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Old 17-01-2012, 11:05   #76
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Re: Urgent - Raw Water Pump Not Working!

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Originally Posted by Seaduction View Post
Not a problem because the garden hose stream only got to the impeller and couldn't flow beyond that point, but it did prime the pump. My line does have a high spot in it that can air-lock. Its new hose but it is extra long in case I have to cut a bit off the end where its clamped onto the water pump">raw water pump.
1st in answer to the "vapor lock question: Can't happen in my system. The pump is 3" above the water line so with the seacock open water is about 3" away. (You can figure out the exact volume (1" hose, 3" length" ((Pi*R^2)*3) = (Pi/4)*3=2.355sqin.) So less than 3sqin (I don't know how many oz that is) of water needs to be moved until there is water in the pump. And this will happeneverytime you turn the engine off.

2nd: I should have fixed this yesterday, I had that hose off I just needed to blow into it.

3rd: The best strainer in the world would not have prevented this, it needs a filter. The grain of the mud that was clogging the line was so fine it passed right through the strainer as if it weren't there. Usually the amount of this fine mud goes right through the system but when that boat swamped me he kicked up a large amount of mud. That mud clogged the HE and my HVAC system. A filter on this line would be clogged every other day, but in normal use the mud just passes through.

Boy, after incident knowledge is great. Next time I'll just blow the lines (both ways) first thing and worry about the impeller next.
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Old 17-01-2012, 11:34   #77
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Re: Urgent - Raw Water Pump Not Working!

Yeah, it can be frustrating. More so if you dont go one step at a time. A 2 hour job became a 2 day one! Live and learn.
Ie:
* water to the strainer?
* water to the pump?
*Water out of the pump?
etc , etc... where the water stops is the problem. Diagnose it in "series" not in "Parallel"!easy to miss things if you dont.
Have a good trip! I wonder if you sucked stuff up aground at the dock and were lucky to get as far as you did?
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Old 17-01-2012, 12:17   #78
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Re: Urgent - Raw Water Pump Not Working!

You may want to explore the heat exchanger a little more. It should not clog up due to fine mud being run through it. You may be in need of having the heat exchanger core cleaned out. Automotive radiator shops can do this for you. They run an acid soloutin through the "tube stack" to clean out build up of salts inside the tubes.
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Old 17-01-2012, 12:24   #79
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Re: Urgent - Raw Water Pump Not Working!

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You may want to explore the heat exchanger a little more. It should not clog up due to fine mud being run through it. You may be in need of having the heat exchanger core cleaned out. Automotive radiator shops can do this for you. They run an acid soloutin through the "tube stack" to clean out build up of salts inside the tubes.
+1

I would also suggest that while you are at it, remove the injection elbow and check for clogs there.

I'm glad you got it going. Happy cruising.
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Old 17-01-2012, 13:25   #80
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Re: Urgent - Raw Water Pump Not Working!

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Originally Posted by DeepFrz View Post
+1

I would also suggest that while you are at it, remove the injection elbow and check for clogs there.

I'm glad you got it going. Happy cruising.
I'm with you on the exhaust elbow. A mostly clogged injection port could easily become clogged with silt. It is quite difficult to clog a heat exchanger with silt.

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Old 17-01-2012, 15:19   #81
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Re: Urgent - Raw Water Pump Not Working!

Mud?
That must have been onehellofa wave. The cruisers props must have been chopping up the bottom.
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Old 17-01-2012, 16:07   #82
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Congrats Don!

I read the post about blowing through the hose and getting bubbles as bubbles out of the boat.

A rubber vane pump cant build up mush pressure at all.

Hope the rest of the trip is uneventful. You deserve some easy cruising days...
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Old 17-01-2012, 16:20   #83
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Re: Urgent - Raw Water Pump Not Working!

Other than the frustration for Don, this was a great thread! It forced me to mentally consider the steps of diagnosis as suggested. This is CF at its finest!

Great job everyone,
Bill

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Old 17-01-2012, 18:10   #84
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Re: Urgent - Raw Water Pump Not Working!

Thanks to all and good night!
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Old 17-01-2012, 19:27   #85
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Re: Urgent - Raw Water Pump Not Working!

Don,
I'm glad you fixed it. I would not have guessed a bit of mud could clog a heat exchanger!
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Old 17-01-2012, 20:28   #86
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Re: URGENT, Raw water pump not working!

Quote:
Originally Posted by delmarrey View Post
Rubber impeller pumps don't need a prime. The only other thing could be is it's plugged up, up steam from the pump. Have you inspected the core of the heat exchanger?

