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Old 06-02-2013, 06:55   #16
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Re: Stuck Rings...Help!

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Originally Posted by forsailbyowner View Post
When doing the compression test, if its rings putting a small squirt of oil into the cylinder should raise compression dramatically. Its vital to spin an engine over if not start, every 30 days. Seems like lately I've been running into a rash of people who have let their engines sit too long, as well as a project boat that sat too long before I got it. A cylinder with open exhaust valve while sitting is exposed to salt air from the exhaust. Invariably that cylinder will rust along with the valve stem, seat and face. Basically the whole cylinder needs a rebuild.
That is what I am afraid of...not looking forward to phase if it comes to that.
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Old 06-02-2013, 07:02   #17
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Re: Stuck Rings...Help!

Quote:
Originally Posted by forsailbyowner View Post
When doing the compression test, if its rings putting a small squirt of oil into the cylinder should raise compression dramatically. Its vital to spin an engine over if not start, every 30 days. Seems like lately I've been running into a rash of people who have let their engines sit too long, as well as a project boat that sat too long before I got it. A cylinder with open exhaust valve while sitting is exposed to salt air from the exhaust. Invariably that cylinder will rust along with the valve stem, seat and face. Basically the whole cylinder needs a rebuild.
Hmm.. not sure about this being vital but I accept that it is a good practice.

However I am another one who doesn't worry about leaving the engine to its own devices for 3 or 6 months; even 12+ months on occasions. I do maintain the external bits every year and more if required and so far every diesel I have owned (4) has always started immediately and mostly ran well.

Probably be banned from the CF engineers guild now....
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Old 06-02-2013, 07:33   #18
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Re: Stuck Rings...Help!

For what it's worth - iodine is what we use to free stuck, rusted rings. I put it in a squirt bottle and spray into cylinders via glow plug or injector port. This is used when an engine is frozen and cant be turned over - may not do you any good. What you are looking for is something that penetrates and iodine is one of the best.
Good luck!
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Old 06-02-2013, 08:11   #19
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Re: Stuck Rings...Help!

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For what it's worth - iodine is what we use to free stuck, rusted rings. I put it in a squirt bottle and spray into cylinders via glow plug or injector port. This is used when an engine is frozen and cant be turned over - may not do you any good. What you are looking for is something that penetrates and iodine is one of the best.
Good luck!
How long do you let it sit before you try to turn over the engine?
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Old 06-02-2013, 08:28   #20
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Re: Stuck Rings...Help!

Could an engine with only 95 hours on it, that started and ran fine one year ago, really have carboned-up rings stuck?
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Old 06-02-2013, 10:13   #21
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Re: Stuck Rings...Help!

Ihope you are not going down a serious sidestreet with this compression/ring worry. are you positive yuo've cranked it enough to fully bleed the fuel system? Also, the solenoid for shut down is operating properly?
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Old 06-02-2013, 10:41   #22
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Re: Stuck Rings...Help!

My bet is on fuel trouble. Test each injector by pulling from engine, connecting to it's fuel line, put piece of carton in front of it and crank engine.
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Old 06-02-2013, 10:48   #23
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Re: Stuck Rings...Help!

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Ihope you are not going down a serious sidestreet with this compression/ring worry. are you positive yuo've cranked it enough to fully bleed the fuel system? Also, the solenoid for shut down is operating properly?

Couldn't agree more.... I don't mind being wrong... I thought I was once...
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Old 06-02-2013, 10:52   #24
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Re: Stuck Rings...Help!

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My bet is on fuel trouble. Test each injector by pulling from engine, connecting to it's fuel line, put piece of carton in front of it and crank engine.

Bingo....

And I quote "You say that you had the fuel components tested, but have you verified that they all work together??? Crack the fittings at the injectors while you are cranking..." - HappyMdRSailor
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Old 06-02-2013, 11:20   #25
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Re: Stuck Rings...Help!

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Could an engine with only 95 hours on it, that started and ran fine one year ago, really have carboned-up rings stuck?

Let's look at the worst case ....

OP stated genset was run for 30 seconds...

30 seconds = 2 x per minute x 60 minutes per hour = 120 x 96 hrs =11,520 starts and stops....

*rubs chin*... Possible I suppose...

But I don't think so...

Ring SCHMING... This is a fuel delivery problem, OR... 1 or more of the valves are stuck in their guides... just off the seats
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Old 06-02-2013, 18:08   #26
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Re: Stuck Rings...Help!

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Originally Posted by HappyMdRSailor View Post
Let's look at the worst case ....

OP stated genset was run for 30 seconds...

30 seconds = 2 x per minute x 60 minutes per hour = 120 x 96 hrs =11,520 starts and stops....

*rubs chin*... Possible I suppose...

But I don't think so...

Ring SCHMING... This is a fuel delivery problem, OR... 1 or more of the valves are stuck in their guides... just off the seats
The genset was run once for about 30 sec and then shut down because the water was shut off.

I am thinking that the short start was just enough to wipe the varnish off of the cylinder wall and hang up the rings (or the valves are stuck in the guides). I bought a compression tester today and will try to post a compression result for everyone to look at.

Today, I poured more marvel mystery oil in the cylinder and replaced the glow plug. I hand cranked the engine until I got to the compression stroke and the kept pressure on the cylinder until the fluid had passed the rings. Tomorrow, I will see if it improved and then have numbers to post.
Thanks for the help
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Old 06-02-2013, 18:30   #27
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Re: Stuck Rings...Help!

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Hmm.. not sure about this being vital but I accept that it is a good practice.

However I am another one who doesn't worry about leaving the engine to its own devices for 3 or 6 months; even 12+ months on occasions. I do maintain the external bits every year and more if required and so far every diesel I have owned (4) has always started immediately and mostly ran well.

Probably be banned from the CF engineers guild now....
It does state the importance of this in my engine manual. Not something I made up or heard second hand. just seen 1st hand the results of what can happen. Now that you posted this you know you've jinxed yourself. Knock on wood?

PS did you try silicone spray as starter fluid? With no start tried wd40=no fire, silicone spray fired immediately. I had gone thru a lot of crap before I tried it and sure can attest to its effectiveness.
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Old 06-02-2013, 19:07   #28
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Re: Stuck Rings...Help!

Before you use silicone spray read the MSDS.
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Old 06-02-2013, 20:30   #29
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Re: Stuck Rings...Help!

I was taught over 60 yrs ago to start the main Engine, and the Genny or gennys, at least once a week! and let them run till operating Temps are reached! Ive done this ever since then. And I really believe that that and early oil changes are the reason my diesels have run as many hours as they have ! My last perkins 4-108 ran over 11000 hours with normal care ! The last I heard it was still running last year and not smoking !! So I think the starting every week is way worth the fuel needed to do it !! Just my 2 cents
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Old 07-02-2013, 06:37   #30
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Re: Stuck Rings...Help!

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How long do you let it sit before you try to turn over the engine?
The answer is............as long as it takes!
The iodine treatment has been used for years to free up rusted engine blocks. Used by antique car collectors, I recon. I first saw this done in a machine shop when I was a kid back in the 60's.
I doubt this is your problem though - let's hope not - probably air in the fuel.
If your engine started under starter fluid and died, then you have a fuel problem.
You can check compression by simply putting your thumb over the glow plug or injector port while cranking the engine. If there is enough compression to blow your thumb off the hole - there's enough to make it run.
Have fun!
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