Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 11-08-2017, 16:05   #1
Registered User
 
TheNomadTrip's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: On the boat...
Boat: Lagoon 380
Posts: 183
Thumbs down Volvo Penta MD2030 White Smoke, Knocking

It pains me just writing the title. Ugh.

I have a suspicion about what the issue is, but I'm hoping for a bit of input from others. Here's what I'm dealing with:

About a year ago (2400 hours) I noticed a small amount of white smoke (which I decided was water vapor) coming from one engine (i have two of the MD 2030's). I did many, many hours of research and then some troubleshooting and came to the conclusion that it wasn't the injectors (no fuel smell, no sheen, etc). A mechanic friend confirmed this.

I was worried about it being a head gasket, but, well, there was no other obvious signs of that potential issue. Basically I just ignored it as it seemed to be OK. Later a mechanic came and looked/listened and decided it was probably just sooty and needed to be run a little harder from time to time.


NOW:

(2800 hours) The white smoke (which I believe is vapor, though the exhaust smells like burnt oil) has become worse. And today, for the first time, I noticed an audible knocking sound. Not good.

There has been, from time to time, some consumption of coolant - but it is intermittent (or at least it seems that way) and when it started I was changing impellers and cleaning the heat exchanger so I assumed that I failed to tighten a hose clamp or some such foolish move.

Also there is a small amount of oil consumption. Very small. As in I top it up (less than a liter) every 50 hours. No water in the oil.

Recently, there has been intermittent overheating. I catch it before the alarm sounds, but I can see the temp increasing. After I bring the RPM's back down a hair, all is well and she cools down and runs fine.

Finally - I noticed this: there is a small amount of exhaust smoke that comes from the oil dipstick when I check the oil when the engine is running. Not sure what that means.



I'm in a remote area with limited tools (ie - testing compression is not possible, and I don't have other pressure testing kits, though with some kind of direction I can probably make one).

I do have a spare head gasket onboard, and I'm pretty handy.

Would really appreciate help on this one. Thanks in advance!
__________________

__________________
Planning a spearfishing/freediving/sailing circumnavigation. Find out more here: http://thenomadtrip.com/
TheNomadTrip is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2017, 17:08   #2
Senior Cruiser
 
DeepFrz's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Winnipeg
Boat: None at this time
Posts: 7,879
Re: Volvo Penta MD2030 White Smoke, Knocking

White smoke can be caused by faulty injectors, bad timing or low compression. Could also be water getting into the cylinder. It is usually unburned diesel fuel and if you hold your hand in front of the exhaust then smell your hand you may be able to smell diesel fuel.

It sounds like you have some blowby which is caused by ring damage or stuck/fouled rings. Remove the oil filler cap and see if you get a puff of air/exhaust out of it when the engine is running. You can best feel it with your hand.

Good luck.
__________________

__________________
The Blue Dot Campaign. This Changes Everything.
DeepFrz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2017, 18:44   #3
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: So Cal
Boat: Lancer 44 Motor Sailer
Posts: 409
Re: Volvo Penta MD2030 White Smoke, Knocking

Every thing DeepFrz said, also loosing antifreeze and maybe a quart of oil every 50 hours does not sound good. Sorry to say but it sounds like some repairs are in order. Have the injectors tested. Rent or buy a cheap Harbor Freight coolant pressure tester and pump up to 15 PSI and watch for leaks. If pressure goes down and no external leaks then pull head. Still might have worn or broken rings with a scored cylinder. Sorry to say it sounds like time for some serious engine work.
__________________
Diesel Bill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2017, 19:07   #4
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Caribbean Sea
Boat: Wildcat 35
Posts: 201
Re: Volvo Penta MD2030 White Smoke, Knocking

Before you pull the head, pull the exhaust manifold and check for leaks. Just a month ago our MD2030 with about 3000 hours sprung a leak. A good welder in Marsh Harbour fixed it for under 200.

You can read about the incident on our blog, It's the time we spent together that matters
__________________
DavidLGCrawford is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2017, 19:17   #5
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 581
Re: Volvo Penta MD2030 White Smoke, Knocking

See if you can isolate the problem to one cylinder by cracking the high pressure nut on the injector and note the change in engine rpm. If you can find the weak cylinder, then swap injectors and see if the problem follows the injector, or stays with the original cylinder. If the problem moves, it's likely you have a bad injector....if the problem doesn't move then the problem is in that cylinder.