Is the pump turning? Try disconnecting the outlet hose of the pump and crank the motor.

beg to differ on this one. They shouldn't need prime and usually don't. I have had mine vapor lock. It might be an issue of the total line full of air etc. I have also had the ity-bity woodruf key fall out or shear so the impeller didn't turn.

Also, do you have a glycol (freshwater) heat exchanger? You might have shoved gunk into the tubes and plugged it. I keep 18 inch soft mohair brushes for cleaning the tubes. Primary tube pass entry usually plugs first. Perhaps the big guy stirred up a load of bottom sludge. While you are at it, check your mixing ell as well. How about the thermostat?

Photo ref: engine left; main strainer lower left; Genset upper right; two strainers on sea water header central. Dual engine Racors left upper and singel racor for the gennset.

Glad to hear you found the sludge!
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Old 17-01-2012, 20:53   #87
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Re: URGENT, Raw water pump not working!

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Originally Posted by Nicholson58 View Post
beg to differ on this one. They shouldn't need prime and usually don't. I have had mine vapor lock. It might be an issue of the total line full of air etc. I have also had the ity-bity woodruf key fall out or shear so the impeller didn't turn.

Also, do you have a glycol (freshwater) heat exchanger? You might have shoved gunk into the tubes and plugged it. I keep 18 inch soft mohair brushes for cleaning the tubes. Primary tube pass entry usually plugs first. Perhaps the big guy stirred up a load of bottom sludge. While you are at it, check your mixing ell as well. How about the thermostat?
Quote:
Raw Water Cooling Pumps
A raw water cooling pump must self-prime reliably at a wide range of engine speeds, tolerating sandy or silty water without loss of flow, and without needing frequent maintenance. JABSCO flexible impeller pumps do the job, often for years at a time, with little maintenance. This is why JABSCO pumps are fitted as standard by marine engine manufacturers worldwide.

Welcome to JabscoShop - Jabsco & Rule Pumps and more - from the experts
These are not my words but those of the manufacturers!

Quote:
Self-priming Flexible Impeller Pumps are ideal for inboard engine cooling systems. Johnson Pump engine cooling pumps are available in a variety of mounting styles and sizes. SPX, Johnson Pump brand, is the original equipment pump supplier to the largest manufacturers world-wide of inboard engines. Our FB-9 model series are specially tailor made to engine manufacturers' specifications regarding design and performance.

SPX Johnson Pump for Boatbuilders, Pleasure, Commercial & Fishing boats

Quote:
Flexible impeller pumps provide an efficient solution to most raw water pumping needs. The pumps are self-priming and can pass fairly large solids without clogging or damaging the pumps.
Quote:
Jabsco Pedestal pump for engine cooling, washdown, circulation and other general purposes. Corrosion resistant bronze. Stainless steel shaft. Permanently lubricated ball bearings. Engine Cooling with neoprene impeller, full cam and lip seal.
Ports: 1" NPT Internal
26 gpm (98 lpm) at 10ft (3m) total head at 1750 rpm.
Self-priming to 10ft (3m) vertical lift.
Lip seal or mechanical face seal.
Double-row ball bearing.
Takes Jabsco impeller # 179370001
Fits many applications.
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Old 18-01-2012, 09:20   #88
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Re: Urgent - Raw Water Pump Not Working!

Maybe I missed it but nobody runs their raw water through a filter?
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Old 18-01-2012, 09:36   #89
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Re: Urgent - Raw Water Pump Not Working!

In order for a pump that requires a prim to act reliably without someone priming it, it would have to be below the waterline of the boat. This would assure that there is always water in the pump so it would not need a prime everytime you started the engine. A prime means that there is water in the pump to draw water from the source. A pump that does not need a prime builds up enough suction to draw the water into it's housing. On my system the pump entrance is about 3" above the waterline, this means the hose is full of water up to that point and the pump doesn't need that much suction to get the water going. Once the water starts the pump has no problem keeping it going. They are very acceptable to silt and mud but sometimes they will be overpowered by a large blast of mud. Aside from just the errant sports fisher throwing up a huge wake in a confined area, I wouldn't follow too closely to a large ,ship in a harbor channel either.
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Old 18-01-2012, 14:24   #90
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Re: Urgent - Raw Water Pump Not Working!



I guess if you have the $1,600,000.00 to buy this sportfisherman and you're in a hurry, you can't slow down for some peon in a dinky little old sailboat. I got swamped last year in Adams Creek on the icw by a big yellow hull one of these. He was talking on his cell phone as he wooshed by about 30 feet away.
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