Replacing Dual Lever Control with Single Lever Control ?

[Seahunter]

Originally Posted by delmarrey

That was the idea in building a single lever.
Man was not put on the moon and successfully retrieved without technology, which many sailboat people still condemn as being something that "if it hasn't failed it will" which is a fallacy flying in the face of successful facts.
By repeating such defeatist anti-technology drivel such people are merely ensconcing themselves in caves amidst a world of wonderful opportunity. Don't deny others with such defeatism who might otherwise benefit from the bigger picture.

Sheesh, I don't think this is a matter of "technological" advancement more than being a matter of personal choice. Single lever controls and gas pedals were employed on boats before cars and before man being on the moon. This is just another tiller-wheel argument gone awry. Personally, I see spending the same amount of money for the cost of switching from dual to single better suited on say; a bow thruster? I'm truly sorry for your feelings of being defeated, but it's all just a matter of opinion in the end.

[barnakiel]

Why a single lever should break more easily than a double one is sort of beyond me.

If it is so likely to break why have I never seen a broken one yet?

?
b.

[delmarrey]

And my wife wonders why I spend so much time in front of the computer rather then watch TV with her. It's so entertaining here, I can't wait until the next post email.

[Shoalcove]

My single lever works just fine as well. Mine is mounted in the side of the cockpit well and seems no less convenient than reaching through wheel spokes.

[zeehag]

Originally Posted by barnakiel

Why a single lever should break more easily than a double one is sort of beyond me.

If it is so likely to break why have I never seen a broken one yet?

?
b.

barnie--ye havent been to my boat yet.... the pin gets stuck and is difficult to push and pull.....i want 2 levers not just to ease confusion but to also facilitate my ability to use them-- hard to push and pull means i dont use boat enough as a result.....and the less i use boat, the more difficult they get as a result--- ouch--- vicious circle--want dual controls....easiest boat i had was ericson 35 with duals....on top of binnacle.
gods only make so much spray lube.......

[sailingharry]

The thread is a few weeks old, but very much of interest to me.

First, why I don't like my dual controls. They are a disaster waiting to happen. Ahead is down, astern is up -- we had a collision in a club raftup a few weeks back when the helmsman got confused. I've come close a few times. Also, it is not "positive." I almost hit a dock a couple weeks ago, when I put it reverse and rev'ed the engine. When I realized I wasn't backing, I looked down and saw I was in neutral! Single lever is simple and unambiguous. Unless you have the pin out, forward is forward, up is neutral, and back is reverse. That said, I'm open to why single levers, especially in Edson's crazy arrangement, are better?

Now for the swap. I agree 100% that Edson's "G-note" conversion is out of the question for my 30 year old boat. Has anyone done a DIY job? I could see a standard Morse side-mount unit grafted onto the side of the pedestal, or perhaps start off with a standard outboard motor control box (they are universally used on outboards!) and begin re-engineering. I wouldn't consider doing it if it couldn't be done well (both reliable and attractive), and I haven't picked up the first control unit to see what it takes, but it seems that it should be possible to do a decent job for WAAAY less than Edson's ransom.

Any thoughts?

Harry

[roverhi]

Dammit, quit talking and somebody switch over to single handle controls!!!!! I want your Morse dual removable handle controls. Will pay good money for a set in good complete condition.

[Cheechako]

Originally Posted by sailingharry

The thread is a few weeks old, but very much of interest to me.

First, why I don't like my dual controls. They are a disaster waiting to happen. Ahead is down, astern is up -- we had a collision in a club raftup a few weeks back when the helmsman got confused. I've come close a few times. Also, it is not "positive." I almost hit a dock a couple weeks ago, when I put it reverse and rev'ed the engine. When I realized I wasn't backing, I looked down and saw I was in neutral! Single lever is simple and unambiguous. Unless you have the pin out, forward is forward, up is neutral, and back is reverse. That said, I'm open to why single levers, especially in Edson's crazy arrangement, are better?

