Freya 39 Rudder removal?

[zuckerfish]

I have a Freya 39 built by Gannon in 1977. I hauled it out for the first time today and it needs a new cutlass bearing. So that also entails rudder removal because there is not enough room to get the prop off without having to do this bigger job that I didn't anticipate. The problem being, for me, is that I've never dealt with anything quite like this rudder setup and there isn't anyone at the boatyard that I'm at (Santa Cruz) that knows anything about it either.
It appears that there are four screws that go through the gudgeon on the lower part of the rudder and that if they are removed (which looks fairly close to being really, really difficult) that it would split in half and possibly come off in halves....however they are also affixed by some stainless pins that go all the way through the keel.

If you've dealt with this style of Freya rudder attachment and you have some answers for a desperate advice taker--I'll be waiting for a reply and I'll thank you very much in advance!

Thanks,

Michael

[minaret]

There are several Freya owners here who should be able to help you. I'll see if I can attract ones attention...

[Terra Nova]

Min--thanks for the heads-up. But I've never had the rudder off my Freya.

My suggestion is to clean the bottom paint from the gudgeon area, so you can see where there is fairing compound to be removed in order to get to the gudgeon fasteners. Explore that area and it should become clear.

[zuckerfish]

Thanks for the replies. I had cleaned off the paint from the gudgeon and seen how it was fastened together with 8 stainless machine screws--the problem was getting them out! The large one that went through fastened through the keel deadwood came easily but.....the smaller ones that go around the rudder bearing are really tough. Used an impact driver and got 3 out of 4 after using lots of heat with propane torch. Had to drill off 1 head to get it off though. All is well that ends well but be prepared for some agony if you ever take your rudder off.

Thanks again.

[Terra Nova]

Photos?

[Camlop]

Hi guys,

I am looking at a Freya for a possible new home with some extended cruising in mind and would like any feed back on the sailing abilities etc.... have read all the usual blurbs about 3 times Sydney to Hobart winner but yet to see any reviews on the general sailing qualities e.g. pointing ability, weather helm etc.. and general sail ability be great to hear from some people that own sail and live aboard.

Cheers

Cam Lopez

[barnakiel]

Images, images, PLS!

Freyas are so fantastic. Maybe one day too.

b.

[randsiegfried]

I found that on the first pull out after a long period of neglect (long story) my Freya had no cutlass bearing.
I was able to remove the prop and add a slightly shortened bearing with the rudder in place. I was not at a yard that I wanted to pull the rudder.

That will be next spring when I also scrape and coat. I will check very carefully for crevice corrosion at the top of the rudder shaft- I may decide to replace or rebuild then; if so I'll add a replaceable prop servicing cut out.

I'm in the Bay Area if I can help, but I'm fairly new to Freya 's as well.

They sail better than you would expect, but don't point like a fin keeled racer/cruiser. I always return smiling from a sail.


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[randsiegfried]

To get the prop off with the rudder in place took shifting the drive shaft further forward and saying a few words, but it worked.


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[Terra Nova]

Is it that there was enough space to move the shaft forward, with the coupling removed?

[randsiegfried]

That us what I did with mine. Can't assume that every installation is the same. Sure got a lot smoother with a cutlass bearing installed!


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[Jim Cate]

Whilst thinking about this question, I suddenly wondered why one could not use (in a typical isolated strut design) a cutlass bearing that was split into two halves? It would solve a lot of installation issues, both going in and coming out.

Anyone ever heard of such?

Jim

[GordMay]

Greetings and welcome aboard the CF, Michael & Cam.

[foxy]

Surpeised you cant pull the shaft back far enough etc to do the bearing. You do get a bit of play on the angle when you take it out and it was enough for us, we did it in the yard in Deltaville. Not taken the rudder off yet but got me thinking that maybe I should......

[michaelspence]

I also am the owner of a freya 39 built in 1977. In fact the original owner. I have removed he ruudder several times and recommend it to anyone that has a boat of this vintage if only to inspect all the components and replace the bearings. This is particularly important if yo plan to go offshore, as any good surveyor will tell you. The first issue is to akllow room for dropping the rudder by either digging a hole under it in the yard, or making sure it is blocked high enough over the ground at the boatyard. It requires about a foot clearance under the base of the rudder. You can avoid the step of actually dropping the rudder if you only want to inspect or replace the lower bearing, but someday you will want to do the whole inspection anyway so why not do it right now since it is a 40 year old boat. Second, the four 3/8 inch bolts holding the bronze gudgeon halves are slicone bronze, and may break or seize upon removal. Not a big deal, just drill them out and replace with either bronze or high quality stainless, making sure that the fitting is protected with zinc button anodes on both sides upon relaunch. These four bolts are 3/8" and go all the way through the keel. Put wooden blocks under the rudder before removing the gudgeons to support its weight when the supporting gudgeon is removed. The rudder assembly weighs about 75 lbs. The two gudgeon halves may require prying with a a stout wide chisel if they are bedded in 5200 or similar. When the two halves come off the 1" cutless bearing will be exposed. it is in one peice and should have a good clear opening in the bottom of the gudgeon castings for cleansing of abrasive particles (sand, etc) that naturally flow through the bearing. Inspect the shaft for pitting or evidence of captive corrosion. a careful sanding of the shaft surfaces with emory cloth or wet sandpaper is recommended. Replace the cutless bearing with a new one as they are inexpensive and removal is the biggest part of the job. Do not lubricate as any type of grease will just attract sand and dirt and accelerate wear. After replacing the bearing you can either re-bed the two gudgeon halves and reassemble with copious amounts of 3M 5200 and new bolts, making sure to use either nylock nuts or lock washers on the new fittings. I replaced mine with 316 stainless about 20 years ago and have had no evedence of galvanic corrosion on the bronze peices, just the button zincs which are attached to both pieces with 1/4 inch-20 screws threaded into the bronze. Dropping the rudder entails a few more steps but is recommended for a boat of this age going offshore. Do so by unbolting the flange above the rudder gland inside the hull or removing the set screw and dropping the shaft. A plastic or wooden mallet will help if it is corroded. Once the rudder is dropped it can be put on sawhorses and the upper shaft surfaces inspected for corrosion. If there is any sign of pitting or captive corrosion, a further inspection or the internal rudder armature is justified. I accomplished this by using a 3 inch disc grinder, cutting a rectangular access port into the side of the ruder, centered between the edges. Removing this access port will allow cutting away the foam internals and carefully checking the stainless parts inside. The rudder armature is composed of stainless tubing welded to the 1 3/4 inch stainless shaft. You can easily see if the rudder had had sea water inside of it and whether the armature is corroded. If it appears to be sound, then reassembly simply requires new high quality foam poured in, shaved to shape, and then the outer skin replacement. The rectangular piece of outer skin that was removed earlier can be replaced by grinding a 4 inch tapered margin on both inside and outside of the access port, (giving a total of 8 inches wide layup) and fiberglassing with succesive layers of roving and cloth and a high quality epoxy such as WEST system.
Do NOT use polyester resin as a secondary bond will not be strong enough. This as a structurally important re-build so great care must be made to use adequate thickness of the build up, a minimum of 5/16 up to 3/8 inch. After rebonding the access port in this manner, the edges of the opening can be ground, filled and faired so the rudder is in original shape. Before replacing the rudder, the exit points for the shaft at the top and in the lower bearing area must be thoroughly cleaned, dried, and given a heavy bead of 5200 to seal the joints against water intrusion. After doing this inspection and repair, the owner can again have some confidence that the rudder is sound.