Is there any chance of the engine having taken a drink of water?? 2030 con rods will bend if the engine takes a drink, and that can lead to lots of problems:
- low compression/ white smoke
- knocking
- cracked rings/ oil consumption
- possible head gasket leaks

DougR
__________________
DougR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2017, 22:35   #6
Registered User

Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Subic Bay Philippines
Posts: 537
Re: Volvo Penta MD2030 White Smoke, Knocking

White smoke occurs as a result of combustion temperature being so low that only partial combustion occurs and the partially burned fuel that exits the exhaust is in the form of a white vapory smoke. Technically, the white color is caused by the light-scattering characteristics of the re-condensed droplets of fuel (unburned or partially burned) larger than one micron.

Many factors contribute to this condition and it can be one or more of the following:

1. Poor fuel quality (low cetane rating).
2. Low inlet air temperature.
3. Low coolant temperature.
4. Low compression ratio.
5. Retarded (incorrect) ignition timing.
6. May also be caused by water(vapor) condensing when expelled from the exhaust. when idling at low temperature or just after startup this would be normal, when it persists at higher temperatures and under load a leak somewhere in the head gasket(s) is the most likely cause.
7. Incorrect/failed fuel injection components.
8. Water in the fuel
Check the fuel filter or filters for water and drain it before you start the engine. Keep your fuel tank topped off to 90% full. Replace the deck fuel-fill cap gasket every year and tighten down the cap. All of these measures will help prevent water penetration.

The knocking would indicate more of a problem with fuel dilution and or fuel injection pump timing/injectors

Cheers Steve
__________________
Captsteve53 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2017, 23:01   #7
Registered User

Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Subic Bay Philippines
Posts: 537
Re: Volvo Penta MD2030 White Smoke, Knocking

Forgot to add this:

Your intermittent over heating issue and there-fore loss of coolant could be caused by a defective thermostat and if sticking some times and not fully closing at other times will cause the engine to run to cold thus causing possible white smoke,

I would recommend a change of thermostat prior to other major works

Cheers Steve
__________________
Captsteve53 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2017, 08:31   #8
Registered User
 
TheNomadTrip's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: On the boat...
Boat: Lagoon 380
Posts: 183
Re: Volvo Penta MD2030 White Smoke, Knocking

Alrighty, first things first: thanks for the replies.

Onward.

Thermostat, just replaced it, not likely and requires a bit of work on these engines. Could be related to overheating but not to knocking and white smoke.

Injectors, etc - it's unlikely them as we pop tested them recently, there is no sheen on the water, the vapor smells like burnt oil. I've also cracked the injector nuts on each cylinder, nothing out of the ordinary.

Head gasket - this is what I'm convinced it is, but I'd love to hear arguments otherwise. Correct me if I'm wrong - knocking could be water in the cylinders, which could follow (white vapor, not fuel) and it would also explain the loss of coolant and occasional overheating.

Fuel - could be, but the other engine uses the same fuel, we put everything through a Baja filter and I've just cleaned and inspected both tanks. Also the filters are new in both engines. I'll do a little more probing on this but really, I doubt it.

Engine taking a drink? Possible but not likely. At least not while I owned it (but there were two previous owners).

Will check entire engine for other leaks,etc - but pressure test kits and compression test kits are not something I have access to right now, nor can I get them with ease. I'm very remote. I will certainly take advice on other options or thoughts about how I can rig a pressure testing for my coolant, etc.


Here are my questions:
  1. If there is a puff of smoke that comes from the oil fill cap (or dipstick) - is this a sign of a head gasket failure?
  2. I have a head gasket onboard and I'm fairly handy. What am I getting into here? On a scale of diesel engine maintenance from 1-10, where does this project rank?
  3. If it is a head gasket, are there other parts I should be replacing while I've got it all apart?
  4. For any of the more likely issues - how much damage will I do by running the engine, or how likely is running it going to cause damage?
  5. Tell me about worn/broken rings and/or a scored cylinder, what is repair procedure here?

Again, thanks.

