Bilge Cracks Leaking Seawater

[coopec43]

Originally Posted by fuentes

I have a 1999 45 ft. Leopard with a sacrificial keel. Please do let us know what you have done and what you found. I have not had any responses from the manufacturer about how to set the boat on the hard nor other questions I have asked in the past. I have been looking for the information manuals for the boat with no success.

Unlike the Leopard 40 there does not seem to be any online manuals for the Leopard 45. Any clues from the Leopard 40 manual?

https://www.robertsonandcaine.com/ne...pard-45-en.pdf

https://www.robertsonandcaine.com/do...rochure_EN.pdf

https://sailingoroboro.com/wp-conten...al-Leopard.pdf

(Page 112 has instructions for lifting and transport)

[Fore and Aft]

I am very interested in what has caused the crack. I supervised the installation of two bow thrusters in a Leopard 45 cat and the hull would have been at least 3/4” solid glass where we did the cut out. A localised crack like that looks more like impact damage? Much like what I see on top sides when they hit a hard object? But there looks like no other damage in the area?
What is the boats history? I would love to slip your boat and examine the outside then grind the damaged areas and see what secrets she is hiding?
Cheers

[coopec43]

Originally Posted by Fore and Aft

I am very interested in what has caused the crack. I supervised the installation of two bow thrusters in a Leopard 45 cat and the hull would have been at least 3/4” solid glass where we did the cut out. A localised crack like that looks more like impact damage? Much like what I see on top sides when they hit a hard object? But there looks like no other damage in the area?
What is the boats history? I would love to slip your boat and examine the outside then grind the damaged areas and see what secrets she is hiding?
Cheers

You'd expect a structural crack in a heavy lay-up to be a lot longer than 3 to 4 inches and it probably wouldn't leak. If it's impact damage the fibers could well be torn which would allow water to leak.

Clive

[pillars]

I think, based on my research so far, the most likely explanation is that the yard dropped it too hard on the starboard side when moving the boat.

The boat was sitting on the hard for the past 6 months, and there was a survey done before that and didn't find this. In the owners absence the boat was repositioned in the yard probably at least a couple of times during that 6 months. Then the boat was surveyed again before going back in the water and that crack was observed, as well as some cracked tabbing in the same bilge. The thought was that these were old though and maybe on the inside only, so the boat was put in the water. Then seawater showed up through the crack...

[a64pilot]

Being dropped was also my thought.
I think you may find that the crack is at an edge right where the layup goes from being thick to thin or the edge of the keel, that’s a guess though.
I’m going out on another limb and am going to assume there is Insurence, and if so you may need a professional surveyor to weigh in and say that in his professional opinion this is damage, and not a design or build defect.
I really don’t know much about Insurence really, but if there is Insurence, maybe contact them before you start any work?

[rabbi]

Originally Posted by pillars

I think, based on my research so far, the most likely explanation is that the yard dropped it too hard on the starboard side when moving the boat.

The boat was sitting on the hard for the past 6 months, and there was a survey done before that and didn't find this. In the owners absence the boat was repositioned in the yard probably at least a couple of times during that 6 months. Then the boat was surveyed again before going back in the water and that crack was observed, as well as some cracked tabbing in the same bilge. The thought was that these were old though and maybe on the inside only, so the boat was put in the water. Then seawater showed up through the crack...

Being dropped could be a cause.
Depending where in the Caribbean it could also be an earthquake. Martinique had a 5.4 in September.
Earthquake data
Maybe not mention this when talking to the insurance.

I see you were concerned about the bad fairing of the hull/keel join back in August. Was that the same boat?
If you have mentioned this to the surveyor he should have done detailed photo evidence of that region both inside and outside.

[FlyingScot]

Be 100% sure it's leaking from the crack. As in dry everything all around it and sit and wait for water to only appear at the crack. Not dripping or running into the crack from elsewhere.

Good luck.

I have a leak I need to find in my port bilge. Ain't life fun...

[Blackie Swart]

Those model Leopards with sacrificial keels should not be stored on the hard on their keels alone. There should be equal weight distribution of chocking and on the keel. I have drawings of the measurements etc to be used when putting up on the hard. I'll post them (if needed) when I can get to copy and scan them onto my computer. Putting up on the hard creates a number of problems with the interior floors, doors etc and possibly something like the OP is experiencing.

They are not difficult to remove but the calking with the polyurathane Sika afterwards is not an easy job and then there's the fiberglass work.

[Blackie Swart]

Here's a Youtube link on the subject as well.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=gM3-LjgWhRM

[Blackie Swart]

Here are some more drawings of the actual keel design. I have not managed to copy the drawings of the layup on the hard yet.

[billknny]

Geez... I always told people that Rule One of sailing was to keep the water on the outside of the boat.

I amazes me that people talk about this like it is just the way "boats are". A boat design that cracks, and leaks, is just NOT SAFE. Not even a little. And a boat that can not sit on its own keels? Really? Just say NO!

[Blackie Swart]

IMHO I guess yachts are meant to be sailed in the water and not "parked on the hard".
It is, afterall, a safety feature - if the vessel hit something hard in the water, like a reef or container, the keel will break off at the sacrificial joins and not destroy the whole hull.
You never see a monohull standing on it's keel.

[gmakhs]

Originally Posted by Blackie Swart

IMHO I guess yachts are meant to be sailed in the water and not "parked on the hard".
It is, afterall, a safety feature - if the vessel hit something hard in the water, like a reef or container, the keel will break off at the sacrificial joins and not destroy the whole hull.
You never see a monohull standing on it's keel.

A lot of monohulls are standing on their keels.
If not all of them .

[Blackie Swart]

They also crack, break off and leak. They're still supported around the rest of the hull. A cat without sacrificial keels can stand on the hard without support but not that particular design with those keels. That's the point of the discussion.

[gmakhs]

Monohulls doesn't need supports around the hull for the weight , only to balance the boat and keep it up right .
There monohulls that use legs like mine for this , monohulls with 2 keels , monohulls with one wide keel , all of them can support their weight on the keel without support for the weight only for balance . .

A boat of this price range like the one mentioned that can't support its weight on the keel it's a weak design .
And don't forget one of the reasons you get a cat is that you can beach it easily with the tides like a bilge keel or double keel monohulls.

The ones who crack or leak without a serious grouding (like Catalina's) are under engineered weak boats that should be allowed to be on water even for coastal .
My boat is week and can flex , it's light build as well but the keel is supported correctly .