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Old 26-07-2016, 11:00   #61
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Re: And so it Begins: The Teak Deck Removal Project

looks like a formosa deck to me
donot remind me my bow again needs work
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Old 26-07-2016, 11:04   #62
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Re: And so it Begins: The Teak Deck Removal Project

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I used the 1/2" hole saw method...drilled holes all around the deck and it all came up bone dry except for the section right in front of the pilot house.


Excellent. Check that bond wherever you can, see how far you can insert a thin putty knife. If it bottoms out try to insert a piece of flashing or other thin stiff metal. If you can insert for long distances anywhere, it's core delam. To cure it you might consider epoxy injection. Keep at it!

For others doing this in the future; a $300 quality meter (GRP-33) would have saved Rich from hole saw exploratory, thus saving him from having to grind and glass dozens of holes in the glass skin. Worth it!
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Old 26-07-2016, 11:06   #63
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Re: And so it Begins: The Teak Deck Removal Project

So I need a total of 27sqft of 1/4 material for 3 - 1/4 layers. (2ft x 4ft sheets are what I'm looking at.
I can go with Corecel for $1107 or marine plywood for $783 the price difference is $324. At the end of the day Corecell seems to be the better choice unless budget is an overriding concern, which it isn't here (since my wife is at work earning real money while I'm working on the boat..ha ha ha)
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Old 26-07-2016, 11:09   #64
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Re: And so it Begins: The Teak Deck Removal Project

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As an update, 90% of the balsa core on this 1977 boat is prefect. Dry...intact...and it's impressive to see how well it looks when we have cut into dry areas or in the act of removing the wet areas and continuing a bit into the dry core. I think a big factor in why so much of my balsa core is in great shape is because in 1984 a previous owner put down fiberglass, paint and non-skid right over the original teak decks. This gave an extra layer of water penetration protection, especially on the bow and forward parts of the deck that had a good slope to them. The wet core areas were where the slops flattened out particularly right in front of the pilot house structure.

This is a close up I just snapped (yes I will do anything for a distraction) of the layers of the Deck. You can see the top fiberglass layer, followed by two balsa core layers with a thin glass layer in between. The very bottom layer is fiberglass with some wood grain still on it and not cleaned up well yet.


So from where I am today with the project.
All of the wet or suspect core is cut out and gone.
All of the fiberglass deck is sanded and cleaned.

So today I'm going to start filling in the screw holes on the deck that will remain and heading over to a local fiberglass shop just on a look see mission. I still have not decided on what new "core" material to use. Cost isn't a factor to me since the actual area is not that large, but ease of install and dealing with is. I need to build back up about 3/4 so I'm thinking 3 layers of 1/4 Corcel or marine ply...I honestly haven't decided and ordered that yet.

Once the core is replaced and made to be even with the existing deck (I'm sure that will be a lot of work) I will then take Minaret's advice and go with a 1708 glass mat over the entire deck for starters followed by 2-layers of 2-4Oz mat.

So far I'm feeling pretty good about the progress and project, but remember ignorance is bliss.

The last time I was told I should get some professional help, it resulted in a $250/hr counseling session where I was asked about my childhood and if I remembered the first time I sent to the bathroom by myself. (??#!$)


+ this top skin is pretty heavy. I'd consider going to two 1708 + 2 1.5 oz matt. The matt finish lets you use a long roller to really roll it out fair; the peel ply helps with that too. Then when you grind/sand for prep for fairing compound, you are grinding on matt only, therefore not removing any structural fiber from the 1708.
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Old 26-07-2016, 11:13   #65
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Re: And so it Begins: The Teak Deck Removal Project

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+ this top skin is pretty heavy. I'd consider going to two 1708 + 2 1.5 oz matt. The matt finish lets you use a long roller to really roll it out fair; the peel ply helps with that too. Then when you grind/sand for prep for fairing compound, you are grinding on matt only, therefore not removing any structural fiber from the 1708.
It's only time and money...
So if your expert eye thinks going with two layers of 1708 followed by two 1.5oz matt is the way to go...then I'm in.

Here is the Core-Cell A500 I'm going with
http://www.jamestowndistributors.com...in+Foam+Sheets
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Old 26-07-2016, 11:18   #66
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Re: And so it Begins: The Teak Deck Removal Project

Quote:
Originally Posted by SV THIRD DAY View Post
So I need a total of 27sqft of 1/4 material for 3 - 1/4 layers. (2ft x 4ft sheets are what I'm looking at.
I can go with Corecel for $1107 or marine plywood for $783 the price difference is $324. At the end of the day Corecell seems to be the better choice unless budget is an overriding concern, which it isn't here (since my wife is at work earning real money while I'm working on the boat..ha ha ha)


I'd go with the marine ply. Instead of three layers of 1/4" I'd consider two layers of 3/8", unless there is a lot of camber in the areas in question. This will save time by reducing the number of steps.


Instead of cutting it into squares, just bore 1/4" relief holes in a 12" or so grid pattern. This is so that excess bonding material under the ply has somewhere to squeeze out. Otherwise it will hydraulic lock and create an unfair surface with highs.