-N
__________________
Planning a spearfishing/freediving/sailing circumnavigation. Find out more here: http://thenomadtrip.com/
TheNomadTrip is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2017, 08:38   #9
Registered User

Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 382
Re: Volvo Penta MD2030 White Smoke, Knocking

you bent a rod engines probably toast
__________________
bsurvey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2017, 08:45   #10
Senior Cruiser
 
DeepFrz's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Winnipeg
Boat: None at this time
Posts: 7,879
Re: Volvo Penta MD2030 White Smoke, Knocking

Do a search on "sailorchic34" and find her thread on rebuilding her engine. Has the answers for you. Blow by is not likely to be a head gasket failure, IMHO.
__________________
The Blue Dot Campaign. This Changes Everything.
DeepFrz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2017, 09:28   #11
Registered User
 
TheNomadTrip's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: On the boat...
Boat: Lagoon 380
Posts: 183
Re: Volvo Penta MD2030 White Smoke, Knocking

Alrighty, I'm in a very limited bandwidth environment so I can't search much. It took me 30 minutes just to load this page... If possible, can someone with some guidance answer the questions below.

Here are my questions:
  1. If there is a puff of smoke that comes from the oil fill cap (or dipstick) - is this a sign of a head gasket failure?
  2. I have a head gasket onboard and I'm fairly handy. What am I getting into here? On a scale of diesel engine maintenance from 1-10, where does this project rank?
  3. If it is a head gasket, are there other parts I should be replacing while I've got it all apart?
  4. For any of the more likely issues - how much damage will I do by running the engine, or how likely is running it going to cause damage?
  5. Tell me about worn/broken rings and/or a scored cylinder, what is repair procedure here?
__________________
Planning a spearfishing/freediving/sailing circumnavigation. Find out more here: http://thenomadtrip.com/
TheNomadTrip is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2017, 10:04   #12
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Slidell, La.
Boat: Morgan Classic 33
Posts: 1,055
Re: Volvo Penta MD2030 White Smoke, Knocking

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheNomadTrip View Post
Alrighty, I'm in a very limited bandwidth environment so I can't search much. It took me 30 minutes just to load this page... If possible, can someone with some guidance answer the questions below.

Here are my questions:
  1. If there is a puff of smoke that comes from the oil fill cap (or dipstick) - is this a sign of a head gasket failure?
  2. I have a head gasket onboard and I'm fairly handy. What am I getting into here? On a scale of diesel engine maintenance from 1-10, where does this project rank?
  3. If it is a head gasket, are there other parts I should be replacing while I've got it all apart?
  4. For any of the more likely issues - how much damage will I do by running the engine, or how likely is running it going to cause damage?
  5. Tell me about worn/broken rings and/or a scored cylinder, what is repair procedure here?
1. Could be, but would seem more indicative of a piston ring issue or, more remotely, a valve seat/valve guide problem.

2. 6

3. That all depends on the condition of the other parts (head, valvetrain, heat exchanger, exhaust elbow, water pumps; anything associated with the top end of the engine) what is available to you and how far you want to go with it.... At the very least you should lap the valves and decarbonize the combustion chamber area and piston tops.

4. Without knowing the real cause of the problem any answer here is pure speculation...from your description it doesn't sound like an issue I'd let go much further.

5. Pull the engine, measure the bore, repair as necessary, from honing to boring oversize and fitting new pistons and rings. If you go that far you might as well do a more complete overhaul with bearings, seals and all the other things that go with it...


In addition to all the suggestions made previously, have you checked your valve clearances?

There could also be a problem with the fuel injection pump.

Also, in case you didn't know, this engine is a re-branded Perkins, originally made by a Japanese firm, ISM, and is fairly ubiquitous worldwide in small agricultural and refrigeration equipment. You should be able to find parts at significantly lower prices than from Volvo, if that is important to you...
__________________
jimbunyard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2017, 10:29   #13
Registered User
 
Cadence's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: SC
Boat: None,build the one shown of glass, had many from 6' to 48'.
Posts: 5,879
Re: Volvo Penta MD2030 White Smoke, Knocking

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheNomadTrip View Post
Alrighty, first things first: thanks for the replies.

Onward.

Thermostat, just replaced it, not likely and requires a bit of work on these engines. Could be related to overheating but not to knocking and white smoke.

Injectors, etc - it's unlikely them as we pop tested them recently, there is no sheen on the water, the vapor smells like burnt oil. I've also cracked the injector nuts on each cylinder, nothing out of the ordinary.

Head gasket - this is what I'm convinced it is, but I'd love to hear arguments otherwise. Correct me if I'm wrong - knocking could be water in the cylinders, which could follow (white vapor, not fuel) and it would also explain the loss of coolant and occasional overheating.

