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Old 28-01-2014, 16:24   #16
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Re: 10 yr old boat preventative maintenance

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I've looked at a few so far. Some honestly look about ready for the boneyard, it's astonishing how run down something can get in ten or twelve years.
Some, a very few, look new, a little wear on the sails etc., but the hull and interior look new. It's amazing how different ten year old boats can be.
Hence the difference between my previously mentioned barn and field finds... You'll know it when ya see her....
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Old 28-01-2014, 16:40   #17
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Re: 10 yr old boat preventative maintenance

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By real boat, I was trying the head off the naysayers that were going to tell me not to buy a production boat, that if I did the rudder would fall off first, followed shortly there after by the keel and we would sink and die in anything over three foot seas.
Viewing a 35' production boat as something other than a real boat is outright snobbery, and worrying about what boat-snob naysayers think is utter nonsense. Explaining that a 35' production boat is not the real boat to which you aspire is a sure way to alienate owners of production boats who might have been helpful about maintenance issues otherwise.
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Old 28-01-2014, 17:00   #18
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Re: 10 yr old boat preventative maintenance

a64pilot,

If you're over 40 disregard all those that tell you to learn on a small boat. Your knees will not be able to do it. No dinghies, no small boats at all. Buy the biggest boat you can afford, in good condition. Life is too short to work toward your "final" boat. If you are serious about cruising and your partner is on board with what you're going to do get your final boat now. One with good bones. You can always upgrade everything else. If there is doubt, charter or sail on OP boats. Or take a keel boat course somewhere.
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Old 28-01-2014, 17:01   #19
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Re: 10 yr old boat preventative maintenance

The above list is pretty good. Pumps usually go bad by 7-8+ years. (Water, macerator, washdown etc) Actually, many "appliances" like refrigeration, could be near the end by 10 years too. Many rudders are water filled at that point. Any stainless or aluminum tanks that are in the bilge are highly suspect at that point. Furling gear may be getting near it's end. If the boat has sat a lot, the propellor shaft may be corroded inside the stuffing box. If it's leaking more than a few drips assume it is. Good bronze tapered seacocks will last well beyound 10 years. Ballvalves, gate valves or other materials like plastic are due to be changed out.
Examples:
'85 boat bought in '92: Some new hoses, prop shaft, fresh water pump, faucets, toilets, new refrigeration, Seacocks disassembled and cleaned and lubricated. New Morse cables for shifting and fuel. New running rigging, new sails (for non offshore maybe not).
'85 boat bought in '97: Some new hoses, fresh water pump, toilets, new refrigeration, Seacocks disassembled and cleaned and lubricated. New running rigging, Extensive bottom job.
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Old 28-01-2014, 17:10   #20
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Re: 10 yr old boat preventative maintenance

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Furling gear may be getting near it's end.
I have a boat with a Harken furler (Harken 02) that's 26 years old and it works like a charm. Don't think the design has changed much since then. Maybe an open drum but that's about it. The bearings are fine, the swivel is fine and the foil is fine. Don't know how they can improve on it. Simple and effective.

Just flush the bearings with fresh water every so often.
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Old 28-01-2014, 17:11   #21
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Re: 10 yr old boat preventative maintenance

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a64pilot,

If you're over 40 disregard all those that tell you to learn on a small boat. Your knees will not be able to do it. No dinghies, no small boats at all. Buy the biggest boat you can afford, in good condition. Life is too short to work toward your "final" boat. If you are serious about cruising and your partner is on board with what you're going to do get your final boat now. One with good bones. You can always upgrade everything else. If there is doubt, charter or sail on OP boats. Or take a keel boat course somewhere.
The comments about getting a boat smaller than 35' was if he wants to learn to sail. If he just wants to cruise, he can certainly follow your advice. I don't recall anyone telling him he needed to learn on a dinghy.

Either you know what we're talking about, or you don't.

It was just advice, though. His reasoning makes sense for getting a larger boat.
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Old 28-01-2014, 17:13   #22
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Re: 10 yr old boat preventative maintenance

Short of drilling into a rudder how do you tell if it's water logged, coin tap test or ultrasound? Pumps I think are just regular maintenance, my little boat had three and usually I replaced one a year, impeller every other year. I'm new to heads, and think I may want to go to a fresh water flushing one, maybe. I think that would waste water of course, but reduce maintenance. Unless I'm stupid wouldn't it be possible to install a Y valve so you could use fresh water, but could also use salt if needed?
Actually I think I have found the boat I want, but want of course to look at several before I buy. It will be late Feb probably before I'm in a condition to pay cash, and I don't want to finance a boat
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Old 28-01-2014, 17:22   #23
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Re: 10 yr old boat preventative maintenance

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I have a boat with a Harken furler (Harken 02) that's 26 years old and it works like a charm. Don't think the design has changed much since then. Maybe an open drum but that's about it. The bearings are fine, the swivel is fine and the foil is fine. Don't know how they can improve on it. Simple and effective.