I know you probably don't have a vacuum bag setup or experience with same. Sand bags and other weights can work out ok, but vacuum gives the best results. If you have a badass shop vac, you may be able to ghetto vacuum bag your core with some plastic film and butyl tape. In the old days we did this all the time. Do a dry run. If you bond core with poly you only need bag pressure for +/- 2 hrs.

Marine ply will be the closest match to the original construction. I wouldn't use core cell for this. Coosa would be the top shelf method for this. Not necessary for spot repairs though.


I'd suggest you apply one layer of core material at a time, instead of all of them at once, unless your core repair areas are fairly small. Much less of a gamble that way.
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Old 26-07-2016, 11:24   #67
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Re: And so it Begins: The Teak Deck Removal Project

Quote:
Originally Posted by minaret View Post
I'd go with the marine ply. Instead of three layers of 1/4" I'd consider two layers of 3/8", unless there is a lot of camber in the areas in question. This will save time by reducing the number of steps.


Instead of cutting it into squares, just bore 1/4" relief holes in a 12" or so grid pattern. This is so that excess bonding material under the ply has somewhere to squeeze out. Otherwise it will hydraulic lock and create an unfair surface with highs.

I know you probably don't have a vacuum bag setup or experience with same. Sand bags and other weights can work out ok, but vacuum gives the best results. If you have a badass shop vac, you may be able to ghetto vacuum bag your core with some plastic film and butyl tape. In the old days we did this all the time. Do a dry run. If you bond core with poly you only need bag pressure for +/- 2 hrs.

Marine ply will be the closest match to the original construction. I wouldn't use core cell for this. Coosa would be the top shelf method for this. Not necessary for spot repairs though.


I'd suggest you apply one layer of core material at a time, instead of all of them at once, unless your core repair areas are fairly small. Much less of a gamble that way.
More great info...I really do appreciate it from an expert who thinks about this stuff in his sleep.

The deck is so large that the camber isn't too great at all, so I think I could get by with two 3/8 Marine Plywood layers and I'm all about saving time and energy. I was going to go with the sandbag weight method.
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Old 26-07-2016, 17:01   #68
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Re: And so it Begins: The Teak Deck Removal Project

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More great info...I really do appreciate it from an expert who thinks about this stuff in his sleep.

The deck is so large that the camber isn't too great at all, so I think I could get by with two 3/8 Marine Plywood layers and I'm all about saving time and energy. I was going to go with the sandbag weight method.



Any time. See if you can acquire a five gallon bucket of Core-Bond, preferably with the hard to find BPO catalyst. Soak each piece in thinned poly resin and while it's still sticky trowel on your mixed core bond with a notched trowel. Then put the piece in place. You may find a few strategically placed screws will help it suck down tight as well as weights. The screw holes will fill on successive core plies or final lam. Once the first ply is down, successive plies can be screwed or even stapled to it (use non corrosive staples). Be sure to use large enough notches in the trowel to get squeeze out from all seams and relief holes. Stagger joints and seams in a "stepped" effect, about 1". This makes stronger joints which are easy to screw in place. Leave a little gap on all joints and rely on squeeze out to fill. Sand fair after cure and glass. Good luck!
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Old 28-07-2016, 21:07   #69
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Re: And so it Begins: The Teak Deck Removal Project

It's coming along....


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Old 30-07-2016, 06:33   #70
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Re: And so it Begins: The Teak Deck Removal Project

Hi SV Third Day,

Just in the middle of the same process on an Endurance 35 Ketch, teak removal I'm going to have to take away the toe rails as well as its rotten, might as well as it will give trouble down the line

Just need to order up the marine ply screws, sealant etc to put it back together and fiber glass the top deck over ply.

Any suggestions on new toe rails I'd like to put artificial teak for the toe rails ??

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Old 30-07-2016, 06:50   #71
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Re: And so it Begins: The Teak Deck Removal Project

Great you have a son interested and willing!
I would go with a tri axel cloth.
Look at all those little bits of balsa, well you go with a cored deck you can expect to get cored
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Old 20-11-2016, 01:27   #72
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Re: And so it Begins: The Teak Deck Removal Project

Hi Guys,

I've just gone threw the same process on my Endurance 35 Ketch, removal of old teak, replacing some frames, applying marine plywood which will be fiberglassed over and painted, the teak was nailed down and chalked over....long job but good job satisfaction

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Old 20-11-2016, 02:47   #73
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Re: And so it Begins: The Teak Deck Removal Project

Never fun to see the boat all ripped up. I admire your sand(ing), for taking the job on. Seems it always takes more time than you think.
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Old 20-11-2016, 04:11   #74
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Re: And so it Begins: The Teak Deck Removal Project

I haven't sanded it yet, the guys in the yard will sand it before offering up the fiberglass
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Old 26-11-2016, 09:24   #75
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Re: And so it Begins: The Teak Deck Removal Project

Yes. That is the way. Can almost guarantee the screws are leaking and he will have some recoring. Just rip it all up, recore where needed and glass over. Major job.
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