half-hour window of slack at high tide. The river is tidal and currents in/out can exceed 6 knots. We will not be able to relaunch for a minimum of 25 hours. If damage is found we will be on the railway for several days.

Any advice or experience on how to keep hard antifouling viable when out of the water? Anything we can do prior to relaunch -- light re-sanding, scrub down with Scotchbrites and thinner? -- to get more service out of our antifouling?

Our last application of Trinidad lasted over 3 years in these harsh tropical waters -- and here this Ultra won't last a year.
If you are trying to exact a new bottom job from the insurance company by fraudulent measures, shame on you for making others premiums go up.

Solution 1: Plan for a 1 hour total haulout time.

Solution 2: Move the boat carefully to another location where timing is not so critical.

Solution 3: Borrow a jet pump, hose, oscillating sprinklers.

Solution 4: If extended haulout and all other solutions won't work, apply a coat of Micron 66 or CSC.

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About Sheen Marine
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Old 01-01-2016, 20:44   #15
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Re: How to salvage hard anti-fouling during haul-out?

Hi,

If you think that there no structural damage is go out to the sea and look there again in clear water to the hull. If it looks all fine continius to Lumut (pangkor marina island) on position 04.12 N - 100. 36 E or to Langkawi.
I was there a few mounds ago and this is for wat I have seen the first place to lift him safley! There are other options but to riskey to have more damage. If you continiu to Langkawi than can you fly all wat you need taxfree in with Fedex or Dhl. TNT gif to mutch troubles by the customs.

Miri Marina on position 04.22.90 N - 113.58.15 E is a other option. They call a crane and lift him on this way. You will find not all the stuff wat you need and in this way not a perfect solution.

Singapore is a other solution but it will be verry expensive!!!!

I woud go for Langkawi if possibol, orden wat you need and send it to there.





In singapore are also options plenty.

I hope that you can continu and it not have to do on a trolly on a railway. Maybe are there more places but this is wat I know.

Hope and wisch you all the best and you are there not the first boat witt this issue!
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