Just flush the bearings with fresh water every so often.
Yeah, alot of things COULD last a lot longer. But many dont. Kudos to Harken for using plastic bearings I guess!
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Old 28-01-2014, 17:22   #24
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Re: 10 yr old boat preventative maintenance

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Short of drilling into a rudder how do you tell if it's water logged, t
Have seen many boats with water logged rudders. In the great white north the folks drill a hole in them to drain them at haulout so they don't freeze but that's all they do. Is it a big problem?
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Old 28-01-2014, 17:25   #25
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Re: 10 yr old boat preventative maintenance

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a64pilot,



If you're over 40 disregard all those that tell you to learn on a small boat. Your knees will not be able to do it. No dinghies, no small boats at all. Buy the biggest boat you can afford, in good condition. Life is too short to work toward your "final" boat. If you are serious about cruising and your partner is on board with what you're going to do get your final boat now. One with good bones. You can always upgrade everything else. If there is doubt, charter or sail on OP boats. Or take a keel boat course somewhere.

Wife is not on board with what I want to do, but then at first flying used to terrify her, but very quickly she became comfortable with it. This first boat needs to be comfortable and have a nice interior. I think she will begin to like it if I take it slow, don't push things and give her nice comfortable surroundings she will come around. She is fine with buying this boat for us to use on weekends and the yearly vacation, but is not yet ready to commit to cruising full time, which I'm OK with, how could she, we haven't even tasted it yet? Plus to be honest I can't afford the boat I want to end up with now, not until I retire in five years. House and land is 100% paid for, I have military retirement and will have a decent 401K then.
Hey, surely I can rent a school boat until I get enough experience if needed right?
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Old 28-01-2014, 17:25   #26
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Re: 10 yr old boat preventative maintenance

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Originally Posted by a64pilot View Post
Short of drilling into a rudder how do you tell if it's water logged, coin tap test or ultrasound? Pumps I think are just regular maintenance, my little boat had three and usually I replaced one a year, impeller every other year. I'm new to heads, and think I may want to go to a fresh water flushing one, maybe. I think that would waste water of course, but reduce maintenance. Unless I'm stupid wouldn't it be possible to install a Y valve so you could use fresh water, but could also use salt if needed?
Actually I think I have found the boat I want, but want of course to look at several before I buy. It will be late Feb probably before I'm in a condition to pay cash, and I don't want to finance a boat
I usually start with tapping, if it rings dead, then "permission to drill" or just consider it wet and final offer accordingly. I have had 3 boats with very strong built rudders, no cracks or damage, they had totally wet rudder cores. My guess is water migrates in around the shaft over time.
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Old 28-01-2014, 17:37   #27
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Re: 10 yr old boat preventative maintenance

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Wife is not on board with what I want to do, but then at first flying used to terrify her, but very quickly she became comfortable with it. This first boat needs to be comfortable and have a nice interior. I think she will begin to like it if I take it slow, don't push things and give her nice comfortable surroundings she will come around. She is fine with buying this boat for us to use on weekends and the yearly vacation, but is not yet ready to commit to cruising full time, which I'm OK with, how could she, we haven't even tasted it yet? Plus to be honest I can't afford the boat I want to end up with now, not until I retire in five years. House and land is 100% paid for, I have military retirement and will have a decent 401K then.
Hey, surely I can rent a school boat until I get enough experience if needed right?
In that case buy the biggest and most comfortable you can afford now. She has to feel secure and a good looking boat down below helps. Heads, showers, pleasant saloon, good lighting and at the expense of being called sexist a good galley.
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Old 28-01-2014, 17:40   #28
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Re: 10 yr old boat preventative maintenance

"Short of drilling into a rudder how do you tell if it's water logged, coin tap test or ultrasound? "

You'd need a lot of skill, experience, and probably some telepathy to tell if there's any water inside a rudder without drilling a hole, which is unlikely to be allowed except as part of the "subject to survey and..." and set aside against escrow. A new rudder for a 35' boat, if it was available, could easily be a $4-5000 repair.

But if you can see any hairline fracture in the paint on the rudder, literally a hairline in the paint, that means it extends into the glass and water has gotten in. A rudder can also be wet inside for years, even another ten years, and still not fail. So, that's a hard one to call.

Ultrasound won't be available at a yard, and I suspect a thermal imaging camera (like the kind used to check home insulation) would do a really nice job if the rudder were allowed to sun-bake just enough. But you won't find one of those in the boatyard either, and I've never heard of a boat surveyor owning one. You probably can rent one for the day someplace, and I've heard prices have plummeted on them.

One thing that wasn't mentioned on the "worn out" list is the HEAD. Especially if you want a happy wife, you may want to have the head rebuilt (kits available, job not as bad as you might think) or more likely, replace the whole thing with a newer, bigger, plusher model. A lot of boat heads are pacifiers for small butts. Ditto the hoses that go to the waste tank, those always will become permeable over time and after ten years...just R&R the entire system before the wife has to spend a night on the boat. You might appreciate the upgrade as well. (G)
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Old 28-01-2014, 17:49   #29
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Re: 10 yr old boat preventative maintenance

OK give me an idea as to which head, are electric flush heads just gimmicks. or are they something she would like? Best place to buy a head?
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Old 28-01-2014, 18:46   #30
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Re: 10 yr old boat preventative maintenance

A 10 y.o. boat can be anything between mint and derelict.

You must look at that specific boat you want to buy:

- how it was used (charter? ignorant owner? caring and knowledgable owner? etc.),
- how it was stored off season (in water? in freezing water? in fresh water? dry? etc.),
- how much has been replaced / upgraded / fixed up by her old owner(s),
- etc.

Each one will be different and some will be very good buys sure.

Our boat is almost 35 y.o. by now. It is a mass production (ok - hand-made, mass production, exactly) one, and she has just made another crossing.

Good luck,
b.
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