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Old 06-10-2015, 08:37   #1
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Best reverse cycle heat / airconditioner

The Cruiseair 16,000 BTU in my salon is about dead, thermostat won't put it in heat mode, still cools well, but pan is full of rust, thing is just old. Rather than to buy another thermostat I think it's time to retire the thing, Lord knows how old it is.
Last year I put a Webasto FCF 5,000 BTU in the fwd Stateroom and have been very happy with it 0 problems, but before I pull the trigger on a 16,000 BTU Webasto for the Salon, I thought I'd ask if there is a better unit than the Webasto.

I'd love one that the fan would turn off when the temp set point was reached.
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Old 06-10-2015, 09:39   #2
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Re: Best reverse cycle heat / airconditioner

Several owners in our club have moved to Dometic/Cruiseair/Marine Air Vector Turbo units, say they're great. Including the composite drain pan (no more rusty condensate).


Our current old-ish Marine Air Vector Compact units can be programmed to cycle the fan with the compressor. Ours uses the Passport II controllers...


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Old 06-10-2015, 11:36   #3
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Re: Best reverse cycle heat / airconditioner

Any idea where I can buy a Dometic turbo 16K BTU?

I can't seem to find many sources online, seem to be mostly dealers who are more set up to do installs?
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Old 06-10-2015, 12:34   #4
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Re: Best reverse cycle heat / airconditioner

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Any idea where I can buy a Dometic turbo 16K BTU?

I can't seem to find many sources online, seem to be mostly dealers who are more set up to do installs?
I found one company online citimarinestore.com that listed them but know nothing about them.

You might try calling Defender. They list other Dometic products on their website. They have custom ordered a number of things for me in the past that they didn't stock but were distributors for the maker.
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Old 06-10-2015, 13:15   #5
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Re: Best reverse cycle heat / airconditioner

Defender doesn't list them, so I had not thought about a custom order.

I'll try the citimarinestore, I've only found a couple of prices so far, and they are about $1,000 higher than a Webasto, and that is a lot, hard to justify a grand
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Old 06-10-2015, 14:16   #6
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Re: Best reverse cycle heat / airconditioner

Interesting bird, these heat pumps. Have they perfected them well enough to make sense enough to install in a world travelling cruiser? I will brave greenlands bergs to equador's isles. Will it really help or just be another thing that breaks down.
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Old 06-10-2015, 14:31   #7
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Re: Best reverse cycle heat / airconditioner

Quote:
Originally Posted by a64pilot View Post
Defender doesn't list them, so I had not thought about a custom order.

I'll try the citimarinestore, I've only found a couple of prices so far, and they are about $1,000 higher than a Webasto, and that is a lot, hard to justify a grand
a64,

Just something for you to consider: warranty issues.

As resellers, some distributors do not honor warranties. While they make you go direct to the company, you may want to consider b uying direct if $ matches closely.

Good luck.
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Old 06-10-2015, 14:37   #8
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Re: Best reverse cycle heat / airconditioner

Our Cruiseair 16K BTU unit is a composite pan. We've only had it for a single season but we've been pretty happy with it. I'd do it again.

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Old 06-10-2015, 14:46   #9
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Re: Best reverse cycle heat / airconditioner

EB, where did you get it, or did you have it installed?


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Old 06-10-2015, 14:48   #10
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Re: Best reverse cycle heat / airconditioner

Beth, they usually last about 20 years, about the same as a house heat pump, and break down about as often as a house heat pump, which if you look at the thing as a system, I wish I could get nearly as many trouble free hours out of a Diesel


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Old 06-10-2015, 15:09   #11
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Re: Best reverse cycle heat / airconditioner

A64, being that we're still several hours from the boat, we had it installed by a local licensed dealer. This was a new install, the boat didn't have AC when we bought her, and was more work than I was ready to try and tackle remotely. It cools very well and with the sound shield, is also pretty quiet when running. I did initially wish the fan would kick of when temp is reached, but have since decided I like the air movement. That and a few fans means we can actually keep the boat boat comfortable during the day and downright cold (if desired) at night. We originally thought the 40 would require two units but didn't want to give up the storage space, or the $$$.

Glad we went this route, though I'm sure there are plenty of good quality units out there.
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Old 06-10-2015, 15:41   #12
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Re: Best reverse cycle heat / airconditioner

Quote:
Originally Posted by s/v Beth View Post
Interesting bird, these heat pumps. Have they perfected them well enough to make sense enough to install in a world travelling cruiser? I will brave greenlands bergs to equador's isles. Will it really help or just be another thing that breaks down.
If you are talking about a reverse cycle valve on an AC unit, they work just like the AC - move heat from one medium to another. In AC, they cool air by removing the heat from the air and putting it in the water. By simply reversing the flow process using a valve in the coolant line, they remove heat from the water and put it into the air.

However, there is a limit. Heating only works to water temps ~45*. Below that, there is not enough differential to provide sufficient heat.

They typically break down at the same rate as any AC unit, since they are just a valve on an AC unit.

Your cruising range would be determined by the temperature of the water.

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Old 06-10-2015, 15:52   #13
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Re: Best reverse cycle heat / airconditioner

EB,
I put a 5,000 BTU under the mattress up fwd, really glad I did, one in the salon just couldn't keep it cool up there by itself, especially the forward head, easy to run a duct to the fwd head, and another duct right by the mast, I assume a 40 os laid out similar to a 38. I picked a 5,000 as a Honda could easily run it, wish I had gone slightly larger, maybe an 8,000 BTU.
One up front is a Webasto and you cannot hear it at all, just the air noise from the duct.


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Old 06-10-2015, 16:02   #14
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Re: Best reverse cycle heat / airconditioner

Dometic 16k turbo reversible with plastic pan is great and has auto fan option, so fan speed changes as set point is closer and when reached fan can switch off, if programmed in setup to do so, they are even so clever that if you have more than one unit they will only ever start one at a time so your generator can cope with the starting loads.
It's amazing how quickly it heats the boat but haven't seen a water temperature below 14 deg C, so not sure how it would cope with Greenland. However domestic heat pumps that use ground water at around 4 or 5 deg C apparently work well and the technology is the same.

Regards

Ab


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Old 06-10-2015, 16:04   #15
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Re: Best reverse cycle heat / airconditioner

Yeah the layout on the 40 is very similar to the 38 (almost identical). We went back and forth on single vs dual units and opted for a single 16k unit under starboard settee. Ducked to the forward cabin through the bulkhead with a large vent the saloon. The rest of the boat we just manage by using fans to move the air where we need it. This weekend we had another couple aboard, so gave them the forward cabin and we took the rear, with the fans angled correctly we where very comfortable back there even with no dedicated ducts.

The nice thing about having another unit up front would definitely be the ability to run AC off a small generator. So far we've decided we'd rather have the space, and have no generator. Once we're out and cruising, we'll see if that was a good decision or not.

Our next big project is an Arch and sails.

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