Now for the swap. I agree 100% that Edson's "G-note" conversion is out of the question for my 30 year old boat. Has anyone done a DIY job? I could see a standard Morse side-mount unit grafted onto the side of the pedestal, or perhaps start off with a standard outboard motor control box (they are universally used on outboards!) and begin re-engineering. I wouldn't consider doing it if it couldn't be done well (both reliable and attractive), and I haven't picked up the first control unit to see what it takes, but it seems that it should be possible to do a decent job for WAAAY less than Edson's ransom.

Any thoughts?

Harry

Sounds like your installation is wonky. All my pedestal controls have been fwd=fwd and faster=fwd. Got no problem with single lever though, although it will be a bit of a unsightly mess on the pedestal I suppose. Or willyou put it inconvieniently on the cockpit wall?

[zeehag]

hate single lever controls..please bring any used and unwanted doubles here to mazatlan and i will exchange with ye....... did i say please?????

[sailingharry]

Originally Posted by Cheechako

Sounds like your installation is wonky. All my pedestal controls have been fwd=fwd and faster=fwd. Got no problem with single lever though, although it will be a bit of a unsightly mess on the pedestal I suppose. Or willyou put it inconvieniently on the cockpit wall?

I absolutely will NOT put it on the cockpit wall! That would be an easy and clean installation, but a pain to use.

With regard to the current installation. It may be an older arrangement, but it is (or perhaps WAS) a rather common and standard Edson arrangement. The throttle is fairly easy, with a crosswise axle and the lever on the starboard side of the binnacle, with "Idle" pointing dead aft, and full throttle being up to vertical or slightly forward of vertical. That's fairly easy. The shift is MUCH less logical. The "axle" runs forward and aft, and the shift lever is on the aft edge of the binnacle and sticks out to port. Horizontal is neutral, up is reverse, and down is forward. During checkout on a charter boat, I learned a trick to think "back UP" which makes it fairly easy to remember -- if you stop to think. But more than once I've pushed down and hit the throttle in an attempt to stop my forward motion -- not good! And at least once, I've pulled the shift lever from down (forward) up to horizontal (neutral) rather than all the way up to reverse and hit the throttle, which while better than putting it in forward, has zero effect on slowing the boat down!

The baffling thing on this thread is the opinions of some that dual lever is better. I've never seen a single lever break, and I can't figure out why dual is better. To go from forward to reverse on my current arrangment, I take both hands off the wheel, use one to starboard to slow the throttle down, one to port to change gears, and then one to starboard to throttle up again. What a pain! I'm sure the differing opinions are well-founded, but I certainly don't see it.

Harry

[jkleins]

I am also wondering what people feel is better on the dual then the single. I have had boats with both type and I couldn't really name any advantage of the dual over the single. I can see someone not caring as they are both fairly easy to figure out but from the usability side what is it that those of you who like the dual find "easier/better" on the dual then the single?

Is there something you can do with the dual that you can't with the single or is it just reliability/installation/cost type concerns that you feel are an advantage?

Jim

[Cheechako]

I liked the single control. I feel a slight bit more in control with two levers but may just be me. (going to reverse in a panic situation I had a tendency to go too far at first) But the single is a nice device.... just not sure on a pedestal. Where there's a will there's a way to make an elegant installtion...

[sailingharry]

Thinking out loud, I could see a nice teak block shaped to the pedestal, and then something like these:
Uflex USA - leader in steering and control systems for boats
mounted on the block. Assuming it can be made to all go together, I'm not sure it would be at all awkward or clunky. The reason I chimed in is that it should be easy and "inexpensive" (in boat terms), and so I should hear lots of "yea's" -- but the silence is kind of scary!

The Uflex B-85 is a reputable control, apparently provided standard on the J/145, and is available for under $200

Harry

[Cheechako]

Or a nice formed piece of aluminum to fit the pedestal... Where will the cables go? Back thru holes drilled in the pedestal?

[delmarrey]

You could make something similar to Edson's design or actually buy the Edson set up at a premium. The cables go down thru the deck.

Edson Single Lever Engine Controls


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