Fuel - could be, but the other engine uses the same fuel, we put everything through a Baja filter and I've just cleaned and inspected both tanks. Also the filters are new in both engines. I'll do a little more probing on this but really, I doubt it.

Engine taking a drink? Possible but not likely. At least not while I owned it (but there were two previous owners).

Will check entire engine for other leaks,etc - but pressure test kits and compression test kits are not something I have access to right now, nor can I get them with ease. I'm very remote. I will certainly take advice on other options or thoughts about how I can rig a pressure testing for my coolant, etc.


Here are my questions:
  1. If there is a puff of smoke that comes from the oil fill cap (or dipstick) - is this a sign of a head gasket failure?
  2. I have a head gasket onboard and I'm fairly handy. What am I getting into here? On a scale of diesel engine maintenance from 1-10, where does this project rank?
  3. If it is a head gasket, are there other parts I should be replacing while I've got it all apart?
  4. For any of the more likely issues - how much damage will I do by running the engine, or how likely is running it going to cause damage?
  5. Tell me about worn/broken rings and/or a scored cylinder, what is repair procedure here?

Again, thanks.

-N
I've kept my oar out of the water. I believe you are correct with a head gasket problem as far as white smoke? Oil consumption may be totally another issue.
__________________
Cadence is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2017, 11:42   #14
Registered User
 
TheNomadTrip's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: On the boat...
Boat: Lagoon 380
Posts: 183
Re: Volvo Penta MD2030 White Smoke, Knocking

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimbunyard View Post
1. Could be, but would seem more indicative of a piston ring issue or, more remotely, a valve seat/valve guide problem.

2. 6

3. That all depends on the condition of the other parts (head, valvetrain, heat exchanger, exhaust elbow, water pumps; anything associated with the top end of the engine) what is available to you and how far you want to go with it.... At the very least you should lap the valves and decarbonize the combustion chamber area and piston tops.

4. Without knowing the real cause of the problem any answer here is pure speculation...from your description it doesn't sound like an issue I'd let go much further.

5. Pull the engine, measure the bore, repair as necessary, from honing to boring oversize and fitting new pistons and rings. If you go that far you might as well do a more complete overhaul with bearings, seals and all the other things that go with it...


In addition to all the suggestions made previously, have you checked your valve clearances?

There could also be a problem with the fuel injection pump.

Also, in case you didn't know, this engine is a re-branded Perkins, originally made by a Japanese firm, ISM, and is fairly ubiquitous worldwide in small agricultural and refrigeration equipment. You should be able to find parts at significantly lower prices than from Volvo, if that is important to you...

Huge thanks here! I did know about it being a Perkins, and the price difference is most certainly important to me.

Moving on, I did one small troubleshooting test and I think it will help here.

There is exhaust coming from the oil fill cap

Knowing this, what should I look for now? I've looked through all of the literature I have and it simply tells me to seek professional help (which is definitely not available here).

In the interest of focusing, is there a list of troubleshooting steps that I can do to eliminate some of the possibilities and narrow things down?

Thanks again!

-N
__________________
Planning a spearfishing/freediving/sailing circumnavigation. Find out more here: http://thenomadtrip.com/
TheNomadTrip is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2017, 15:38   #15
Certifiable Refitter/Senior Wannbe
 
Wotname's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: South of 43 S, Australia
Boat: Van DeStat Super Dogger 31'
Posts: 7,222
Re: Volvo Penta MD2030 White Smoke, Knocking

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheNomadTrip View Post
...
There is exhaust coming from the oil fill cap

Knowing this, what should I look for now? I....
Rings or valves.
__________________

__________________
All men dream: but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds wake in the day to find it was vanity: but the dreamers of the day are dangereous men, for they may act their dreams with open eyes, to make it possible. T.E. Lawrence
Wotname is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
md2030, penta, volvo

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Smoke, Smoke, Smoke that Cigarette ! bangkaboat Health, Safety & Related Gear 149 20-06-2013 22:41
Volvo MD2030 White Smoke Rumble Engines and Propulsion Systems 10 31-10-2009 22:03
Yanmar issues... white smoke and black oily soot (exhaust) and engine smoke CS27 Engines and Propulsion Systems 3 14-09-2008 17:40



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 06:14.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.